Hello and welcome to this week's edition of Free Your Mind. Let's talk about it with LKJ. Now, I don't know if it's, um, the pandemic. I don't know if it's something that I've actually shut my eyes off to. I'm not quite sure what alerted me to, um, Start noticing how people eat at a table, how they always say the fast food community taking away our manners. I did, and I was asked for People's Friend earlier this year to state what the importance was of eating at a table. Did I find this was in there? So if people like to look at People's Friend for the article they will be able to see that my response, which I shall be reading out to the viewers on it. But in my quest for doing so, you know, searching on the— like we have nannies for our children, is there anywhere that you can go? Can somebody teach you this? Is there anybody, you know, when we go and we've got to, um, put a really— your husband's got a really important dinner. I think, darling, we don't go there. He's got this really ladies high-flying job, something completely different. Decided to step out the box and do it out of your comfort zone and think, I can't do it. Is there somebody that can help? How do you— a bit like the Pretty Woman film. How do I do this? When you see her talking with the gentleman, the manager, in that, but it opened it up. So it opened my mind up to say, when we free our mind, wanting to go out, is the highest society that is dining in the first class of a yacht to steerage? What separates us? So it sent me on a quest, and fortunately I found a lovely lady, and who I have actually sat and Daju on a few occasions, both in an informal and a formal manner. And it was through that I actually got to find out what she did, what was her job, what she— everybody knows I'm quite inquisitive and very open and free in that side. So I do absolutely have the pleasure of introducing to this show, Free Your Mind, about etiquette and manners. Something you probably thought, actually, when you hear this show, is this how it's done? Is that that we've forgotten? If you agree, disagree, you know, join in, join in the remarks and feed them, you know, with it on www.womensradiostation.com. And onto Facebook and all the other channels that come on there. But I am challenging you in this interview to look back at yourselves. You may believe in it, you may not, but I would like to hear your opinions. The radio station, you know, everybody has a right to have it or not to be told. But I would like you to listen, engage, and let us know. I know Laura's very, very well sought after. Even, you know, recently she's dined on the Sunborn yacht where people didn't realize so much that, you know, for her children that they want her to do that because as they get older they would know different things, or if they went to restaurants that they're not really uncomfortable about, that children don't Some children aren't going so much with the fast food industry. So on that note, let me introduce you to Laura O'Carlow. She is the founder and principal coach at Polished Manners, an etiquette and social skills training company. She has successfully taught children, teenagers, and adults through her etiquette classes and afternoon tea events. She has been featured in television and radio programs as well as features in newspaper magazine articles. Laura has worked with high net worth and families and visitors, uh, from other countries. She is passionate to empower youth and women with the life skills that etiquette training gives. She believes that understanding the rules of etiquette as it relates to different countries and cultures not only improves relationships but also improves civility within our societies. It is her belief that etiquette and social skill training empowers an individual to live a positive life and enhances professional and business success. Laura teaches in a fun, practical, modern, and relevant way that can be applied to everyday life. Laura gained her etiquette certifications having completed training with 3 schools based in England and the USA. She is a married mother of two. In addition to her qualifications, Laura brings a wealth of life experiences that complement her etiquette classes for children and adults. Her mission to make etiquette training more accessible and affordable for preserve— for just not just for preserve— for just the rich and famous So to bring it for people in everyday life, just to help bring back the forgotten manners that we use at the table, perhaps. So on that note, are we all ready, listeners, to bring her in? Laura, are you there? Yes, I am. Good evening. Thank you very much for inviting me, and thank you for that lovely introduction. It's absolutely our pleasure. And may I just say thank you for the wonderful grace and honour at My Fair Lady afternoon tea with Lady Kendall-Jagger on the Sunborne yacht, where we did engage in afternoon tea, and your support that by doing so gave to 3 charities: to the MAD Foundation, also gave to the Laszlo Foundation, and the Service for a Reason Foundation. And for that, I thank you for your donation. And I hope you enjoyed the Fortnum Mason afternoon tea set and all the flowers from Ziggy's Flowers in Dover and everything else that we brought together that gave us a lovely afternoon tea. But one I must admit, as I looked around the yacht, you know, we were looking around again, I was chatting to you and saying different things, you know, people, some people look very frightened as we looked around the yacht, engaging into afternoon tea, waiting for the service. And one thing I will say, and I have to say on this radio station, that I have contacted the Sunborn Yacht. Although I love the setting, I love everything about that, And I think the price and what you get was a little poor. You know, when you're trying to do something of high cost, I know with the wastage of people