Hello, this is Anna Kennedy, and we're at Women's Radio Station, voice of women worldwide, and we're talking all things autism. It's April already, my word, the time is flying by. And it's World Autism Awareness Month, World Autism Awareness Day, and World Autism Awareness Week. I've seen so many social media posts really, really positive and sharing all the fantastic work that smaller groups are doing, individuals, charities, businesses. So it's a fantastic platform for us all to share what's going on. I know Autism Awareness Day and Autism Acceptance Day should be every day, but we do have these specific platforms that we can share. So I have been a very busy bee. Yesterday I was at Heathrow Airport, Terminal 3. I've been working with Heathrow Airport for quite some time now, I think it's probably about 18 months, and we've been talking about a sensory room. And finally, it's nearly there, I'm so excited. So I went to Terminal 3, and off we went to see the sensory room. And it's amazing. I love it. There just needs a few more little bits that need to be adjusted, but the theme is the Mr. Maine, which is fantastic. My son Angelo loves the Mr. Maine, so did my son Patrick, even as an adult, he still loves the Mr. Maine. I just think it's so popular. So if you're going to Terminal 3, please just look at the special assistance link on the Heathrow Airport website, and you don't have to book, you can just go straight up to the playroom. And as I was coming out, a parent said to me, you don't know what a lifeline this has been for me. She said it's just caused me to relax a little bit more, you know, there's lots of different activities. They've got the sensory room, they've got equipment in there. So please, and we're hoping that it's going to be rolled out to all the terminals. So I'm not sure how long it's going to take. And I've said, don't forget about the adults because adults obviously need time out too. So my guest today is really amazing gentleman. I met him probably about a few months ago now, and it's Dr. Chris Papadopoulos. Welcome Chris. Thank you very much for having me. I'm just going to give everybody a little bit more information about you. So you're a principal lecturer in public health and a director of health research at the University of Bedfordshire. You teach on a range of health postgraduate health courses, in particular the MSc public health taught course. Chris engages in research in a range of health related areas within the social sciences, particularly stigma, autism, mental health, informal care of parents, older adults, culture, health technology, and social robotics. Chris also engages in a range of community related work having founded the London Autism group in 2014 and the London autism group charity in 2017 for which the autism podcast forms part of, which I'm pleased to say that I was a participant. So Chris, you're a busy bee. I try to be. Yeah. I try to make a difference, you know, following your footsteps and, you know, I don't think I could ever quite follow in your footsteps at all, you know, I'd have to run a million miles per hour to follow in your footsteps. You know, of course, but I'm trying to do what I can, you know, we have one career, one life. It's important to make as much impact, I think, as possible. So why autism? So how did you enter the world of autism? So it started with my son being diagnosed, my first son back in. He was three when he was diagnosed. He was born in 2010. We got a reasonably early diagnosis. I was going to ask you, I'm always interested to hear how long it takes for parents to go through the process. We were very fortunate when that, you know, he got the diagnosis very quickly. We were lucky in that we have in the area that we live in, which is Barnet in North London, we have a very good provision, local authority commission commissions various various things. And there's a decent provision. It's fairly well known. Of course, unfortunately, provision is a bit of a postcode lottery that completely depends on where you live and which has happened to be very lucky that in Barnet we we have a decent provision. So it gave us access to some support and to some professionals. I didn't actually know much about autism at the time. My expertise was more in mental health. I did my PhD in mental health and mental illness. I was always interested in that and disability more broadly. But I didn't actually know very much about autism. And I didn't really expect or I never expected that my son would be autistic. And I wasn't looking out for it. I didn't know what I was looking for. It was all very new. It was only until, you know, he you know, the developmental milestones weren't really happening in the typical way. You know, you read those those horrible books that tell you about typical development. You know, I absolutely hate those books, you know, those books that talk about typicals, but oh, by the time that your child is everyone's at a different level, I mean, kids are so different. Yeah, it just it just sets these these standards that, you know, you've you have a lot of anxiety about, you know, on every little thing. And and it's just needless. I mean, parents are so that the research tells us quite clearly that parents and carers are stressed population as it is, particularly carers of autistic people, autistic children and other people, vulnerable people. So when you've got these additional kinds of information saying, well, your child should be doing this or if it hasn't, you know, it's stressful. It's concerning. It adds to the stress. And you blame you can blame yourself. Well, I've actually spoken to some parents. Well, I said, I must have done something wrong. I said, you didn't do anything wrong. