Future Classic Women Awards – Claire Oppert

Hello and welcome to future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte on women's radio station, the program where we search for the most amazing new female artist on the classical panorama today. This is the second episode in the lockdown and actually the third one. It's going so fast. So our special guest is cellist Claire Aupert from France. Hello, Claire. Hello. Hello. How is it going there in France? Where exactly are you in France? Well, at the moment I'm not in Paris. We left in the night after the announcement of the lockdown. All the family, we put all our luggage together during the night and we left for the country where we have got a country house in the woods. So I can't tell you that the situation is terrible, personally, because all the families together and we are actually in beautiful nature. But the situation is, of course terrible around the world. Yeah, absolutely. Well, how is it with the. I mean, the news that they come from France? We've been interviewing an artist in lockdown in Italy and another artist in lockdown, a couple last week here in the uk. How is it going with the, you know, the shopping and the everyday life? Everyday life is absolutely amazingly still. The roads are actually empty and the shops, almost all the shops are closed. I mean, like everywhere. But here in France, we go where I am actually in the middle of France, once a week in the shop, and there are little farms where we can go when we buy eggs. Well, that's so. It sounds very idyllic. Okay, well, you know, we don't know how long this lockdown is going on for, but what we know is that we can try to keep up the spirit with beautiful music. So that's what we're gonna do today. We're gonna listen to your fantastic project. You just published a book called Les Pensaments Chubert. But we're going to talk about that in the second part. First, we would like to talk about your new cd, your latest release, that is called Fire Light with your husband, Rustem Cykoloff. So how did this CD come in mind? How did you decide to record this new album? Well, we both studied in the Moscow and we met there and we started playing chamber music together. It was before the fall of the War of the Wall. So you can imagine when I arrived from Paris as a young cellist in Moscow at the conservatory, it was an amazing experience and it changed all my life. So I met my husband and there he's a fantastic pianist and we started playing together chamber music. It was in the 90s. Wow. And we've been playing together all this time and now playing with our daughter. One of our daughter is violinist. So we've got the trio, though. This CD is actually gathering some beautiful romantic sonatas from, well, romantic and late romantic from Strauss, Richard Strauss and Shostakovich. Yeah. And Schumann, of course, with all the passion, the light and the fire in this beautiful music. So we've been playing that for many, many years and we were very happy to be able to record it. Yes, absolutely. Now, how is it to work with your husband? I mean, how is it to, you know, to leave and actually to work at the same time? You know, you're not leaving work out of the doorstep when you come back home, for example. Well, I think that's the situation that many musicians. We're not going out to work. I mean, if we're not going to tour or to do concerts all around the world, we're just staying at home and practicing. So the life of the family and the life of the professional musician are very linked. And our children were brought up under the piano, always hearing music and sometimes sleeping in the cello case and so on. Oh, really? Oh, that's so cute. Very sweet. Yeah. And. Well, the first. The first piece we're gonna listen to is Schumann. It's from the Dry fantasies, cheek up 73. What is interesting of that piece, we're gonna listen to the last movement, quick and with fire. And that is was WR in lockdown, actually, when there was this insurrection in Germany against the Republican insurrection against the Saxon king. So somehow it goes very well with our situation right now. Do you hear. I mean, you are in the countryside, so do you hear music in a different way now that you are in lockdown and you know that you cannot go, for example, to play music outside? Well, I wouldn't say I hear it personally in a different way, but there are other means to give it to people. So it means, for example, I'm going to talk about my work also in the hospital. That's the second part. I know, but I just wanted to say I'm playing and I'm actually recording videos for the people and sending actually music through these means. Two days ago, for example, I did an amazing thing for me, it was a studio edition of my class of young cellists. All around the world, I've got pupils and students in Moscow and St. Petersburg, in Zurich and in Paris, and they all played a concert in a Zoom studio. So it was so amazing. So the mean of giving music is very different. But I don't think I'm Listening to music in a different way. Because for me, music has always this power of transformation. And actually, no matter in which way you give it, the main thing is what you give, not the canal. Absolutely. All right, then let's listen to Schumann, the dry, fantasistic upper 73 third fantasy cheek with Claro Perdicello and Rustem Sedglov at the piano. Ram. Wow. And this was Schumann, dry, fantasistic