Free Your Mind – Nicci Clarke Part 1

Hello and welcome to this week's edition of Free Your Mind, Let's Talk About It with LKJ. Today's guest is Nikki Clark. Nikki Clark, um, is director, regional director of Global Women Birmingham. She's also marketing director of a company that she's just about to join, which I'm going to let her introduce. Express on that. But I'm going to take you on a journey. This is going to be part 1 of 2 interviews, actually, because when we deal with mental health and trauma and how we get through that, part 1 is going to be taking you, the listeners, on Nikki Clark's personal journey to where she is now, and then her part 2 will be about corporate being CEO of her own company, working as managing director, being a regional director, and how even through trauma you can still stand and carry on using your umbrella of support. So on that, I'm going to introduce you. Nikki, are you there? Hello, yes, I am. Welcome to the show, Nikki. And can I ask you in your own words because, you know, we can often read one's bio out, um, what's in there. But I like to actually hear sometimes, especially somebody like yourself that has had firsthand adversity with mental health trauma, to actually open up and say who you are and, um, your position at work, etc., so the listeners can see that before I take you back through your journey and through your mind. Certainly, I'll definitely share that, and thank you for having me. So my name is Nikki Clark, and I am about to start a new role as marketing director at Sodexo Live. So they're a large hospitality company that supplies lots of things to the likes of Ascot, Chelsea Flower Show, a number of football stadiums and arenas around the UK. I also have a number of charitable interests, so I'm running a charity ball. I'm the global regional director for for the Global Women Club in Birmingham, and I also mentor a number of different people ranging from school children to sort of adults who are on their journey and who want some support with their careers. And then also outside of that, I live in the Midlands, I have a dog called Lorona, I love spending time with my family and friends, love eating nice food. I've worked in hospitality for a long time now, love shopping, going on holiday, all the sorts of normal things you'd Lots of normal things as well as a passion for high-speed cars. Hmm, yeah, I've also bought myself a sports car, so I've been enjoying that as well. I've also bought myself a bike, so I've been cycling to the gym. So I also love keeping fit, playing netball, walking. Yeah, definitely after lockdown, it's kind of one of those moments that it was like, you know, you only live once, why not? So yes, I So when I look at that, it's a clear thing. Thank you for joining us and the listeners on Free Your Mind. Is that you have this empowerment to free your mind now? Because when we look at your car, you know, high speed, the wind, you know, really taking life full speed ahead. But then sometimes also having the balance where you will go on to your I believe it's a Pendleton bike that you have, to just cycle and take the slower pace going through that. But life hasn't always been like that, Nicky, has it? No, it hasn't. I have to say, behind all of that has been sort of quite a tough time, really. I think before COVID sort of experienced some trauma. As you've mentioned, the loss of my partner from cancer all happened really fast, and life after that has been navigating this world without him. It's been really hard, but through the love and support of lots of people have really helped me. And I use the word, rather than say move on, move forward. I have to say, feeling in a much better place now, but it's not been without some really dark days. But yeah, that was quite a difficult time in my life. So for the viewers and the listeners, or now, the way that I conduct my shows is taking you back, um, and to really take you back to where you were born, who you— parenting was, education— so to see who you were, um, and was there any early onset of trauma in your life before? Because there are many different forms of trauma and acute, chronic, and complex that we deal with, and how do we deal with that as psychologists, how we will use therapy to go through the support. As I always have the umbrella of support, which I use in the coaching for that. But let's take you back, Nikki. Where was you born? So I was born the 6th of November, 1984, in Wolverhampton in the West Midlands. I was actually a twin. My sister Vicky was born first, and just under 10 minutes later, which must have been a very long time for my mom, I arrived second. So being a twin, I mean, you're saying arriving second, have you ever felt that you are the second child or first? Or do you find being a twin that you have these natural instincts of each other equal in the balance of when you come out, even though there was 10 minutes separation? I mean, you're coming from your mum's womb into, um, from the universe and into the world and your life journey beginning. It's interesting you should ask that actually, because I've done quite a bit of work about sort of childhood. I never felt number 2, no, um, but I was part of actually 6 years later, um, went on to have a little sister. And I think typically, even though I was a twin, I was kind of classed as the middle child in sort of quite a busy household. Um, me and my twin are not identical, we're very different, but we were always encouraged to express our own interests. So I think we were dressed the same up until about 5, and then I have to thank my parents that they kind of— we were— we explored our own interests, and I think that was really important. But no, we have a really special bond. There has been times when I have had that twin sort of sense. My sister suffered from epilepsy during her childhood, and I would— there was a couple of times when I just knew I immediately had to go and see my sister, and it was when she was actually having an epileptic fit. Hit on a number of occasions. And so we have a very, very special bond. And people always ask me that, what's it like being a twin? I just don't know any different. And she's always been there for me, and I'm forever grateful for that. We are super different but very close nevertheless. But I guess I was typically the middle child. I was quite quiet, quite studious, pretty good, well-behaved. I think my twin sister probably wasn't, and my little sister was definitely sort sort of knew her own mind, shall we say, and I was just the one in the middle. So, you know, because we often hear of middle child syndrome, so did you ever feel any middle child syndrome? I didn't up until recently, actually, when I started to look back. I think I probably