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, absolutely. So but at the time, you know, I wasn't really sure what was going on. It was only, as I said, the professional indicating that he may well be autistic. I didn't even know really what that meant or what the implications were at the time. It was all quite new to me. But fortunately, I I think I took a positive approach to it. You know, I think I think people respond to different things, different ways. I'm very lucky. I have a great social support network. You know, I have an amazing wife and family and where, you know, largely reasonable people, you know what I mean? So so we're lucky and fortunate and we're able to respond to things reasonably sensibly. And my response was, OK, well, let's let's learn as much as we can about this. Let's try and figure out what's best for him and us. And also at the same time, maybe, you know, maybe we can make a difference to other people as well. And so that was really the initial stages of my personal journey. Something happened in that, which I might bring up later on, which led to some of my initial research activities. But just to add that, my third son, who is my youngest now, my three boys, football team. No, yeah, no, definitely not football team. No, we're done. We're done. But the third one, he is also I mean, he hasn't got diagnosis, but I'm I'm I'm 99 percent sure he's autistic as well. How do they get on all three siblings together? They get on really well, actually. Yeah, we're very fortunate. They get on. I mean, obviously you get the usual. Yeah. Squabbling over every, you know, toy or whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Brothers. Yeah. But on the on the whole, they get on really well. My oldest, who, as I said, was the first to be diagnosed. He's just an amazing. He's absolutely an amazing boy full of heart. You know, we might talk about this later, but the idea that autistic people, that that stare, the horrible stereotype that autistic people don't have empathy or they lack empathy. I mean, if you met my son for five minutes, you'd know that that's just nonsense. You know, he's just such a loving, empathic, beautifully spirited, lovely boy. You know, and so that, you know, he's really the glue, I think. Yeah. With the brothers. I did share on social media that my son, Patrick, who's 29, the lady next door that she's been our neighbor for quite some time now, her daughter died just over three years ago. And Patrick was very upset by this. The first he saw was obviously all the flowers outside the front of the funeral. And he was asking me lots of questions. And then he said that must be awful. So what he does now is every year when it's her birthday or when it's Mother's Day, he go, I don't tell him. He just goes himself. He buys a bunch of flowers and he gives it to her. And they also sit and look through photographs. So if that doesn't show everything, I don't know what. And she just said he just brings a tear to my eyes, so gentle. And then when I said to her, oh, he's going to be looking to be moving soon. Now he's got a job, you know, he needs to find his own place. And she just said, I'll just miss him so much. And I just thought they've got a really good relationship and it's great. So tell me a little bit about the London Autism Group and the London and sorry, the London Autism Group Charity. So what's that all about? So, yeah, that's a great question because it leads on nicely from what from what happened with us personally. So a year after the diagnosis in 2014, having learned more about everything and experienced all of the various kind of state based channels. You know, so we got the diagnosis, you know, it's a state based provision, let's say. But after the diagnosis, it was very striking to me that there was no support given for the parents, nothing was whatsoever. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, there were a few leaflets given to us about, you know, how you might support your son and what's available in the community. But nothing, nothing tailored for the parents or carers, particularly their mental health and well-being. The thing is, if you don't know much about autism, it's your first time when in experiencing autism and maybe also you're someone that believes the stereotypes, you know, you don't know, you've not ever been challenged. You might just be one of these people that harbors these stereotypical views, you know, for no fault of your own that you just may have this. That if you if you're that kind of person and your son or daughter gets a diagnosis, then, you know, you're you're very, very, very vulnerable to be very distressed. You know, I mean, first time don't think about it. All you know is negative things. You know, you'll you'll catastrophize it and and you'll be very, very stressed. And there's, you know, the evidence is quite clear that those people at that point need support and protection when it comes to mental health. So one of the many things I've done related to that is to form the London Autism Group, which is an online Facebook group for Londoners to go on and access support and and communicate, because, of course, the other thing is there's no offer of integration when you get when you get a diagnosis. There's no, oh, that those people over there that live near you also are in the same boat. So why don't you go and reach out? So I thought it'd be a good way for people to connect. And OK, so if people want to look at what you're doing, where would they find you? So the London Autism Group, you just simply go to the you just simply go to Facebook and search for it. London Autism Group, you'll see it's a closed group. You have to apply to join. OK, and there'll be an administrator that will. Yes, we'll message you. And the charity is that similar? The charity is the London Autism Group is part of the charities. One of the things that we do as part of the charity. Yeah, you meet up as a group? Yeah, we meet up sometimes. Lots going on. Lots of people on the London Autism Group. You know, it's a very popular, successful group. OK, so we can talk a little bit more about in the second half. So we're at Women's Radio Station Voice of Women Worldwide. And we're live here at Covent Garden. If you're interested in looking at our charity website, it's www.anna Kennedy online dot com. If you want to follow us on Twitter, there's a lot of activity going on. It's at Anna Kennedy One and Anna Kennedy Online, which is Facebook. And we're at Women's Radio Station. Welcome to Women's Radio Station, the voice of women worldwide. I'm Sarah Louise Ryan and welcome to Love Lessons Live on Women's Radio Station. 