going, "I've got to lower the price, but don't lower the amount that's on there," is my suggestion to them. Whether they take that as a world-renowned critic and for people to come back, who knows. But do not expect that grandeur on the afternoon plate. There are images that I have for that. So that let me down a little bit. And then what let me down a little bit as well was when it was all set up beautifully, which I personally set the table up, you know, people myself. The manners and the people of the staff was lovely, service was lovely by the gentleman there. We know the champagne, everything was going on there, but part of the afternoon tea was the tea. You know, generally speaking, I would, you know, normally be shown a box of tea with the different types of tea they offer. Some don't. There's many different variations in afternoon tea, but the concept is the same regarding that. And there was a very lack of the tea. We had to ask for the tea. They'd send you the sandwiches, but the tea being just a pot put in, they did ask which one would you like, but, you know, and the explanation, I'm not sure, because this is your field. Yes, I'm a world-renowned critic and will judge on it, and it'd be quite nice to spend a few weeks going around different venues with yourself. For me to write an article on this, to actually see who is the one detecting it. I absolutely love that. Because when you actually go and you study, it really opened my— it opened my husband's eyes, and it opened my husband's eyes that, you know, have people forgotten table manners? Have people forgotten when you're a guest, when you watch people that come in, you know, there's many things I could, uh, say, you know, when I've noticed, you know, one of the things that you don't do is even at a wedding, your place setting is set for there. You do not change your seating plan. So, well, can I sit here? Can I do that? That is classed as ignorance to the host, absolute ignorance, to cause confusion and to do that. If then you have disruption at a table that you are hosting that holds the kitchen and everything up, that again is an insult to your host. And if you quietly challenge and you say to somebody, you know, I mean, you have it at weddings, don't you? People get up and you're waiting for your dinner and like, excuse me, and those poor waitresses are trying to get things, you know, I went to a wedding, Laura, recently And you're sitting at the— well, they've set everything up for you. People are moving and shifting where they're sitting. That has been perfectly planned for a reason. Yes. Why you sit there, the table, the time and effort of why I've sat you across there, the way who's sitting there, why, in consideration, etc. And then when you are there and it's booked for a time, Yeah, the wedding guests, they're all at the bar, "Come on, come on, get in," and they're sitting down. That's it, you know, they've got a huge role to play in the kitchen as well as the waiting staff, and it's a knock-on effect. Everything gets delayed by timing. I know when our son got married, you know, we were very sharp on it, and, you know, the mates' G was very good, and we didn't have that problem. Because they were ordering and we didn't have that problem when people moved on our table and it was safe. But when I've been a guest at other people's weddings, you see, I think they're like, you know, what's going on here? The host hosts the table. You come as a person to the host on the table, yeah? And you respect that host. So I'm going to, for the listeners, and the reason I've waffled on a little bit was it Lady Gaga, shush, you know. But it's just, I'm trying to open up in a lower thing, oh, it's all afternoon tea, it's not, it's about anything. If you go to the café or stuff. But what I'm saying is every listener, they're going to listen to you. Oh God, you know, we have to have our name clap, we have to do that. No, there is a reason for it. And that's why I'm gonna pass it over to you now. I am done speaking. The mic is yours. Thank you. Well, you raised a number of issues, and I might need you to remind me of some, but on the last issue that you raised about people going to an event or where they, they have been invited to an event, and then the, the table has been set, place names, everything is done, and then you get there and you start moving names around and changing the place setting. That is very disrespectful, and it's actually quite bad manners really to, to do that, because as you said, a lot of thought has gone behind the planning and everything. So as a gracious guest, when you are invited to an event, whatever type of event it is, even if you're not on the same table as your friend the right thing to do is to sit where you've been placed, and that should— that really should be the case. It really does not look good for someone to get to a venue and then start changing seats around. It just really looks in poor taste. Yes, completely, you know, because for instance, if you're at a wedding or christening, or, you know, there's lots of events now taking place. Everybody's having an event for something. Whether you're going to have an afternoon tea, it becomes— excuse me— more of an event now because more people are going to these. So they do these little mini parties, and a lot of that I found has increased since COVID and the pandemic, people being shut, you know, where they weren't allowed to see 6 people. I'm finding that, you know, we're having these small tables of 6 or 12. You know, the baby showers, they're coming over in these grand things that are very much Americanized. Beginning, we didn't used to have those. Yes, brought over from America. So it's a lot of planning that goes into these events. If there's an engagement, if you're having a buffet and it's quite— even if you're having a buffet, I was hosting a buffet in the hotel I would