couple 73, number three, with Clara Pere at the cello and Rustem Seitkuloff at the piano. Claire, that was an amazing piece, full of passion, full of fire. Kind of remind me the fire and the passion that we will have as soon as this lockdown is finished and we are able to go out and walk again and meet with everybody and have a big party. Now, I would like now to talk about Les Pens Chubert. It's a book you just published and with great success in France. So it's in French, the book right now, right? Yes, but it will be soon translated in English and actually in other languages. Perfect. We're really looking forward. This is a very important book. Would you like to tell the audience what the book is about? Yes, of course. Well, this Passement Schubert, which can be translated into Schubert Dressing or Schubert Treatment, actually tells my story, my life story, and over 20 years of meeting with different people suffering with pain or with dementia or autistics or end of life patients. It means that I'm talking about the music when it goes out of the concert halls and meet people in the hospitals, but also in nursing homes and in palliative care units. That's one part of my life. And this book explains first all the different sides of this way of thinking that music transforms. Music reduces pain, anxiety. Music has this tremendous power of connecting people and actually giving hope. So it's the theme, actually of my book. And Schubert Dressing. The title comes from a very amazing moment when I was working as a music therapist cellist in a nursing home. There was an old demented lady suffered from dementia. She was very aggressive. She was biting and insulting all the nurses that were trying to do her dressing because her arm was very wounded and there was no way of calming her. And I was there. And suddenly and spontaneously, actually I sat down and played for her the theme of the slow movement of Schubert Trio Number two, Opus Hundred. And the effect was amazing. At that moment she stopped shouting, she stopped biting and insulting everybody. She just calmed down, gave her arm to the nurses and the dressing was done in a few minutes. And one of the nurse who was There told me, you should come back for the Schubert dressing. And that was the beginning of this amazing experience. Because after that spontaneous counter stimulation, it's really, I mean, neuroscience, they would call that counter stimulation. It means the stimulation of the pain is stopped by another stimulation of the pleasure of music through the nervous influx. And that was the beginning of a study, a real clinical study that I did with doctors and all the palliative care units in France, showing and proving that the presence of music, live music, my cello in the bedrooms of the patients, while very painful procedures were done, could really diminish pain and anxiety a lot. Our results showed that it could diminish from till 50% of the pace when the music was playing and singing in the room. That's incredible. That's a fantastic story. I mean, it gives you a completely new dimension to your role as a musician, isn't it? The fact is that you can perform in a concert hall. We already can feel the energy when we're performing in the concert hall. The connection that there is between us as performer and the audience listening to you. But when you are one to one, the power, it's amplified to a million in a way, yes, that's for sure. But it's not only the fact of being one to one. I think it's a certain intention of transforming the power of music into a healing power. Actually, music, I mean, it's nothing new. The ancients knew about the powers of music. Aristotle, Plato, they wrote a lot. And even before, only the harp of David would calm down the nervous crisis of Saul the King in the Bible. So it's nothing new. But what's new is the way of using it and the methods and also the fact that music can enter in the faculties of medicine in the hospitals and be a real help as a non pharmacologic approach. Helping. Of course, it will not replace morphine. Very often I say that it's not like something would put away all the medication. Of course not. It's a compliment. It's something that helps and that transforms not only the patient's pain or anxiety, but also all the nurses, they felt better in the way they would do the dressings and all the different cares. And also actually the families of the people that saw actually this amazing joy, transformation, relief through the presence of music. So that's very important for me. Now you're gonna record this Schubert trio with your husband. Is that due to your experience, you know, with the patient being in the room and the power that this specific piece of music, for example, was transmitted to the. To the. To the audience, to the person that was listening to you, does that will make you. To perform this to you in a different way? Does this give you a different type of tool of expressing the meaning of the music, or you will be always performing Schubert, thinking of Schubert and not about this incredible, unique experience? You know, for me, there is no frontier, no barrier between. No difference, I would say, between playing music and actually this kind of thought I have, which is not my personal thought. When I was young, when I gave my first concert, I was 14. And I remember there was one lady coming after the concert. I don't remember the way she looked, but