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For more information on how you can sponsor a show, go to womensradiostation.com. Women, the possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. Hi, I'm Nina Masconi, Head of Business Development at Women's Radio Station. Radio advertising is the most cost-effective way of reaching a huge audience globally. Moreover, our sponsorship and advertising packages can be tailored to your needs, whether it be a product or brand service you're looking to promote. If you are interested in sponsoring or advertising, please contact me on 07 956 371 483 or alternatively ZM at womensradiostation.com. Hello, this is Anna Kennedy and we're talking All Things Autism and we're at Women's Radio Station live at Covent Garden. Before I go over to my guest, Chris, I just wanted to share with you that we're so excited about performing at the Apple Store with the Autism's Got Talent performers. So we have three dancers and three singers and you're going to be blown away. So if you're in Covent Garden on Friday at 5 30, come and support us. 5 30 till 6 30. And we're at the flagship store in Covent Garden. And we're so excited. And one of my ambassadors, Sienna Castellon, who actually spoke on Women's Radio Station, is going to be talking about her project, the neurodiversity that's going to be happening at the end of May. So please come along and support us. And I'm sure we'll be able to share some highlights if you can't get there. So, Chris, we were talking about the London Autism Group and the London Autism Group charity. So you were talking to me about sometimes parents don't want to give their name. They want to remain anonymous. So can you just share a little bit of information about that? Yeah, definitely. So the main aim of the London Autism Group is is to offer a safe space for parents, carers, autistic people, anyone whose lives have been influenced by autism to come online and share whatever it is they're thinking or feeling with others, get information, get support. And one of the things I often see is that parents or autistic people or professionals, whoever it is, contact the admin members anonymously and say, can you post something anonymously on there for me to get some information? But I don't want to put my name out there. That's absolutely fine. We do that. That's one of the ways that we support people. And often, you know, it's amazing the response that we'll get. Often I'll see messages and comments in the group saying things like, you know, these kinds of groups, these kinds of social media spaces that really give me the support that I need. And in terms of state based support that I access, you know, we've supposed trained professionals, I encounter problems. I encounter things that give me more concern, more anxiety, more more reason to be fearful and more annoyance, frankly. So when they come on social media, that is a good place to to be a bit car and cathatic, you know, and get get whatever it is off their chest, get support, share experiences with other people that have had similar experiences. And it's just a great successful group. I'm proud to say that it has been very successful. We've got about fourteen hundred members just since 2014. So it was one of the things, yeah, that I wanted to do after my son was diagnosed. You know, I wanted the thing was the reason why I formed it was because I was looking after the diagnosis a year past, I was looking for support, local support that I could meet other fathers, you know, talk to people that might understand what I'm going through. And I just there was nothing in terms of an organised space that's local. And I didn't want to do it too local because I thought, OK, Barnet only, how many people can we can we reach and how many people can come together? But there was nothing London wide. And I was very surprised that when I looked on social media, there was no London wide presence in terms of I'd seen a couple of groups, but they'd actually close their clothes. They just couldn't keep it going. Yeah, there was something called Autism London. That's right. Yeah, I remember going to visit them many years ago. Yeah, that's right. They were a charity that were doing various charitable activities. They didn't have a social media presence, you know, like like what we do. And they actually did since merge with another charity. And MCCH, I think it was. And so we are literally the only space London identified geographical space when it comes to London. So it's a nice it's a nice place. People can connect reasonably close to each other. People meet up. We have one thing that I just like to mention, which is fantastic, which is called the London Autism Group Services Map, which is publicly accessible. You can just go to Google and search for it. Right. So that's London Autism Group Services Map. And what that is is that that was created by our admin member James Gordon. Oh, yeah. Who is absolutely fantastic. And I'm really appreciative for him for everything he's done. So what he did is amazing. He compiled compiled all of the London based autism friendly services that are in London spread all across London. And he put them on a on a Google map. So you can click on this link and go to this Google map and you'll see all of these points, you know, these little anchors that they put on for each place that there's something on the map. And everything is there. So if you don't know what's around you, you can go to this map and it's been a great idea, tens of thousands of times. We encourage people, professionals to share it and get it out there. And if anyone wants to add any of their services to us, we can put that on there. So maybe if you tweet it to me, then I'll retweet it. And obviously I get a domino effect and we can share it because that's the sort of information that parents and adults are asking for. Yeah. So we've got lots to talk about. So tell me a little bit about your academic research interests and when it comes to autism. So what are you doing? What's exciting? Anything exciting, Cameron? So so a couple of things, mainly to do with mental health and stigma, particularly when it comes to the well-being of the parents and carers. Because as I said earlier, what I experienced was quite striking to me in that as a parent getting a diagnosis, we had no support provided. So as I said, one of the things I wanted to do was create this London autism group, do some community work and go down that road. But also begin to focus my academic research activities towards addressing this issue. And I remember because as as I as I am an academic, I've been an academic since 2001, doing various research, work in mental health and stigma, the stigma towards mental illness. And I just thought, you know what? I'm now in the world of autism. The best research is the research that you're passionate about, that you live and that you feel. But of course, also, you think and are objective about. And autism began my big was my life in 2013. It became it absorbed every it absorbed my life completely. I was thinking about it all the time. And so I thought, you know, the best