still have that table plan so it stops confusion where people are going to sit. So because there's no wandering guests, where do I go? Who's that? However, although it's there and you're doing, then that's your place. Once the speaking and the event and the food is finished and you feel uncomfortable and you get up, like a lot of gentlemen do, tend to wander off to the bar and all these seats become— they're then you can change and go, but certainly not when the preparation and you're letting down staff like that. It is rude. And like you said, for anybody watching, and no matter whoever you are, that's the highest fall from grace possible that you could do because you have brought attention to yourself. Yes. You've just highlighted that you would not place that person at another one of your events because I certainly wouldn't. Because it wasn't about the event or the charity, or it wasn't the event about the bride or the groom, it wasn't the event of the baby shower, it wasn't— it's the fact that it was all about you and to be noticed. And sometimes to be sat quietly and graciously on the side and waiting, um, is more noticeable at the wedding when you're sitting there and you get somebody that's very outspoken and you're on the table. Like when, you know, when I've gone on the cruise ships, it's why even on there, Laura, the first night they set it, the maitre d' sets it, and you see people shifting. Oh, I didn't feel quite comfortable. I've got to go and sit on there. I've had it. I've changed 3 times on a cruise ship. I didn't feel comfortable. I tried a table of 2 or try a table of 4, try a table of 6, 8 and 12. You know, for me, my 2 favourites are a table of 12 and a table of 2. That is my prediction, because when you have a larger table, you've allowed everybody to speak. It helps the conversation when they're trying to serve and getting that through. But if you are having a table of 12, for the listeners that are going, you have to run to the show because it takes a lot longer. The bigger the table, the longer the service. Yes. And you have to allow for that. But when you sit down, when those people are sitting at the back, even for the wedding, if you're at a wedding and you are there going, I need to go to the toilet, when you're invited somewhere else that I've noticed as well is people's toiletry manners. When you're going, you know you're going to go and be seated, it's time to say when you're going. So why wait till you then go to the table at a wedding, look at, "Oh, excuse me," they plonk their handbag on the top of the table, crushing all the beautiful stuff that's been done, phones placed on there, "Excuse me, darling, I've just got to go to the toilet." You're like, seriously? You've had from coming there with the bride and groom being there to come in all lined up, so everybody's there welcoming this joyous union of a bride and groom that has taken months and months, some people years of planning to get the ideal wedding that they feel fits for themselves. The detail that when you put that phone and slammed on that place card that the detail and thought that's gone into that, to the fact that when you look at it and it's squashed, they're a keepsake. I remember my grandmother saying to me and my mother, they would bring everything home from the table and it would go in the bag with the invitation and everything was kept, and they would always buy a photograph of the photographer to commend that day. And there we go, purely is on. Oh, remember Sandra when she got married? Oh yes, I do. Look at this. Where's it all gone? I, I just feel people, um, either are quite naive, or I think also a lot of people are just really not aware of the correct etiquette and how to behave in certain situations. And I believe that's been my experience. And there are those who feel that I should be able to behave or, or do whatever I want, wherever I want, which again would go against the rules of a civilized society. So for instance, I mean, a table setting is a table setting. There is no spot for a handbag or your makeup or or your phone, because I tend to tell my younger students I'm still waiting for someone to create that perfect place setting where they've actually allowed a space for your tablet or your phone, because it doesn't exist. You're there to eat and enjoy the company of the people around you. So once a table is set, each person has their place setting. Handbag, your handbag, your makeup, your phone, your tablet should not be visible, should not be anywhere on the the table, because as you said, it does spoil the effort that has been made. It spoils the beautiful table setting as it's been laid. And also, in talking about people needing to go to the loo, or if we want to sound a bit more sophisticated, you might want to say the lavatory. Again, I always try and say people should try and avoid the word toilet, because that just gives you a picture of what a typical toilet would be. But I think also when you go to an event, perhaps as soon as you arrive, maybe leave a little bit of time if you know you're going to need to use the loo or freshen up, then allow some time to do that. That's provided you haven't turned up late in the first place. So then you can sort yourself out and you're ready to fully immerse yourself in the activities and what is going on, and that is what I would recommend people should do. Yes, because the reason, you know, for myself, when I really need to open up those lavatories or so, you have to start with the words, the keyword toilet, lavatory. I always say powder room, actually. Powder room, ladies' room, Whatever people want to call it, but I do encourage people not to say the bathroom because we're not really going to have a bath in there. So maybe not bathroom. People could use it, but the two— so if we were to do a lesson here, and my lesson would be, and we were to draw