realised that some of my sort of behaviour now is definitely about being seen and heard, and I think it was just simply— had a wonderful childhood, great parents, but I just I think it was part of being, you know, the household was busy. Mum had 3 of us, Dad worked really hard, and I definitely think it was always the case that I just kind of got on with things and they didn't really need to worry about me. And I think some of my, you know, flamboyance, shall we say, buying sports cars, etc., is possibly, I think, comes from that middle child. But I always had this drive, I always wanted more, and I remember feeling that way from an early child. It was always, I was always typical, I want the next best thing. And that doesn't mean to say I'm not grateful, but I was always pushing for more, and that was in me from a very early age. So as you were saying, you know, it's quite a well-behaved child being in there, and you were saying, you know, we just touched on about your sister suffering of epilepsy. So being a first child, so she had quite a few issues that have come through. Have you— is she quite a sickly person through having epilepsy? Was she the one that always caught the cold? Was she the one you know, she's got more fatigue, where you, as the twin that came out after 10 minutes, didn't have any. You've been quite healthy, quite fit. You don't suffer anything like that. Yeah, do you know what? I've just got goosebumps with you asking me that. But yeah, she has. She's always been really quite, you know, the one, as you've just explained, gets the colds. She's had, you know, some sinus issues actually recently that she's got some treatment for, which is great. Yeah, she has. I was always the one that was kind of just cracked on. That's really interesting. I've never quite made that connection actually with her epilepsy. And, you know, we've always put it down to having quite a low immune system, as in myself and my family, because she was always quite ill. Yes, obviously being the first. And did she weigh more than you? Yeah, she did. Yeah. So obviously by her you know, being firstborn, taking, you know, a lot from the placenta, etc., coming through, feeding through the cells and her own DNA building from that. It's yourself being smaller behind, quieter version, and then because a lot of that energy was going in, but also with the brain, you know, suffering with the epilepsy. Was she diagnosed with epilepsy quite early on as a baby, or did it— was it something that progressed? Later in her childhood? It was later, it was when she was a teenager actually, and I'm not sure if they ever officially diagnosed it as epilepsy or whether she was after a number of scans, but she had quite severe seizures which were difficult, difficult for her, difficult for people around her, and fortunately she has grown out of it and hasn't had a seizure for, you know, over— I would like to say over 10 years now. So yeah, has recovered and is well. Yes, but does she take medication for it? Not— no, not now. Oh, just so she can drive and everything like that. So being the elder, do you think even going through that, is she the stronger of the two of you, or would you say you are the strongest out of the twins? I would say I'm the strongest. And the strongest in the mindset? Both mindset and emotional, or does she carry more of the emotional? I think I would think I'm the strongest emotionally and mindset, but my sister has this really lovely personality and perception of the world where she's always happy. And it's something I really admire in her, amongst lots of other things, that she's just always happy-go-lucky. And I think it's a lovely trait to have. And I often wish I could have that sometimes when I'm kind of pushing harder, doing lots of things. And she's just really happy with her life and she's wonderful to be around. Everyone loves my sister. She's a great company. So, yeah. So when I'm, you know, analyzing this as we go, you know, starting to take the listeners into this journey of whilst you free your mind, Part 1, is this your charge, you were second, you know, middle child, you know, with the other sister being born after, that for you on that twin side, how she had suffered many challenges and being then obviously, you know, protected more, you know, probably by your mother and your father being there for yourself too. I suppose in one way it could be described as you had to get on with it because if, you know, a sister was sick, you got on. So this is where you gained your early strength as a child to cope on your own. I'm going to do this, I'm going to complete this task. They're busy, your love for your sister to allow that to happen, but grew you stronger. But at the same time, as you're saying, in the emotion factor, you have suffered with depression, you know, as a teenager. Am I correct? Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I think it's a good way of looking at it, actually. I remember when my sister used to have fits and I would suddenly get up in the classroom and say, I need to go and see my sister now. Obviously, everyone— my sister would be unconscious, she'd have a seizure, and there'd be like, you know, a number of children hysterical because they're, you know, they're quite distressing for both the person having the seizure but also to watch. And I just remember having this strength where I used to say to 30 school kids in the class, you need to move, you need to get hold of yourself because my sister does not need to see this. When she wakes up. And I would be as cool as a cucumber because I knew that she just needed to see a friendly face holding her hand saying, 'It's okay.' She was obviously very disorientated. Often the ambulance would have to come and take her away, and all that's really traumatic for the person having a seizure. But if you wake up and you see 30 of your friends peering over you in hysterics, that is just not going to help. So I remember having that attitude, and I think people used to read that as me not being emotional. And, and, you know, it was actually the opposite. I just knew I had to be strong for my sister. And then, yeah, as a teenager, when I was in sixth form, I remember being quite low. I think I put quite a lot of pressure on myself. That hasn't changed in terms of what I wanted to achieve. I really battled with that. And, you know, at the time, sort of, yeah, 20 years ago now, the support wasn't available that it is now today. And I'm really pleased to see that in terms of mental health and feeling depressed and Sometimes the doctor would put it down to your age and your hormones, but really, I really struggled through that time period, through a lot of my early 20s as well. And obviously, with a person of strength, you are a person of strength, even though suffering with this, that you put a mask on your face, basically to show the world that I am Nikki Clark, I'm strong, I protect everybody, I do the task at hand. And I support you. Show yourself already then as your leadership skills in, you know, this is the situation, this is how we handle it, you know, this is not the correct behavior to have. And I feel there's been one that's been a huge attribute to you in your career, but at the same time, leaving that mask has left emotional scarring. And like you said, you know, removing the stigma that you've had. But how old are you now, if you don't mind me asking? They say a gentleman should never ask a lady, but as a lady, I think I am on a different platform to ask that, just so that the listener can see where we are now in your age. That's fine. I think I've kind of given it away as well. I'm 37. 