research is when you when you're passionate about it. So I wanted to direct my research attention towards autism. And in particular, the mental health of carers and the impact that stigma has in particular. Because, as I said, when we get a diagnosis, there's no support. And at the time, very fortuitously, there was a research call that came out from Autistica. OK, yeah, yeah. So the Autistica are absolutely fantastic. They are the UK's biggest research charity. And so they fund a lot of research. And there was a call that they put out for applications on mental health, anything to do with mental health. And so I put in this application calling for an intervention to be formed in which we can give give parents that have just been whose children have just been diagnosed or about to be diagnosed access to so they can come together and get mental health support. So it's basically a tool that parents can use to get mental health support and send them off in a positive, healthy way after diagnosis, as opposed to leaving them with nothing. And of course, the crucial rationale to part of this is that when the mental health of the carers and parents are better, they're much better able to look after their children and their children benefit. Because of course, if the well-being and the mental health of the parents and carers is compromised, then their ability to care is compromised and the child or whoever it is that they're caring for, you know, suffers from that. So it's, you know, crucial and ethical imperative that we build tools, build practices, build interventions that are evidence-based, that parents can access post-diagnosis so that they are, you know, given a springboard going forwards towards being supported and having better mental health and just a healthier, more positive, more friendly, more happy start into their autism world, as opposed to what it is at the moment. Yeah, because I have said many times that both my sons are very much in tune with the way I feel. If I'm not well, I can see the anxiety building up in the house. And I think it's because parents are the linchpin. They rely on us an awful lot. Even like now we're getting older. My son Patrick says now and again, you still got a long, a longer time to live, haven't you, Mum, type of thing. And it's just the anxiety because we've always been there. We've always fought their corner. So I always try to promote and we're going to be talking a little bit more about what do you do to relax because it's very important that us parents relax and we tend to forget about that because we're so focused on supporting our sons or whatever it is that the work that we're doing. And we're juggling like 60,000 balls in the air, aren't we? So for me, it's really important. So if anyone wants to look at your research, where would they find it? So I published a few things. If they just Google, my name would probably be the easiest thing. So they just typed in Dr. Chris Papadopoulos. They'll get links to my various web pages that list all of my research activities and they can read on. Yes. So I work at the University of Bedfordshire. And so all of my research goes through them. We've got a new research coming up ideas of what you might like to do. Yes. So so this intervention that I was talking about, we are just coming to the end of of that project. So it was fortunately granted. So we received a research grant. These research projects, they take three or four years, you know, to go through. And we ran the trial. So we had to test it. We designed it with some good science and good theory. Much of it was based on this issue of self stigma, by the way, I should mention, which is the idea that at diagnosis, parents often may self blame. So they might blame themselves that their child is in this situation that they're that they're autistic because of because of them, which is a terrible feeling to have. So much of it is about reducing those feelings of self blame, being able to protect themselves from all of the horrible stigma and misconceptions that surround autism so that they are thinking healthier about it. And fortunately, we have gone through three years. We're coming to the end and we're about to publish our results, which are very positive, I should say. So we found we found that it really does improve mental health. It reduces feelings of self blame. It enables you to cope better against external stigma and compared to the control group who had nothing. So we compared our intervention versus care as usual. How many parents did you interview? It was there were 16 parents that formed part of the intervention. OK. And 16 that didn't. OK. So that's how it works. We compared the two. OK. So for future research, if you need people, I do get contacted by quite a few research and said, oh, Anna, can you share this for us? So I'm quite happy to share information like that. And also the results. If you want to share again, just tag me and I'll I'll share it out to everyone so you get a wider reach. So we're at women's radio station. So if people want to find you, where will they find you? Chris, if they want to find you on Twitter. Yes. Facebook. Yeah, I'm on Twitter. So my handle is at Chris Pabst P.A.P.S. OK, just one. Yes. And Facebook. Facebook, I suggest you search for London Autism Group and you'll find me there. I'm I'm I'm there a lot. And as I said, my University of Bedford share page, if you just search for me on Google, my name, you'll find it. OK, thank you. And again, if you want to search for me, I'm on Twitter at Anna Kennedy One Instagram at Anna Kennedy OBE and on Facebook. It's Anna Kennedy online and we're live at Women's Radio Station. Women's Radio Station is a fresh new broadcasting platform driven by love and passion. Connecting women around the world in a global network is all about diversity from the opinions, career, ethnicity, education. We aim to show the individuality of every woman everywhere, providing opportunities and a platform for your voice. Women, the possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. 