which words wouldn't we use, so you're sitting at the table and I would say it to— sorry, if I didn't know, and you know, because sometimes, you know, if you have renal problems, you need to go more frequently, that people wouldn't know. Which is fine. Which was saying, and I was sat next to her, so I said, excuse me, would you be able to tell me where the powder room is? It had to be a bin, and there was nobody there and I needed to go, so I'd answered it, But yes, of course, son, it's just, you know, where you go and you make your exit. But for somebody that wouldn't do it, or lavatory. So I put the two fundamental words in: powder room, lavatory. On the other scale, which is the negative, is toilet and bathroom. You're not going to bathe and you're not going to— you're just seeing everyone's image immediately goes to the toilet. Yes. And it's, you're not, you're not being pretentious, you're giving two levels that is your choice to go. Except the lavatories, please, very different, or the powder room. Because the reason I like the powder room as well, and somewhere else that we can open up and talk about, is when people sit at the table, automatically using their, well, I'm gonna just put my lipstick on, I'm just gonna do this, 'What's that picture?' Seriously, it's a private thing. And even I've seen people get their perfume out, start spraying themselves. 'Excuse me, darling, but I haven't finished eating my bread roll.' You know, when you're looking, and in some of these things you do see it. Yes, yes. I mean, it's not just that, especially with the perfume spray and things. Other people might actually be allergic to perfume. That's one reason you don't do that. Secondly, they might not even— they might not like the smell. So, you know, it's your perfume, you love that smell, that's great, but that's not something that should be applied in, in public. And I actually teach that if you're going to be in a confined space or in a room with a lot of people, try and avoid actually using any scents or perfume, or as little as possible, because not— it's not— it doesn't mean that everybody wouldn't necessarily like the smell, and you never know who might actually be allergic to that. So that would not be acceptable, and definitely not touching up on your lipstick or your makeup around the table when you're sitting with other people. So again, that's something you just easily excuse yourself. May I be excused? If you know where the loo is, or lavatory, then you go and go and do whatever you need to do. And it's the same thing if you do need to go whilst you're eating with other people. There's no need for you to actually— if you know where to go, there's no need to say anything other than, "May I be excused?" or "Please excuse me." And then you go and sort yourself out and come back without necessarily announcing where you're going. I know, but the only exception I would— because there has to be an exception to a rule— an exception to the rule. This is somebody who had renal problems, stuff like that. Which is fine. Conditions, they have to go. And they had come in there and say they'd come into somewhere and everyone's gone— say they were the guest speaker that's coming and everybody wants to chat and that they've been let there, you know, and they made sure before they've made their entrance that they've been to the lavatory, etc. They come in you know, somebody's given them a drink and they've sat down and then there's more water they're giving them, and they're, "Oh," you know, but they don't know where. That's the only time I would call on the Secretary-General's rule, is to say, you know, you would look and very quietly, and then you would say, then I'd actually pause for about a minute, 2 minutes, and then say, "May I be excused?" And you don't say where you're going. You know, when you hear, "Oh, sorry, I've just got to go to the toilet," or, "I'm just eating my steak," you know, I didn't need to hear that, but people do. But this is like, do you think it has, you know, when people say, "Oh, I know Amma," and you know, I did challenge somebody, I think it was at one of my tables, I don't know when it was, a while back, let me say. But I challenged somebody on that table and said, you know, about, you know, when they were going off, this person was going off. I think I would introduce you to him. I'm trying to recall. Please excuse my ignorance on that. But, you know, we have many times when we meet and go out and These people were going to say, "Oh, what does Laura do?" And I said, "Oh, Laura has Polish manners." It was almost like you were being mocked. Why do you need to do that? We know I've got manners. And I was like, "No, this is Polish manners." "Well, I know what she— I've been and met so-and-so and so-and-so." And this gentleman was like really quite rude. And I was like, you know, when you're teaching that, Is it wrong or right? Everybody has a right way or wrong way. You as a family may feel quite happy eating with your hands and, you know, and if that's okay for you, that's okay for you and your family. But when you bring yourself out into certain areas that are fine done and people then get frightened that 'Oh my God, I've got to go to this wedding, oh, they've got all these fancy starters, which knife, which fork.' And it's not wrong, it's not wrong that person, it's the way they choose, but we forget that that's where your service comes in, where you say, for people that aren't us, a bit like someone said, 'Well, I can dance, but I don't know how to do a waltz or do that old-fashioned dancing.' It's what I, you know, I often hear people say, where they go up and they do their disco. But when they're getting married and the bride and groom want to learn, so they go and see a professional dancer to learn the steps. For me, it works the same, so that, you know, you can do these one-off classes