37. Oh, you still look young. As we get older, we look younger, you know, I believe, because those our life journey comes out, we express that, and we get that freedom within to actually release that. So with this and your care, going back to your sister, and, um, how is your relationship with your family? You know, Mom, Dad, who was the more protective? Were they both protective of you? Because it's very strong family that I feel, you know, as we're talking through to get the you know, the strong bonding ethics, you know, that were in that family with challenges. And even if you hiding the challenge, do you think your family ever understood that you were suffering with depression? Yeah, I mean, my mom did. She was— she still is my best friend. And but I think I probably hid it from lots of people quite well, my close family and my friends. But my mom really saw sort of how down I was feeling at the time. I would often break down and my mom cry and be upset and just to talk to her about things, and I think she picked up a lot of that worry. But we were super close and still are today, and I'm really, really, really grateful for that. But it wasn't something I felt particularly comfortable talking to my dad about. I definitely would do now. I think things have changed, our relationship's changed, but it was definitely my mom who supported me during that time, and I shared pretty honestly how I was feeling at times and when I became a bit overwhelmed. But I I definitely hid it from probably my sisters and my friends. And just picking up on that, you said where your relationship with your father has changed. What changed that relationship, Nikki? Actually, my partner dying of cancer, really. I think my dad was really there for me. And actually, probably have to go back a bit before that. And when I separated from my previous partner of 7 years before that, my dad was the only person I could get hold of. When my partner ended the relationship and I was really naturally upset. It wasn't what I wanted at the time, and I rang a number of people and the only person who answered my phone was my dad. And I was just in hysterics. And he came round and he sat with me until my mum had finished work. It was a Saturday. I'll never forget it. And then he used to come round every week after that with the dog and he'd just knock on my door and have a cup of tea with me. And that was, you know, his way, really kindly, of showing how much he cared. And that really changed that our relationship actually. We talked about things and I really valued that time and I actually value that he was the person that picked up the phone. Wonderful. And it's great when you hear that, Bon, because we hear all these stories of the bond between the father and his daughters. But going back now, so this break and everything for 7 years with his partner, and obviously the trauma. This was probably the first encounter you had with acute trauma in the breaking up of your relationship for 7 years. Would you like to express some of that in how you met? And, you know, how you did— I mean, 7 years, again, there's another thing that hits point with the 7-year itch. You know, we have these different terminologies it's coming there, but 7 years you're on a path. Where did you meet that partner, Nikki? Well, actually, there's quite a good story with this one. So I remember I was in my early 20s, I was living at home, saving to move out, and, you know, typically going out with your friends, you're working full-time, you're going out at the weekend. And I remember coming home one night and it was a dark December night As you can tell, I work in marketing. I'm a storyteller. My mom's like, my mom is like, I've got to show you something. I've got to show you something. And she opened the newspaper and there was a, there was a coverage on Peter in the newspaper about this guy who was a physiotherapist. And she went, he's right up your street. And I just remember laughing. I said, oh, he's probably got some lovely girlfriend. And this was a Thursday night. Roll on the Saturday night and I'm out in town with my friends. We live in a small town and I just happened to say to my friend who was standing next to me at the time, I think that's that guy Peter from the paper. And she said, oh yeah, he is. I know him. I know I used to work with him. Come on, let's go and talk to him. So we sort of go over and talk, had a bit of a chat to each other. And I remember getting home and the next morning saying to my mom, you'll never guess who I met. And that was it, really. The kind of the rest, as they say, is history. But I honestly thought that, you know, we'd get married, we'd have children. It was that sort of early 20s into your latter 20s. You know, everyone starts to get married, settle down. We bought a house together, and, and I really did believe that, that we would, we would do those things together. So it was really difficult for me when that ended. Um, and we went on an incredible journey together with our lives, with our careers, um, traveled the world, and lots of amazing things happened. But, but unfortunately, one of the things that happened is we didn't spend that much time together. He was away with work. He pursued a career that he really wanted to. I supported him with that, um, but it did have a, you know, at the detriment of our relationship. Um, so yeah, it's just a bit about how we met and what happened afterwards. But after 7 years of living a life like that, you know, obviously with marketing, growing in your field, empowering, you know, people with your marketing skills, who you were, your leadership skills, your personality and character shining, because, you know, I'm had the fortune to know Nikki myself and through Global Women where we met. And Shine, and how you are, you know, you're actually a genuine individual, you