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If you are interested in sponsoring or advertising, please contact me on 07 956 371 483 or directly ZM at Women's Radio Station dot com. Hello, this is Anna Kennedy and we're at Women's Radio Station Live in Covent Gardens and we talk in all things autism. And my guest today is Dr. Chris Papadopoulos. And before I go over to Chris again, I'm just wanting to put a shout out there for everybody that lives in St Ives or in the area of St Ives. We're going to do Autism's Got Talent again and I'm looking for some performers. So if you want to showcase your talent, please contact the charity. So it's at www dot Anna Kennedy online. And the closing date for entries is the 12th of May. The show is going to be on the 29th of June 2019 in St Ives. And please send us in your submission videos. One of the performers I just wanted to share who was part of Kids Are Us, which is the fantastic Phil Barnett. She her name is Molly and Molly was on The Voice on Saturday and she's gone through to the final with Ollie. So we're excited and we're rooting for her. So come on, Molly. She just loved Autism's Got Talent. She did Mary Poppins on the show and she was just overwhelmed by all of our performers. So we're all rooting for her. So if you want to take part in Autism's Got Talent at St Ives, I had a lovely message that I picked up yesterday from a performer that performed last year, a young girl called Imogen. And she left a message on the answering machine. It was about quarter to eight on Sunday. And she said, hi, there, it's Imogen here. I'm just checking to make sure because I performed last year that I just go straight through to this year's show. And it was just so sweet, the message that she left. She obviously had such a positive experience about the show. And so she thinks she just automatically goes through to the next show. So, yeah, that was just really sweet. So, Chris, we spoke a little bit about Autism's Stigma. So why are you so interested in Autism's Stigma? Yeah, thanks for that crucial question. I'm happy to talk through that. And I will just to say, though, talking about performers, Robert, was it Robert White who got to the final Britain's Got Talent a couple of years ago? Yeah, he today joined the London Autism group. Oh, did he? Yeah. So you find all sorts of different people on the group. So, you know, definitely if you're interested, if you live in London or near to London and your life is in some way influenced by autism, you're new into autism, you're welcome to join the group. Connect with Robert White. So, yes, Autism's Stigma is a crucial thing. And I think Autism's Stigma because of the consequences of stigma, basically. And those are the formation of misconceptions such as these ideas, as we said earlier about autistic people lacking empathy or possessing some sort of character flaw or, you know, these kinds of negative beliefs that people have that don't know anything about autism, just what they've seen from the general media, perhaps, you know, from watching Rain Man, you know, the general, you know, usual misconceptions about what autistic people are like are very problematic. Even things like I shared on social media that, oh, you know, you can't have autism because you're a girl. Yeah, exactly. Right. Exactly. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So things like that. Yeah. I saw that recently. Yeah. That there was this ridiculous notion that, oh, you know, autistic, a girl, you can't be autistic. Are you too articulate? Yeah. Are you too? Yeah. Right. All right. As I keep saying, if you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person, everyone has got their strengths, their differences. And ultimately, autism is, for me, just a neurological difference. Is a difference in the way that we process information that what is the autistic brain works, you know, and who's to say whether the way that that it works is better or worse or right or wrong or correct or incorrect? Who's making up these rules? You know, so it's a problem. And I think we have to we have to be ethical and fair to autistic people and try to value their their difference and their strengths and the fact that they have their own individuality and avoid these ridiculous misconceptions and generalisations that cause harm. And that is the thing with autism stigma. It causes harm. Another key reason it causes harm is because of discrimination. They cannot get discrimination without stigma. If if by stigma, maybe I should just explain what I mean. I'm just going to say that to some people might be listening thinking, well, what does he mean? Right. So by stigma, I mean negative perceptions and labelling towards a particular person or group of people or population, but not just negative in a reasonable, irrational way in the way that we might think of cancer. You know, we think of cancer as a negative thing. Avoid, get rid of, et cetera. That's reasonable. But the thing with stigma is that it has to be unreasonable, you know, irrational, unfair, you know. And that's that's the thing with stigma that, you know, it's an unfair, unreasonable, negative label that you've been given that hurts you. And I do think that there's plenty of evidence that autistic people are the victim of autism stigma. Not just autistic people, but also the parents and the families and the people associated with with those people. As I said earlier, there's a lot of self blame among parents. Yeah, it was my fault. And that often comes from their connected family members. Culture as well. Right. Still heard things like, you know, it's like witchcraft. It's like, what? Right. I've heard that before. And if there was no autism stigma, then you wouldn't get that. No, you're absolutely right. One of the stigma is a culturally constructed phenomenon. What I mean by that is that it varies from society to society. You have different types of stigmas at different severities. So autism stigma is a problem in the UK. But I would say that on the whole, it's not as big a problem as it might be in South Asia or some parts of Africa, places where they really are far behind with how they conceive and perceive people, autistic people. As you said, the idea that it's an infliction because of a previous life or, you know, witchcraft or some sort of, you know, evil, some sort of evil part of you. And people still think like that. And I've spoken to some families where, oh, we've got visitors today. So the autistic child or individual, they have to go upstairs and stay in their bedroom. They can't come downstairs because the guests are coming. It's just like, hello, they live there. It's just like, I just I can't even get my head round things like that. It's just like it doesn't even enter my head. I just don't know why people think like that. It is absolutely disgusting, because as I said, these people are just it's just different. It's neurological difference. This is why