and stuff. Not saying, oh God, I've got to do it, but if you're there, so that you don't have that and you're not the person Everyone goes, and it's a bit like Bridgerton, you know, where she writes in her little magazine, and so he really was the shocker of the ball. But it is like that, whether they put it in Bridgerton or that, there are the whispers in no matter what level, there will always be the whispers. Yes, yes. I, I agree. I agree with you. I mean, the, the thing is, a lot of people think etiquette is not relevant for them, but it is. But what I do want the listeners to remember is that etiquette is culturally bound. So you mentioned families that might just enjoy eating with their fingers, but that could be because of their culture. Because if you go to parts of Asia, Africa, the traditional way of eating is quite often with the fingers. So with cutlery, it's a lot to do with Western culture, so in England, in America, and parts of Europe, then yes, you'd be expected to know how to use your knife and fork, but it's not necessarily the same thing. It's not a normal eating utensil for other cultures. So again, it's all about where are you, but if you're in England or you're in America and you know you're going for a formal occasion, um, say a wedding and things like that, then it's really important to understand the place setting, to be able to read a place setting and know how many courses you're having, what you're probably starting with, and also to know in which order to use your cutlery, or where would my bread plate be, where's, you know, my napkin, where would my drinking glasses be. All of those things are important in certain cultures, but as I said, if you are in parts of Asia or Africa, that might not necessarily be that important. It's more about learning how to— how they eat with with fingers and what is acceptable, what isn't. Although we do know that a lot of countries also have adopted using cutlery, so no matter where you go, it's still relevant that you know how to use your cutlery properly. And while you were saying that, the image that came in, probably, um, for a lot of listeners immediately took me, with no offence to any other culture, whatever, was to The King and I, Miss Anna, with this barbaric king, you know, when they say he brought the English lady over to teach him. No, well, they had to find out because this was like when they looked at the couple, you know, what is this? And you know, how did they do that? Because, you know, and it isn't even wrong or right. The same for us when we go over, they must laugh at me. Yeah, and for myself, you know, when I go to, when I went to China, for instance, and I've got my fork to eat my rice and my spoon and my knife to cut that. They're like, what are you doing? Get a cup knife and you can to chop the meat is why it's all chopped ready to use your chopsticks. Chopsticks, yes. Can we have that? It's the same when they look on that. So I personally, you know, and I have flicked a few things that, you know, gone flying out my chopsticks, but, and they laugh at it because the fact that you are engaging and you are trying, trying, yes, is actually a sign of good manners. It is, and they appreciate that. Yeah, so if you think, oh my God, it's thrown off, we've made a mess on the table, they are probably happier they've got to change the tablecloth because you respect that culture. Then thinking, oh, I must eat with my spoon because I mustn't leave any mess. Don't you dare leave the mess and not let it fly over, you know, with it. Once I had it and it was a chicken ball, you know, you thought, like, you'd think the chicken ball would be really easy. Kill that and go on. And then people are watching, you know, when I was doing where I mastered it, and the people that hadn't learned that, no right and wrong way, was like, Lady Janet, you're going to eat all that rice right down with just them things? How are you going to get that? It's the technique and in your hand, and you know, we keep one firm, it's only the other one that moves, you know, and they show me, even though they show you quickly, and do it. And they're like, wow. But what it did was encourage everybody else to try. So all you can do is try, and even if you can't, if you can put it in, even if inside your bowl you scrape it in and use it as a spoon to go on, then bring it in. The fact that people around, you know, can see that, the fact the waiter, the cook, you know, the chef, whatever, can see that at least you are trying. Yes. And that's the main goal, just try to be the best person and the better version of yourself in these situations. Always think of another person, you know, by opening the car door, when you're doing all that, when you're in conversation, and approach so we don't offend. So when you're saying, is there any, you know, so where did you start? Let's now take the listener back to this little girl who became this wonderful lady of such class and who became the My Fair Lady. Oh, this little girl actually grew up to a degree with elements of etiquette because I'm originally from Nigeria and my parents studied here in the '60s and my mother studied Home Economics at the time, and there was quite a lot of etiquette involved in, in what she learned. So from table settings to entertaining and baking and planning, all of those things— posture, presenting yourself, hygiene— all of that was part of what she learned. So I grew up learning properly how to set the table. I quite used to get told off when I was slouching, or when I sometimes I walk past her and she would literally shout my name, can you, you know, straighten up your back, or your posture is wrong. And so I would— I'd always been encouraged, even behaving like a lady. My mother couldn't possibly see me with a group of friends outside if we were chatting and laughing, and then we're laughing loudly or making