know, to help somebody is imperative. But what I'm trying to look at, you know, when we're getting to where we are, is for Peter, you know, this time that you had with Peter, there's 7 years which are, you know, as the counseling and stuff I have as a professional is I often wonder why after 7 years does it become apparent that this road is changing and you've learned love, you've learned how to build with another person, you've learned how to share things, um, organize diaries to do everything like that. That what put the chink in the chain to stop the wheel turning? Why, at 7 years, did he say, I don't want this anymore? Had he met somebody else? I think he had. I'm not sure that the two crossed over, I have to give him that. I think I can answer that. It was the distance. I think his work took him away. He was away all of the time. I would go and visit him at weekends, every other weekend, and we drifted apart. I think in your early 20s— I've definitely done lots of work on this— you don't necessarily— I wasn't the best communicator, neither was he, and we sort of lacked that, you know, way of really just sharing with each other how we felt. I think I was frustrated. I was definitely finding it difficult to be away. I was back at home you know, looking after our house, seeing family and friends, but I was doing that all on my own. I remember going to weddings and he'd literally fly into the wedding on the night before the wedding and by the next day, sort of after the wedding, after they got married, sort of 7, 8 PM again, be flying back out the country. And that's hard. That takes its toll on your relationship. He then went on to have a relationship with somebody in the same industry that he worked with. That didn't surprise me because it meant that their lifestyle and their schedules could be the same. It would have been very difficult to have a relationship with someone outside that industry. So that was it. And I've done a lot of work on myself after that in ensuring how I communicate with a partner and being really clear on what I want and the boundaries of what I would accept and what I wouldn't moving forward. So you did seek therapy after that breakup? Yeah, it was like a— little did I know at the time, you know, it's like grieving and it's not just the person you break up with, it's a whole life. I'd spent lots of time with his family. I'd been there with his sister when his sister gave birth to her daughter, super close, and we've got a house together. For me, you know, I genuinely did believe that we'd get married and have children, and it was a really difficult time because he lived in a different country. It took over a year to get things sorted, which I found really difficult. So yeah, it was it was a hard time, as when anyone breaks up from a partner, and you kind of go through all the questions in your head, and it's really difficult. Yeah, thank you for sharing that, Nikki. So after that, obviously with your career in marketing, did you find that you put every inch of your power into your work and thinking, okay, this has failed and that, I am now going to just put everything into my career and be the best version of myself in my work then as well, having that therapy. Absolutely, yeah. I think I ploughed myself into work. It was what I was good at. It was something that somebody couldn't take away from me. I enjoyed it. Yeah, I definitely did. I think at times my lifestyle allowed, allowed me to work longer hours than maybe other people, which wasn't necessarily a good thing. So I would often kind of be, you know, staying late in the office because, you know, there wasn't anybody to go home to. So I would just get done what I needed to get done, which probably meant that I did, you know, quite a bit more work. And I'm not saying that is the right way at all. It's just what I ploughed myself into. Yeah, and obviously, in a huge respect to you for what you've done, and where you are in the world is, you know, empowerment to women as empowerment to men. But, you know, when we're going to touch on that, on the, on that question a little bit later on this, because our next show is very much about corporate and everything on that. But this is first getting the, this is people whoever you are, whether it's one of your work colleagues in your new job that listen, to say, who is my new marketing director? Because people are so quick to judge the book by its cover, and you are very glamorous, very glamorous. And, you know, for the listeners, we do have a nickname for the wonderful Nikki in Get a Woman we should call her the Duchess. Reason being, because she does represent actually the twin version of Kate Middleton. Her mannerism, her class, simplicity of— and what you expel for somebody else. At the same time, being like that, you— why are we criticized in life if you achieve by yourself as a female. Someone said no, no, no. But I want to actually touch on this subject before I go back. Is there's 3 questions that you get asked that no man will ever be asked in marketing, isn't it, Nikki? And what are those? They are— I've been trying to explain this to some of my male friends and work colleagues is a couple of the questions that I get asked that I don't believe men get asked is, "Who bought your car for you?" Well, I did. "Who bought you watch?" And, you know, "Why aren't you married or have children?" And they're just some of the comments or feedback or questions that mainly men ask me, and I just find it quite offensive. And when I try and explain to some of my male friends, family members, and colleagues who just say, you know, why are you doing all this stuff? Why have you set up this Women's Global Networking event? Why are you talking in schools? And I'm just like, because the simplest way I can explain it to you is, you know, we want equality and we just want to be equal. We don't want to be better or worse, just equality is all we ask. But let me ask you 3 questions. Has anybody ever asked you those questions? And I see the look on their face and they're like, no. And this is not about, you know, material things, this is not about anything like that, it's just about saying that's the difference between men and women, that, you know, we are not regarded the same. It's quite a negative, a woman who's successful and ambitious has sometimes negative connotations, that you're aggressive, that you're pushy, but yet a man does all those things and he's sort of, you know, he's applauded for it. So we're not quite there yet, but it's really important that I stress the point it is about equality, and I'm working on my approach to it. I don't want to isolate anybody, I want to take everybody with me, and it's about being inclusive, supporting and learning each other, men