I remember she had a strange hat on her head, actually hiding the fact that she lost all her hair. She suffered from cancer and she was very pale and. And she told me this very amazing sentence, which I never forgot. She told me, if you would have been a doctor, you would have healed me. And actually, I realized at that moment, even, of course, I wouldn't have helped her directly in her cancer. But I understood and I felt very deeply that actually music could heal, could take care, and that actually I had the intuition that it would be my way of playing. So for me, it's so natural, actually, to play for everybody. I even played in prisons and in all kinds of different situations. For me, it's something very natural. And actually I couldn't imagine to do it differently. And so when I play on the stage, I can't say that it's different for me, because I did everything. It's a whole, you know, it's a certain way of looking at music. Like really a healing power and a transforming strength, which is very, very important, I think, in our world. Wonderful. Then let's listen to an extract of the second movement of the trio by Schubert, Opus 100 with David Oistrack at the viol and Sviatoslav Kousseviski. Ram. And this was schubert trio number two in E flat major, opus 100 with David Oistrack at the violin Lev Oberyn and Ziatoslav Knudiewitzki. Claire. That was. I mean, it's one of my favorite pieces, actually. Do you have a favorite piece to perform when you think about Le Pensamon Schubert Quindy, not necessarily Schubert fa. I think about other composers as well. Or this is the one that is having the most of effect on your audience. Well, Schubert is a beautiful music for the end of life people and for everybody. Actually, not end of life, but my big discover in this work was that actually it's not the question of repertoire. And of course I love romantic music and also I play Bach a lot. But the main thing I discovered is that every music, all music can be suitable, can have a positive effect. And then I discovered jazz and rock and pop music, and even I played metal, really. So that was the most amazing thing for me. I've studied in Moscow in a very strict way, where almost everything was forbidden except the true way of playing. And actually my world opened and I discovered that what was important to me, at least in my work and in my way, it's to meet the heart, the soul of the patient. And it's a deep, living, inherently human part that is connected. And sometimes it can be Schubert, Bach, Mozart, but it can be also other music. And that was maybe the main thing I discovered after my very strict studies in Moscow. Now I would like to ask you. Yes. So how did you decide to go to study Moscow? Why did you leave Paris to go to, I know, Moscow Russian School. It's incredible. It's. I'm very passionate of the Russian culture in general, the literature, the composers, of course. What was your motivation to go there? Well, I was absolutely. I fell in love with Ross Popovich, even if I didn't, I met him just once, but I always dreamt actually to go there. I had the feeling it was a mixture between all the romantic side of the Russian soul that I read through books, and also the fact that I had like, intuition that here was actually my school and my conservatory, because of the way of the attitude towards the technique. And now I'm actually teaching a lot myself. And I understand that what I received, despite all the difficult times and all the tyrannic way of actually giving all the advices that the teacher had there in Moscow at that time, there is no actually difference or the process of music and technique is actually a whole. And that's maybe the main thing I understood. It means what do you want to express? And the direct question which comes in the same time is how, which path are you to choose? How are you going to express it with your hands, with your bow, with the place of your bow on the string, with the pressure, with the vibrato. And actually this way of teaching, where the technical way of doing is totally connected with the wish of the desire of expression, was actually my ideal. So therefore I think I was attracted to Moscow. Did your. You said your daughter plays the violin. Did she go to study in Moscow or she's studying in Paris? Well, she studied in Paris, actually. She was admitted at the Conservatory, Very, very young because she entered in the Paris Conseilatoire at the age of 14 and then she went to Germany and now she's about to go to the States. But actually she had always Russian teachers. Even in Paris she didn't go there, but she the Russian School of Violin for sure. Now, what would you say was the most exciting moment in your career? Well, there are many, it's difficult to say actually it's very interesting because my career, of course as a professional musicians playing on the stage was actually renewed by the thing I'm doing actually side of this stage of the concert hall. And so I had fantastic experiences. Actually my most fantastic experiences were always connected with people that were not in the concert hall. That's very strange to say that. But for example, my most amazing artistic experience was when I played with people with dementia and we did a fantastic concert which was like total art because they were dancing, I was playing, they were singing, I was singing, they were reciting poetry. And actually all people, they had no