a scene. I'd be in so much trouble. So there's been that element of decorum in terms of how I behave and things. So I kind of grew up with that. But then I would say when I got married, perhaps I did let it slip a bit. Some of it was still there. And then I had my own daughters, and I did the best I could because I remember people used to comment when I was in school, when they were in primary school, how polite they were. And then I started— I remember looking for etiquette classes for them, and I just remembered they were ridiculously expensive. And, and so I kind of let it go for several years, but then eventually I worked with young people. I started running what we call after-school clubs and holiday play schemes, and it was really as a direct result of that, the mannerisms of the children and even their— some of the parents That is actually how I came about the idea of doing something to particularly help young people to know how to behave, to treat other people, and to respect themselves. And eventually the idea of etiquette training came to me, that actually through this they can learn all these social skills and it can give them a better chance at being successful in, in all areas of their life. So in a nutshell, that's That's how I started on this journey. Oh yeah, that's some journey, isn't it? When you're talking about Nigeria, when you're coming from there, coming across, and very much the role of Nanny, as I was saying, so My Fair Lady. Would you say that if you were to engage and try to empower somebody in the world of manners. If somebody was to look at you, how do you answer if somebody gives you that— just for the listener, that you must have been in situations even as young girl, you know, what you've learned, you've come across and sat at a table with people a bit like myself sitting at a table in China trying to eating their cultural ways and coming across for yourself, sitting at a table where they're seeing this highly polished, well-educated, as I've been, you know, even a small girl, the way you dress the child, you know, your doll, your doll child, you know, that we have, to how you do your tea party. You train your mind in what you want to be and going there. But when you would go out and your parents would take you out with these wonderful manners and sitting into areas, coming over, and you had another child that would look at you and be like, that wasn't trained in the manners. That manners come first. Manners maketh the man, not the clothes. That manners get you a long way. Manners, posh attitude will get you a long way because first and foremost you have to have manners. Now, as my grandma, I was taught that. There are occasions that I was as a small child, and even now, I will adapt to this situation that I'm in and trying to hold And sometimes I have to lower my shoulders and that, as much as you can with the grace that you're not sitting there with people coming down. I try and raise my shoulders and sit forward if somebody is discommanding the table of a table that should be respected, and the guests that are on that table should be respected for the class person who they are, that it's not tolerated. And like Ascot, for instance, your child will go into the, you know, the management, very, very high. This is why, um, even myself, I'm, you know, people like, we still can't, because sometimes there is certain etiquette that we have to do that we forget. We buy these beautiful shoes. What do you do to our shoes when they're going in the hill? And you've paid all these hundreds of pounds for these shoes and they come back and they're all stained in grass and they come back with their dress to be photographed. They haven't, you know, the photographer's taken all day to do Anne's photograph and it's just ruined their shoes, you know. Ask what's going on with ladies' shoes, do not go together unless you get certain pumps to go down if you want to go onto the grass and do that? And how do you carry that bag in with you into Ascot when you're walking through the gates? You know, these are all things that we need to ask. These are all questions that we need to ask in there. But my original question was, Laura, how did you cope, or how did you answer If you were put in a position on a table where all you knew was you're finding— one of the things I often see you do is when you place— you opened your bag, you know, even at My Fair Lady afternoon tea, and you gently opened your bag and you had a perfectly folded tissue, and then you tapped gently but quietly onto your lips, put that through without getting anyone— I noticed because that's what I do, I notice things like that. Everybody else probably didn't, or the other ladies that did probably didn't know how to go on it. But it showed the class that there was a lady on there that I know has— one of the guests we had on, came to that table recently that we had, that was so impressed, they said, "I want to engage you." And I know that that's happening, and for her children to actually— and they're from China, I'm sure they're Chinese, they are Chinese, yeah, no, from Hong Kong, sorry, I must correct that for her— to engage her children, that they love and they're well-mannered, they do everything there at McDonald's, but just, she said, so, you know, that she wanted them to learn this extra element in the culture and cuisine, which is great. So, yeah, so that was something I noticed. So yeah, so the mic's over to you. Okay, so the question is, how do I cope or answer I think we didn't— I didn't quite get the end of the question. The question is, how do you cope if someone is rude to you in their manners at a table? Do you get up and leave and say, "That's it, I have to leave," or would you stay, is another one, and see it out and take note of that and back and take this as a lesson lesson that you would teach to somebody and your students. That's