we're calling autism more and more an autism spectrum condition or an autism spectrum phenomenon, as opposed to autism to spectrum disorder, because even the word disorder implies something negative. You know, disorder is not a nice word. You know, it's something problem is a problem as a problem, you know, and it suggests treatment and curing, which when in fact, there is no evidence. I can guarantee you that there's no evidence that autism in itself is a problem or anything negative that needs treating or curing. Of course, there are many challenges, such as epilepsy. Yeah, overlapping conditions, overlapping conditions, such as learning disabilities. Yeah, these are challenges that definitely we need to think about and work towards. But autism in itself is simply the way that the brain processes and also almost always the way that our sensory worlds also react. So the way that we are, we process sensory information. But ultimately, there's no evidence it's a disorder. And with autism stigma, the inference, the implication is that it is a problem and that we need to get rid of it or deal with it. And as I said, one of the key problems with autism stigma, why I'm so interested in it is the consequences. And one of the key consequences that I need to draw attention to is this issue of discrimination. So autistic people are far more likely to be discriminated in the workplace, for example, and face employment discrimination. It's it's often the case that I hear from people that they don't disclose that they are autistic at a job interview. My son didn't. And then when he got the job, then he told them on the first day that he started. To be honest with you, he probably boosted his chances because the stigma is real. If you do disclose autistic, then you're you're playing a bit of a risk. It's a shame because it'd be better to be honest. And I mean, in terms of reducing stigma, it'd be nice. But really, the onus should not be on the individual to take full control and and feel the need to reduce autism stigma on their own. If it is that they need a job, you know, I think wider social policy should be dealing with that. We need better laws, regulations, policies that really give us a better framework for reducing autism stigma. The owner should be on the politicians and the power makers. Not so much the individual. Of course, the individual should do what they want. And it's great if they do it. But I don't I wouldn't want to think negatively of someone who didn't disclose because they need a job, maybe. And the reality is they're more likely to be turned down if they do disclose. So, you know, and loneliness is another big problem. Social exclusion, bullying. All of this would not happen. Right. All of these properties are huge problems that destroy mental health. And all of these problems wouldn't happen or would be significantly reduced if you just took away the stigma. If it was something that was viewed positively or fully accepted, we wouldn't be discriminating against these people. We wouldn't be excluding them or finding ways to keep them away from our from from our families or ourselves. You know, we would just value them as we do or give them a chance as we do anyone else. And then what you would see is better mental health among those people and the parents and the families better mental health. And everybody's quality of life improves. Yeah. So sometimes just some small, reasonable adjustments can make a huge difference. I was just talking about this to some parents to their child at school or the child in the college or child in the workplace, an adult. And I gave a shout out today to Pinewood Studios when my son works. And they've been amazing with him. And he tells me every day about what's been happening at work and about his boss. And I can just see, by the way, he talks about how they're supporting him and about how they like sometimes he finds things where they give him a job to do, but he doesn't think outside the box. It's just like I'm doing that job. And he doesn't sort of look at other things that might need doing at the same time. And he tells me this. And they keep trying to give him pointers of Patrick. You know, you need to look at this. You need to look at that. And he also shared with me that when he actually knows what he's doing every day, the anxiety is so much less. But when they say to him things like Patrick, we're not quite sure what we're going to be doing tomorrow because of this situation or that situation, whatever impacts on it. That's when he feels the anxiety. So for him reassurance is knowing what he's doing. And that's just a small thing, isn't it? Really? So, you know, that's great. So I just again wanted to say thank you to Pinewood. Patrick's been working there for 10 months now. I can see a big difference in him. I can see his chest puffed out. He feels like he's contributing to society and that's what he wanted. So as I said, the next stage now, hopefully September, October time, we'll be looking for a flat and he'll be on to the next stage. So we're at Women's Radio Station. If you wanted to share any information with me about some of the things that we've been talking about or you want links, just please message me at Anna Kennedy Online, which is www.anna Kennedy online. Any questions you might like to ask Chris, I can pass them on to him. And again, we're at Women's Radio Station and it's www.womensradiostation.com if you want to send any questions. Welcome to Women's Radio Station, the voice of women worldwide. I'm Sarah Louise Ryan, and welcome to Love Lessons Live on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamante on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to Julie May is Listening. Hello, this is Anna Kennedy at Women's Radio Station, live voice of women worldwide, talking about all things autism. Women, the possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. I'm Saskia at Sable Forex, and we specialize in saving individuals and companies money on their international money transfers or foreign exchange. So in monies crossing currencies, whether it's euros to yen or rands to pounds, that's where we can add value. So for all your foreign exchange needs, I'm Saskia at Sable. 