and women. But they're just some of the questions that I get asked on a monthly basis, and it's time to change that way of thinking and that conversation. Which is quite true, Nikki, when you're coming in and doing your job and whoever we are, You're only being the better version of yourself. You're bringing this content to your company of who you are when you— they— we— how do I put it? Um, there's a male there, there's yourself. You're coming in, uh, beautiful, coming like that. And who's this? You know, people would, you know, have fear. People will think, oh, are they going to be strong with this? Well, they have preconceptions. Until you meet the wonderful Nikki. But for us on this journey, part 1 is opening up for people to understand who you are. You could look at you when you roll up in your lovely Porsche, shiny car, beautiful, you know, watch on, your hair like that, and people assume by the COVID of that book 'Oh, she's not married.' Do you find, Nikki, if you went to parties, you were like the spare chair that would be like, 'Oh, you know, sit there,' or did people try to matchmake you? Did they leave you with that empty chair syndrome? You know, did you get lost, or was you like forever like the bridesmaid? You know, do you understand where I'm going with this? Yeah, no, I do. Yeah, I definitely did. I think a lot of people would be surprised to hear, like, you know, quite a lot of sort of a bit of anxious nervousness about into the events, the amount of weddings I've been to on my own and thinking, you know, will that be me one day? I have to say, after working on myself, I found those happy occasions. I love going to them. But there was actually a long while, actually, when I was in a relationship where I'd just go and I'd always have this kind of feeling, you know, when my friends were getting married. Of course, I was happy for them, but internally I was like, you know, sort of really sad. I don't feel that way anymore. But yeah, it was a difficult time. The amount of parties, Christmas parties, and you do sometimes feel a bit like the third wheel. And, you know, even driving to a party or someone saying, you know, I'll pick you up and those things. I've got some wonderful friends and family and they always make me feel inclusive. But there's still— you get to Christmas on your own again. Valentine's Day I find very difficult. So yeah, I do actually, and a lot of people I think would be surprised to say some anxiety around social events sometimes, yeah. Did you ever feel fear from women that you would roll in as this wonderful, you know, top executive, stunning, with the fast cars, with the stuff like that? You are quite a head turner. I must say that. Do you think sometimes you was met with, you know, a little bit of any narcissism towards you? Because of that, when you come in, that, who do you think you are? Definitely. And sometimes I think I'm a really warm, friendly person. Anyone who knows me knows that. Really chatty, really welcoming. But yeah, definitely a bit about you know, if I'm talking to their partner or something, kind of just a little bit of, yeah, like resentment. I could definitely— it's something sometimes you just can't put your finger on, but it's definitely a feeling that you feel. And I'm, you know, really not like that at all. I just love chatting. But yeah, I definitely sometimes get a look or there'll be a body language shift or something to say, oh, I shouldn't really be talking to you, or my wife's not going to be very happy, or the partner would appear, which is, yeah, quite difficult because you've meant no harm or offence by just talking to somebody. Thank you for clarifying on that, Nikki, because after Peter, we are, you know, for the listeners, this could cause a trigger emotionally. That is why when we open up to going, and I do say to them, because we're going to bring bringing about loss now, Marcy, for Nikki to express for anybody that's listening that have judged this person that's been in there thinking, oh, you know, they feel an imposter syndrome, um, with their husband being in there because the lady's not married, etc. But this is a person that Nikki Clark has supported. It's always a first for everybody. You know, she's graced with beautiful looks, graced with a mind that is very knowledgeable, empowering, and for success, but also for everybody else. That has herself suffered a massive breakup, to then devote all her mind into her work and committing to this, what we're going to do. In my early 20s, pushing aside, you know, I'm just going to work, I'm going to get through this and don't think through that, that you did find love. That empty chair and going to the wedding, you found the love of a gentleman called Spencer, didn't you, Nic? Yes, I did. So about, um, after a year of being single and after Peter, I bought the house and I went on some great holidays, um, met met some amazing people. My friends were brilliant. I'm still best friends with my friends from high school, an amazing group, amazing support for me. And I met Spencer, and our first date was on Cannock Chase, and he had 4 vizslas. And I still have one of those vizslas today, Lorona. She's the light of my life. And, you know, I remember going home, standing in my kitchen, my mom and dad were there, and I said, oh, I think I've met the person I'm going to be with. And, you know, it's quite a strong statement to say on a first date. And we just had this amazing couple of years together. We were, you know, I was selling my house. It really wasn't the right location for me. It was in a village too far out, really. And I just thought it was the right time to sell it. I was going to move in with him and invest in some property and unfortunately became unwell. He had an ulcer in his mouth. Before we get into that bit, I need to break down a little bit from this. Rather than put you full speed on that. And obviously that's what's happening, as the listeners will see, and the council, the people listening, going full speed. You're in your Porsche, you just want to rush through this. And it's important that we slow things down, to put you on your bicycle and cycle through this, not Porsche it through, Nick, because first and foremost, that you met this guy that you knew instantly by the law of attraction that Spencer was the man of your dreams. That after pain and understanding what true love means, you knew what it was to have that impact, that emotional hit in your heart and in your mind, this is going to be right. So where did you meet Spencer? So we met, and thank you for slowing me down, actually. I have a habit of doing that. We met through a friend, and our first date was on Cannock Chase, which was basically a national forest which is near our