the first. There's a two-point question, so it's 1A, is that. The second is 1B: how would you cope if somebody challenged you about why you would think that their behaviour was wrong? Okay, I'm— I think it's more or less, um, along this— along the same lines, both questions. And rudeness, I have to say, I've, I've come across that quite, quite often. One thing I always stress to people, people who are rude, that usually tells you the level of their emotional intelligence. And really what etiquette has certainly helped me to do— I'm normally quite a calm person anyway, but I will definitely not rise to that occasion when someone is being rude. Quite often, depending on what is said and how it's said, chances are I would actually say, okay, maybe I do disagree with you, but I do not have to put up with your rudeness. So if I can move away, I will move away. If I can walk away, I will walk away. But what I will not do is engage with that person or walk out in a huff. I, I wouldn't do that, especially if I'm in an environment where I can speak to other people. I've— maybe I'm there to enjoy myself, and I certainly would not let someone else's mood ruin my afternoon or ruin the, the, the environment that I'm in. So quite often I just look at people that are rude, that obviously it's their problem, they have whatever issues they're battling, but I do not have to engage in that. So I would always, always make sure that I, I remain calm and not end up in, in that sort of situation where you pretty much are having a maybe heated discussion or argument with someone because there never is any winner in, in that sort of situation. And, and then in the, the other aspect where people have challenged me in, um, maybe why, why do you think my, my behavior is wrong? Firstly, I would not tell anybody that the way they're behaving is wrong because that's not correct etiquette anyway. So you really would not say, oh, you shouldn't be doing that. If— I mean, I, I think the the afternoon tea on the yacht that we went to, someone actually asked me if they were eating their scone correctly. I noticed how they were eating their scone, but I wasn't there to teach, I wasn't there to correct anybody, but I had observed. And when they asked me, I just whispered, I said, in essence, you're actually not eating your scones correctly. But that's because they asked me. But I would not, and it's, it's really rude and bad manners for anyone to actually turn around publicly to anyone and say, oh, you have bad manners, or, or, you know, your behavior is, is wrong. Because yes, naturally they probably will challenge you that why are you telling me that my behavior is bad, because perhaps that's how they're used to behaving. So quite often I observe people um, in networking, at networking events, various events, and I just let it go. And if more than anything, those are just— those just give me topics, things that I can add to my repertoire when I'm training people how not to behave, things not to do. And that's— I think I would leave that there. Yes, lovely. That was a very, very Wonderful explanation on that, um, Laura. Thank you. And, um, you know, I'm sure for the listeners could see that. So if you are there and you think somebody is, you know, but you know you're talking and, but, and explaining, and, or if somebody is explaining to you, they go, oh, you know, and they get across at you, oh, I've got my you just ignore the conversation and carry on chatting about— you're explaining what do you do, this is what you do, and just explain in a general conversation if we're having, you know, over there. So which is, you know, again, as I say, a wonderful explanation in how to deal with that. So what sort— if somebody listening wants to get in touch with you, Laura, I think, you know, I like that you say you do students like that. Could you just— can we look at firstly the classes you do? Can we use this time now for the listeners? What sort of classes can they do? Are they bespoke? You know, if you're a corporate business, how can I work with you, and what can you get? Do you do— can you bring stuff to corporate? What can you bring, and how do they contact you? So it's quite a multi-mixed, uh, question there. Okay, I mean, I'll start off with the— generally I run what we call in-person classes for children, teenagers, young adults, and adults as well. Social etiquette or business etiquette. I run my own courses that anybody can come on, but I also do get contracted by schools, sometimes companies where they want me to come in, maybe dining etiquette for a group of people or a particular aspect of business etiquette, maybe a few hours session. So I can and do work with in a corporate environment as well, depends on what people, what topics people want to cover. So, and you know, I also work one-on-one with, with families, people who choose to have private sessions individually or as a family. I, I do that. Sometimes I— some people I work several months in, in a row and, and actually work in their house working with them, whether the children or the parents. So there are various options to work with me, and I also work one-on-one online. So some people want to have a few hours private tuition, which some topics are okay to do online, but there are some— is better in person. So to contact me, I'm on Instagram, I'm under as @polishedmannersuk, and also I have a website which is www.polishedmannersuk.com. Www.polishedmanners.co.uk, and I'm also on Facebook as @PolishedMannersUK. So there are several ways that people can get in touch with me. I also offer afternoon tea etiquette training as well, so I do organize a couple of times a year where anyone can come on the afternoon tea session and we'll have afternoon tea in a nice venue, and I talk through the etiquette, the history of afternoon tea, how it all started, and also the etiquette of having