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Women's radio station can give a voice to your brand with a wide range of sponsorship opportunities, including individual programs. We can tailor your experience to you. For more information on how you can sponsor a show, go to womensradiostation.com. Women, the possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. Hi, I'm Zina Miskoni, Head of Business Development at Women's Radio Station. Radio advertising is the most cost effective way of reaching a huge audience globally. Moreover, our sponsorship and advertising packages can be tailored to your needs, whether it be a product or brand service you're looking to promote. If you are interested in sponsoring or advertising, please contact me on 07 956 371 483 or alternatively ZM at womensradiostation.com. Hello, this is Anna Kennedy and we're at Women's Radio Station live at Covent Garden and we're talking all things autism. And my guest today is Dr. Chris Papadopoulos and before I go over to Chris, I just want to remind you of our Autism Hero Awards, which is www.acoautismheroawards.com and we have 12 different categories. So if you know of someone that goes the extra mile, it could be a teacher, it could be a carer, it could be a business, it could be a reporter that writes particularly well. It could be a mom, it could be a dad, it could be a sibling. Just check out the 12 different categories. We've had nominations already coming in since last year. And we have the difficulty of choosing 36 finalists. So, Chris, thank you very much. You are going to be one of our judges for the Autism Hero Awards. I hope you're prepared because it's quite a rollercoaster. I'm really, really looking forward to it. I'm sure it's going to be an amazing experience and inspiring. Yeah, so there's seven judges in total. And what you need to do is narrow them down to three finalists for each of the 12 categories, and then you'll be there on the night and you'll be able to meet all of the finalists. And then we choose a winner on the night. It's quite an emotional rollercoaster the evening and it's such a great event. So it takes place in November and it's at the Radisson Blue at Marble Arch. So, yeah, so you will be reading a lot of entries that are coming in. So many people do such amazing stuff. I think this is such a great opportunity to formally recognize that and give them some credit and acknowledgment. Whether you win or lose, you're there. You've been nominated. That's an amazing achievement. And so many friendships get formed as well at these events. So people meeting each other. So much goodness from it. I think it's such a great idea and I'm really looking forward to it. Thanks for inviting me. Thank you. So, Chris, what are your future goals in relation to the charitable work that you're doing and your academic research? Yeah, so the charity, the London Autism Group charity, we formed that on the back of the London Autism Group. So what happened was London Autism Group is just simply a Facebook group. It's a closed private group, meaning that people can post on that without a worry that what they post will come up on their public page. So it's quite secret and closed and private, which is very nice. But I mean, it's great, but all it is is a Facebook group. So it had all of this success and a big following and it still has. It's been great. But we wanted to build on the success. And so what we did is in twenty seven at the end of twenty sixteen, we got approval from the charity commission to form and set up the London Autism Group charity. So the Facebook group is one of the activities now that formally sits within the charity. So it's charitable work that we do. The Autism podcast is one of the other things that we are doing for the charity. This is something I'm very, very proud of. And it was great having you on and thanks for coming. It was like a therapy session. It's for remembering everything that you've done throughout the years. And it's just made me think. And then sometimes you sort of sit there and you think, oh, did I do all that? Almost done. Yeah, you really sort of shocked me really when you talked through all of the various things that you've done. You know, I think we needed several more hours, to be honest with you, to capture it. Or it's unbelievable the amount of stuff you've done and really. And it's nice to just talk with you about it and ask you some questions that might help listeners. So the podcast, the aim of the podcast, or should I say the aim of the charity, maybe I should start there, is to work on this issue of autism stigma to really help do things that can reduce the stigma and its impact. And that includes promoting social inclusions, acceptance, etc, etc. And the podcast is just a great way, I think, we think, to doing some of that. Because people more and more are listening to podcasts. That's what they do now. They go for a run, they go for a jog, they are cleaning, whatever, they're driving, they're listening to podcasts. So we want to be one of those people that are listened to and not just listening to any old nonsense, but interesting, inspiring discussions surrounding the critical issues of autism. So we've had various conversations that are critical to autism, such as the work you do, but also mental health. And also one on, we did one recently on sleeping, which is a big issue. Sleep, what's that? That's coming out soon. Bullying, we've talked about bullying. So all of the kind of key things. And we've done one recently which was very well received with Carly Jones on the topic of autistic girls and women. And Carly, well, yeah, she is absolutely fantastic. If you haven't listened to that, I really suggest you check it out. Just get you can access the it's called the autism podcast. And you can access it just through any podcast app. So if you if you use iTunes or an iPhone and you go to your podcast. Yeah, you can just search for it and find it. If someone's interested in speaking themselves. Oh, definitely. Yes. Thank you for saying that. OK, absolutely. If you'd like to come on and have a conversation about what we'd like to do is talk about experiences and issues. Those are the two, the two sorts of things. And those conversations should be geared towards having a positive impact in some way. So if you're interested in doing that, just contact me. Drop me an email. Again, as I said, if you want to find my contact information, just Google my name and my Web page at the University of Edfordshire comes up, which it has my email and my Twitter handle. You can tweet. You can contact me on Twitter as well, which, as I said, is at Chris Paps. So the autism podcast is something we're very proud of. We've done seven or eight episodes and had and quite significant response. I was