house, with the 4 dogs. And I remember, I think what swung it for him is one of the dogs went to the toilet, and I just kind of got the poo bag and picked it up, and he was like, "Oh, okay, you're not like messing around." I looked like I'd fallen out of the Barber catalogue. I had my Barbour wellies on, my Barbour jacket, and Spencer was very country, but he was just, just this amazing man. His laugh, his smile. He was so much fun to be around. He'd light up a room. The dogs were amazing. That was a new, a new kind of life for me. We had chickens. We'd walk down to our local pub. We'd go on camping adventures. We'd go out for meals. We'd walk, we'd go on holidays together, and we just had this brilliant, brilliant life. And the dogs were a massive part of it, and I absolutely loved that because they were— Vizslas are like Velcro dogs, and they love a good cuddle. They love being part of your life, and I really loved that. Wonderful. And so when we're looking at that, you know, for the listeners seeing this very strong marketing career girl, very much into that more city girl than country girl, even though she— you tried the country house and selling it. Come on, to meeting this guy who actually walked you and taught you through that pain you went through, the power of love in the one, in the natural beauty that you held, and you could relax it, um, and live outdoors in, in the walks and it wasn't all about material, it was anything like— because for Spencer, you know, the time we had together, which we're breaking this down slowly to go through, not to leave any triggers, you know, from that, you know, to really work through this, because it is hard when we talk about these situations, and for this is unique, that you there, had gone through all this pain and breakup, was it, to find there was a reason outside of work. For all those people thinking she's just a workaholic, just a machine, just all this, everyone questioning you about how'd you get this, how'd you get that, you know, why would you have a watch like that, you know, who bought that watch. So this show is going to be for anyone that knows Nikki Clarke and wants to ask those three words This is the part that she has a human reactor. She's not made up of being a robot. She's somebody who has so much empathy and everything and had the world at her feet. Again, having suffered acute trauma and in the past with issues, as she's expressed, with depression, that then went on to issues with, um, the rejection and abandonment, the end of a relationship, which opens many, many avenues. Um, and then bring you back to the road to meeting this wonderful guy, knowing instantly he was there, that you enjoyed two hands together, that was imprinting your own footsteps in there. And as she was saying and by allowing the listeners to breathe, yourself to breathe, Nick, as we go through this next part. It's important that we keep this, you know, balanced, you know, because mental health is real. And if we shut down very quick and we don't shut down, it can affect us. So for the listeners, again, over this weekend, we're going to go into this next bit with Nikki. Why? You've had some time to go in there, that you had this wonderful relationship, you were going to move in with Spencer. Can you explain who Spencer was? What was his build like? What was, you know, his strengths? You know, obviously you had beautiful inner strength and mental strength and very empowered, but can you just say his physical, you know, and his appearance for people to look at? If he was— yeah, I mean, The best way I can describe him is he was just the most beautiful man inside and out. He actually looks a lot like Mark Wright, for those of you that know Towie, who's married to Michelle Keegan. But he just had this beautiful smile, a wicked sense of humour. He was short, and he actually adopted bodybuilding really early on in the '80s because he was about 10 years older than me, and he still kept that physique. Tanned, gorgeous dark hair. He was just I remember the first time I went to his house and he'd got this beautiful country mansion with chickens, so it was a really simple life but a really great one. And we had, you know, he had an agar and it was just lovely. And I remember pulling up to these gates thinking, where am I? Got lost. Everybody knows me, knows I have a dreadful sense of direction and I'm not the best driver in the world. Got lost and they nearly had to come and find me. And I swung into these gates and he was just standing at a big oak door, and this door lit up, and he had this lovely Ralph Lauren jumper on, and he looked like he'd fallen out of a magazine. And he really was— the only way I can describe him is the most beautiful man inside and out, and his laugh was amazing. And he loved the outdoors, he loved dogs, there wasn't anything he didn't know about Vizslas. He was very well regarded in the Vizsla community, grown up on a farm, he loved all things animals, he wanted to— he actually wanted to have some bees, and very knowledgeable. He'd had his own sign company, for over 20 years, was very well known in the local area, did lots of shop signs and vehicle livery, and he was just a great guy. Loved Bathams Bitter, so he loved his local pub, loved his football, loved being outdoors, doing anything active, but was always immaculately dressed, just looked brilliant, and very much a creature of habit and routine. And he definitely had OCD, which was hilarious because again, anyone that knows me knows I don't have OCD.. And I used to turn like the sort of, you know, the tins of beans in the cupboard around just to kind of see his reaction. But together we made a great pair. So yeah, that was just a bit about him. And you had the dream. Literally had the dream. And he really calmed me down because I think my life before that was quite hectic, traveling around all the time. And it was just such a really grounding life. You know, we'd walk the dogs together. We did lots of things together, which I really valued having come out of my previous relationship. Relationship where I basically did everything on my own. I really valued that and think, you know, it was quite simple things for me, going food shopping. I'd just not really done that with someone, going for a meal on a Saturday night, walking the dogs together, being part of a team and part of a unit. It was absolutely wonderful. It was a wonderful life and anything put in the AGA tastes amazing. And again, just sharing a bit about me, I just, I'm not a very good cook, so I could possibly quite get away with it in the AGA because it just tasted amazing. Wow. And so with this life and the life that you have, family, working, you have the balance, everything, the dream was there, um, but tragedy was about to hit this beautiful lady at the age of 33 in the fact that, um, this wonderful man who loved the freedom of the outside, his love for animals, love for everything, um, began to get quite weak without you noticing, wasn't it? At first, when you sold your house, if I believe, um, I was like, oh, but normally you'd expect this strong man to help and lift, and he's compassionate, couldn't lift his own tired neck. Can you take us through? And I know this is going to be painful, Nick, and for the listeners as we go through. Can you take us through this, only if you're able to? Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, I was selling my house at the time. It was the summer, and I just remember thinking— it was sort of August, I was packing up the boxes— and I remember thinking, because it was quite a busy time, quite a stressful time to be selling your house, as it is for everybody, and I just remember thinking, you know, it's a bit odd to that he hasn't offered to kind of come and help pack up boxes. And he kept saying to me, I don't feel well, Nick. I'm really tired all the time. And I said, well, you know, perhaps you're doing too much. You're 44 now. You're not getting any younger. You go to the gym 5 days a week. You're walking the dogs. You've got a busy job. We're full on at the weekends. You know, perhaps you need to just slow it down a bit. I mean, he always ate really well. He was like Bear Grylls. He was super healthy, super fit. And looking back, actually lost around half a stone in weight. But, you know, you see someone most of the week, you don't really notice. And then he started to develop an ulcer in his mouth in around September time. And again, you know, men aren't particularly great at going to the doctors, but I managed to say to him, you should really go to the doctors. And he went to see the doctor and they referred him to the oral hospital or oral clinic at the hospital. He never made that appointment. Moved on a couple of weeks till October, beginning of October, and I get a phone call. I'm sitting at work, and he said, "I'm in A&E." I was kind of like, "What do you mean you're in A&E?" 44-year-old men who drive pickup trucks do not drive themselves to A&E for no reason. He said, "I'm in so much pain." It was in Worcester Hospital. I'll never forget it. His best friend was there, and he mentioned bone marrow, that they'd taken bone marrow at the hospital. I was like, "This this isn't sounding great. I did think leukemia, and I walked into the hospital, and I'll never forget his best friend's face. And I went into a very small room with Spencer and a doctor, and, you know, it was leukemia. They started treatment that night, and it was just— it was like all hell was broken loose. You know, he then started chemotherapy. He was in a private room on his own with 24-hour care. It was just— you can't really compute it looking back. And made the decision to start chemotherapy. The doctors prepared us for the fact that he may end up in intensive care. And at the time, I kind of came around to the fact that that was quite normal. Looking back, it wasn't. So this was on the Monday, and by the following Monday, we were been moved to intensive care, and we were asked if we could put him in a coma because he'd had a very rare reaction to the chemotherapy. About 2% of people get this, and it had affected his lungs and his breathing. And I was with him. I was the last person to see him. He was really struggling to breathe. He was really scared. And I just remember sort of 7 people appearing in this room. The consultant wanted to put him under before he, he left on his shift, and it was a really scary time. And he just remember him saying, "I'm going to feel better. I'm going to go for a sleep." And I remember thinking, I don't think this is good, but I'm not going to tell you that because he was really scared, and I just wanted to be there to support him. And he was really struggling to breathe at this point. He had an oxygen hood on. And yeah, that was the Monday, and unfortunately, by the Saturday, he'd passed away. So 12 days from diagnosis. Wow. Yeah, it's a really, really tough time, and you don't expect it at 44 for someone so fit and healthy. There were definitely some things he shared in hospital that he hadn't shared with me before. He said he'd been sitting in the shower for 20 minutes at home. We have separate bathrooms. Again, I'm not mad on sharing bathrooms, and people who are close to me know that. And he'd been sitting sitting on the floor in the shower just to get the energy to get through the day. And I said, you know, why didn't you tell me? Why don't you tell me how you were feeling? I didn't realise how unwell you've been feeling because he hid it. I think he knew something wasn't right. I don't think you skip to, you know, I'm going to have leukaemia and pass away in 12 days. I don't think anyone quite skips to that. But I do think he knew that something wasn't quite right. And it was perhaps a little bit more serious than he would have wanted to have believed. And obviously, so traumatic at the age of 33 to have everything, all your life in your hands, happiness, and taken away, which obviously then leads you into a trauma situation where, you know, You needed the support of everybody around to help you through that, you know, and giving Spencer the send-off that he rightly deserved. But finding yourself alone again, wondering, you know, what could you do? But your dog became your savior. Yeah, she did. We had 4 dogs together, and his His brother supported us in having 2 of them, and his friend had one of them. And I managed to, through the support of my parents, keep one, Lorona, who was just literally my lifeline. I just went absolutely everywhere with her. I had about 6 weeks off work, and she just was my safety blanket. Still is to this day. I remember the other thing I haven't shared, actually, is obviously I was selling my house, as we've mentioned. And the money went in my bank on the Friday. I mean, at this point I didn't really care, and he passed away on a Saturday. So yeah, it was quite a difficult time. To be honest, I didn't really care about the house sale. I mean, when something like that happens, nothing else matters. But yeah, it was quite a lot of change to go through at one time. So yeah, Lorona came with me. My mum and dad helped me look after her. She still spends time with them in the week and I have her at the weekends when I'm working from home. It works really well. And I remember going into the bank to get a mortgage. I was looking to buy a new house and the bank said, oh, you can't come in here with that dog. And I just looked at them, standing with my mum at the time, and I said, well, you