afternoon tea, because there is an etiquette to it. There are— there is a way to eat afternoon tea, from which course is first to the first to second and third, and generally We cover parts of dining etiquette as well, how to use your napkin and general conversation, all those lovely things. So there are a number of ways that people can work with me if they're interested, whether professionally or you're just interested in social etiquette. Can I ask you if we can just open up a little bit on what the history of afternoon tea is. Okay, when I talk about the history, and I don't want to give away too much, it's just the history of how afternoon tea started. There's even a history to how the sandwich was first invented, which is part of what I teach, and all started in England as well. So afternoon tea was something that was started by the 7th Duchess of Bedford because she was feeling a bit peckish, you know, in the 1840s, and she asked for tea and some cake, and that's kind of how afternoon tea evolved. But then obviously sandwiches were added, scones were added, and then it really now, you know, became almost like a meal nowadays, but it was something she started, and ladies, and, you know, ladies started copying it, and it soon became, um, you know, something very elegant that obviously when the richer people are doing it, then the middle classes started copying it as well, and, and it became a very elegant and, um, interesting event that ladies, ladies started, um organizing afternoon tea, and it was a way of meeting up and just enjoying each other's company. Yes, I mean, and what we're seeing, you know, people are trying to do more afternoon teas. You know, when they— we had the pandemic, you know, the pictures that coming, but obviously we've got the Jubilee coming up, so we're going to see, you know, the heightened for the cup and saucer, everybody wants to do that. Honegans, you remember the Queen's Jubilee? I remember, I mean, we had the Jubilee and then she was like James Bond coming down. But for me personally, which was fantastic— That was the Olympics. Yes, yeah, yeah, and yeah, it was, wasn't it? That was the Olympics. Yes. I had to think because, you know, when I was crossing that— for me, the other Jubilee was the Golden Jubilee, okay? And I was a 13-year-old girl. I was about 13, 14 then. It was just before Diana got married. It was 1970— 1977, wasn't it? I can't remember. No, I don't. You know what we're looking at? There we are, guys. We've got the Queen's Jubilee coming up, and that's something I'm going to look at. I know it's on the weekend, the 3rd, the 4th, something like that. Yes, it is. Because I'm in America with Sean Fair, um, who I would like— if you speak to the wonderful Juliet Morrison and speak to her because he's coming over and he wants to bring his brand, who he is, into the UK. So a lot of Americans coming in here, which is a different thing, which would be a fantastic connection for you to work with. And he's coming to a couple of the balls that I'm doing, so we need you to come and I'll send you some private details on that. Okay, thank you. Which is good, a huge, huge You know, he teaches speakers. He's taught over 300,000 speakers. Wonderful. He's a lovely guy, you know, coming up. But I'm going to be spending the Queen's Jubilee over there, but I'll be flying the flag for it in America as the Brits are coming, you know, over there. But for me, I was saying, I always remember, as we're coming to a close of this show, that for people, you know, with the with the Queen's celebration, got the cups and saucers, to just, you know, have a little thought, a little courtesy to go back when you are doing this, which is that the challenge is send me the pictures, whether it's on Twitter @ladyjagger, that we can see, so Laura can see, all these wonderful pictures of people having afternoon tea. And it would be lovely to see that. And then the little children holding the cups and saucers and what they're doing and what type of, you know, what makes your cup, you know, what do you look for in a cup and saucer and the etiquette and everything in there, Laura. Because I do like a mug to drink out of sometimes in the morning. I'm really thirsty. I like a mug, and I like a mug at the end of the night. I'm having a hot cocoa or something. But during the day, if I'm going out, I like my cup and saucer and, you know, different teas throughout the day that, you know, to awaken you, the lemon and gingers. You need refreshing from an Earl Grey, you know, about 4 o'clock. Then I don't want to go into anything that's caffeinated and everything on there. But so you've given— can we just remind the viewers of your website and any stuff, how they can contact you, just before we close the show? Okay, thank you again. My website is www.polishedmanners.co.uk. I'm also on Instagram at Polished Manners UK and on Facebook @polishedmannersuk. So you can contact me through any, any of these, these platforms, uh, or send a direct message through Instagram, and I can send you any information. Thank you. So for the listeners, you know, when we have these events and we, we can bring ourselves mental stress and strain and worry, how, you know, you've got a mix of people And like with the event that you were saying in the office, a boardroom, because the notes of the perfume or aftershave can bring on somebody's hay fever. It can be quite disruptive. So there is quite a lot there. So I challenge the listeners to just have a look at being in a room. Have you been in a room and perfume, aftershave's been too apparent? Have you sat at a table and somebody's manners, uh, been rude, or somebody disrupted your, your, um, event. But on that note, thank you, Laura, for coming on Free Your Mind. Let's Talk About It with LKJ. And here's to the wonderful afternoon tea, and let's all polish our manners. Thank you very much, Laura.