just going to say, how far does it reach out? Because I remember when you were chatting to me, you're saying it goes to different countries. Yeah. So we have access to all these statistics and surprisingly, it goes to the the most unusual places I'd never predicted. OK, you know, all sorts of countries across the world. You just wouldn't believe the various countries. There's no rhyme or rhythm to it. It's just random, which is great. It has real international reach. Yeah. And in fact, I'm particularly interested in getting in some international audiences because at the moment it's been a little bit UK centric. OK. So I'd like to get someone from the state or Australia or New Zealand. And we get a lot of followers from Australia and Canada, Germany. OK. These kinds of place, Spain. Yeah. So in terms of your question, in terms of what do I want to do to, you know, build the charity and what we're doing, one of the things is to just keep pushing the autism podcast. OK. A couple of other things quickly. Something that we're going to be doing soon because we've managed to raise a reasonable amount of money so far, which is to do a small grants scheme. OK. So this is going to be something initially piloted and tested within the London Autism Group. So if you're a member of the London Autism Group, soon there is going to be a way to apply for a small grant to support whatever it is you need help with. What's the limit? We haven't quite decided yet. I'm not going to say, but it isn't it isn't substantially big. But sometimes a small thing. I remember we gave a grant to a young lady who was autistic who couldn't afford books for her university. And it wasn't a lot, something like a hundred pounds. And she messaged me after she passed and got a two one. And she just said, if it wasn't for you with that small grant, I wouldn't have been able to do it. And she just said, I just wanted to say thank you just to let you know I got two one. Yeah. So that was amazing. It will probably be that's fantastic. And that's exactly what we want to achieve. It will probably be around the five hundred pound, six hundred pound mark. But we'll give out multiple of them. Yeah. So it could be anything, as you said, from books and academic stuff to speech and language sessions. You know, those those professional sessions are very expensive. Especially if they're one parent family. Right. So if if you apply and you say, look, I really as as everyone else is benefiting benefiting from it, I need to as well. My son needs to. My daughter needs to. But we haven't got the funds to do that. Can you help us? Then we'd love to do that. So something like that. So small grant scheme to help people, you know, in their situation. And also the other thing that we're thinking a lot about and planning is an advocacy service. OK. So 24 hour telephone line or text message line via WhatsApp for support and information advice and one to one peer support advocacy as well. These kinds of things that, of course, can only do good, but are complicated. These people need to be trained. They need to be there's legal issues, ethical issues. So we're working our way through it. But we have big goals. And I think I have a fantastic team and it's just a matter of time. Really, you know, time is our biggest. It is just like there's so much to do in so little time. Then you're juggling lots of other things. Being a dad, you know, working and everything else that you've got to do. So talking about juggling lots of different things and balls in the air and all the rest of it, what do you do to relax? Because I know for a long time I didn't do very much. And I try my best to do things to relax. But I do find it hard sometimes. So what do you do? What makes you wind down and recharge your battery, if you like? Yeah, that's a great question. I think everyone needs to think about this a little bit, a little bit, and work out what works for them. Yeah, I'm pretty good at managing my daily life. So I never get stressed. I never get too stressed, actually. You actually seem like a quite a laid back person. Yeah, I'm reasonably laid back. If anything concerns me and if I feel like I'm getting, you know, stress, then I am quite proactive and I deal with it as much as I can. I prevent it. So I'm reasonably calm most of the time. But I do what I do, if I'm honest, it's nothing exciting. It's pretty boring. I'll have to put the kids down. I'll watch an hour of television or something like that. Netflix. Yeah, I think Netflix is great. I didn't know anything about it until my son said so. My wife and I will watch. You know, we're watching the disappearance of Madeleine McCann. And yeah, what else? Game of Thrones is quite stressful. Yeah, I know. It is very stressful. It's so sad as well. I know it is. I just love to see what happened to it. But anyway, I'm moving on. Yeah, yeah. So watch a bit of TV. I've taken up running recently, believe it or not. I'm very unfit. So I've started the couch to couch to 5K. I know a few people have done that. Yeah, someone like week three of that. So I find that quite therapeutic, actually, doing a bit of exercise. That's it. Nothing. I like playing Paul and Snooker. OK. I'm pretty good at that, actually. And that's about it. Nothing too exciting, really. It's hard to have time as well. Just you and your wife or me and my husband, because obviously our sons have grown up, but they're still at home. Yeah, sometimes there's no like private time, if you know what I mean? And it's just like you're on the go all the time or you're listening out for what's happening. Always on yellow alert. Yeah, definitely. I'm always on yellow until the moment I've fallen asleep. Yeah, so it can be quite difficult. But wherever you can try and grab five minutes, I always say, even if it's just to go for a walk, jump on down in the bathroom, shut the door, whatever it is that you need to do to relax. So I just want to say thank you very much, Chris. Always a pleasure to talk to you and thank you for sharing about your research. Thank you for sharing about the charity and anything that you want to share. Links wise, remember to tag me in. So we're at women's radio station. If you want to be one of my guests, please contact me on Anakinady online. It's www.anakinadyonline.com and we're live at women's radio station at Covent Garden. Again, if you want to listen to what's going on, please check out www.womensradiostation.com to listen to the podcasts. 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