either want my mortgage or you don't. My mum was like, oh God. And I just knew that I just need to be with her. And I did actually have my mortgage with them. She sat quietly while I did the mortgage application. And she, yeah, she's brilliant. She's been a great great support to me, and I just couldn't imagine life without her. And I'm really grateful. He taught me many things about animals. I'd never had a big dog before. They now kind of call me the dog whisperer, but she definitely— they give you so much strength and support, and I'm so grateful for her in my life. Yes, because she was left vulnerable, and the love of the dog that has given that compassion and companionship that you had felt and the energy that you both shared in the power of the animal spirit and your own spirit together with that. Because you had sold your house to move in together for a life with Spencer, that, you know, on the Friday you— it sells. You now lose your partner who was, you know, going to be your life, your husband, your children different to become home. You had no home, lost everything within 24 hours. Yeah, and I'd sold, because we were moving together, I'd sold like quite a bit of stuff because I thought, you know, we don't need it. I kept some furniture that I liked, so it was like starting again really, but I found an amazing apartment in a listed building, which I have to say I loved living there for 12 months. It gave me some headspace, it meant that I was in a better position to buy a place, but there was no pressure. And I was really grateful for that time there. I absolutely loved it. And the dog could come and visit me. And it was just, it was just, it was a really, it was a sanctuary. It also wasn't something that I associated with Spencer. It was, it was part of, you know, moving forward. You know, I went on to purchase my house, which I've been really happy with. So, yeah, but yeah, it just looking back, I look back and I think, you know, I actually sometimes don't know how I got through that time. But through the love and support of some amazing friends and family, obviously the doctor, therapy, lots of things. And I remember I went back to netball and the gym before I went back to work. It was really important for me to, to keep fit and healthy, and that helped my anxiety. I had panic attacks. I had panic attacks at the gym, panic attacks at netball. And me being me, I just kind of said, oh, it'll be fine, I'll get on with it. But they were pretty scary. And I remember the doctor saying to me, you know, 'People don't recover like this. What are you doing?' And I just said, 'I'm just in my comfort zone. I'm with loved ones. If I don't feel comfortable going anywhere, I won't. I'm eating well. I'm exercising. I get why other people want to block it out. I totally get it.' But the resounding feeling I had is I lived and I will not waste a minute of this life. And that's, that's been my motto because it could have been me on that bed. And it wasn't. So I can't then go and abuse my body and my life because I know that Spencer would have wanted to have lived so desperately. So I would not— I could not honor him by, by doing that. I had to honor him by being the best version of me and living life to the full. And that's pretty much been my motto. I read an amazing book, one of the second books written by Sheryl Sandberg called Option B. She is the the sort of CEO of Facebook. She wrote the famous book Lean In, but she wrote this second book with a psychologist called Adam Grant because her husband died of a heart attack. And there was this line in there that said, Option A is not available, so we're just going to have to kick the hell out of Option B. And that, that really has been my motto. And that's not to say that my life after Spencer is, is, is less at all. I think I have to clear that up between A and B. It's just a different path and I just have to make the most of it. It, because I just won't waste a minute. No, well done, Nick. Well done for seeking the help, using the power of an animal around you, having, you know, a second hit, you know, pain. But the question is, if I was to say to you, okay, Nikki, here's a magic wand, but I will take you back and let you have him back, but you have to leave everything behind now. Would you do it? It's a really, really tough question, one I struggle with, because if it changed everything that happened afterwards and the lot, you know, it's kind of led me here today. I sit on the fence, I have to say, 50/50, because there are some days you ask me that and I absolutely would erase it all and have him back. And there were other days when I'm like, you know, it's definitely driven me forward, but I wish it was not at the cost of his life. So I'm going to have to remain impartial on that basis because I don't think I could call it either way. I just ultimately wish that he hadn't died. No, of course. And, you know, in a life is lost, in his love and legacy and in his name is is amazing, um, from that. But obviously, um, with the therapy and help going through and who you are, the life has changed for Nikki Clark, who has suffered more than some of us in knowing what true love means, what pain means, and to move forward. And also with the intelligence of moving forward as this executive, who we will hear in part 2 of her journey, how now, through all the adversity, is saying, "Siwakon, the fence fisher," has, may I say, a new partner, a wonderful guy that I've personally met, and has brought laughter back into your life. I've seen you smile, I've seen how you're going to walk on. And with this new company, amazing company, as getting now your dream job to lead other people. So for those people that come in there and see you, to make an impact. But the person that you are, which is truly honorable, you know, and with Regional Director of Global Women, empowering other women to join this club Global Club, Global Women Birmingham, where people come up and you're given that mic to free your mind in empowering, connecting, collaborating in a sisterhood of people that will support you, that are there for you. For Nikki, being the best version of herself is bringing the best version of herself herself to a new company, to a female CEO who will have empathic different ways of made herself to the top. But unifying in a leadership, whether male or female, is the importance that we all count, we're all worth something, we all have a voice, whether male or female. We still bleed, we have pain, we feel the So for— as I close the show down now and say thank you everybody for joining us on Free Your Mind, Let's Talk About It, Val KJ with Nikki Clark, I look forward to opening up with the empowerment of Nikki Clark in part 2. Thank you, Nikki. Thank you.