remembrance of their own daughter that they were the most fantastic musicians I never met. So you see, that's maybe the most amazing thing I experienced in my musician life. It's a beautiful experience. Now what would you say was the most challenging moment in your career? Well, there are many also. But I remember quite funny thing that happened to me when I was supposed to play with my husband Roost inside Kuda in Germany, in munching in the whole program. And at that very, at that moment he got the first prize in the Rome competition. It was all more than almost 30 years ago. And he called me and said, and I got the first prize and I had to stay to play the concert in Rome. So I had few hours to find another pianist. Oh my God. It was absolutely amazing because I called my friend Boris Berezovsky and his wife told me, oh, he's right now in Berlin, so maybe you can catch him. And that time there was no cell phone. So I called the airport and they did a public announcement. Boris Berzovsky is called. Oh my gosh. And he heard that he was about to take the plane to London and then he came and I told him, can you come right now for the concert in Munich and say yes? And then he changed his flight and arrived. And that was the most amazing moment because Boris Berezovsky is a wonderful pianist. Fantastic. I know him. Yeah. I mean, I don't know him personally, but I know he's a superstar. Yeah. And then we practice. But I want to say how big why challenging? It was because he played Prokofje Sonata with four movements. And after the third one. Oh, my gosh. After the third one, when we were practicing, he said, all right, let's go and have a walk. What? We didn't look at the fourth movement. He said, oh, it will be all right. I must say, he never played that movement. So we went to have a walk and we came back. So we played the Prokofiev sonata without having rehearsed actually the fourth movement. And it was a big success. And the people said, how long have you been practicing together? It's amazing, this ensemble. So that was the most challenging, I think, concert in my life. That's a crazy story. Also, I mean. I mean, sight reading. How do you do sight reading of Perkof Sonata? That's impossible. I hope you did play that sonata before. It's not sight reading for me, but it would. No, no, I know. For him. Yeah. All right. Now, in general, what would say are the pro and cons of your career as a woman musician? Well, if there is any, of course. Sometimes being a. Yeah, well, I don't know, because, you know, playing with my husband means we very. I mean, we're not playing all the time together and sometimes we have other plans, but it's a certain way of staying together. So when you. And even now with our daughter who's playing with us, sometimes we have the feeling of being separated because we are together. And it's no matter if we are in South Africa or wherever, because we are together. So that's the main thing. So it's more like a good side of playing together. And actually I do not see any bad sides because we just feel happy in this way. One question. Do you ever have differences, musically speaking, artistically speaking, with your husband? You know, you're both a musician. And sometimes when I do play, I don't play often chamber music. But when that happened, it might be that maybe I disagree in a way of understanding a passage. For example, does that happen and does that makes faction or you're actually somehow in the same tune even when you're playing all the time? Well, I think it's not easy. It would be light to say that there's no conflicts, but I think there's always somebody leading in a duo, and that's for sure, Rustem is the one. But in the end, when we play concert, I do whatever I want. That's. Maybe I should say that. I'm not hearing me. I hope not. But anyway, of course, we have different approach. He has an incredible understanding of musical basis. And his approach of music is very. With much consciousness and understanding deeply with a harmony. And I'm more actually in the feeling, in the communication. So we both have actually like in the Greek ancient wisdom where there was Apollo and Dionysus. I would say we've got actually these both like the light and the understanding of Apollo, the God of music, beauty and actually by the way, medicine. And Dionysus is more the God of instinct, intuition and. Yeah. So maybe both of us playing together, it makes an interesting mixture. And even if it's not easy, I think it's highly interesting now. Exactly. That's my next question. I mean, what was your most interesting collaboration apart from your husband? I would say, you know, my most interesting collaboration are always linked with other. Not musicians, but other people. And I love actually these crossings of arts. Like, I did an incredible thing when I was in Montreal. I played actually with a Canadian circus called Licette Doit de la Main, the seven fingers of the hand, Very well known in Canada, in Montreal. And I did improvisation and they did acrobatics. And it was so fantastic. And I was myself in the hall. Four dancers and circus players took me and threw me on the stage. And I started playing while people were doing incredible acrobatics above my head. So that was one of the most fantastic. And lately for a few months, I did something incredible also. Who was a collaboration with hip hop dancers. Okay. And it was a choreography. Cello solo. I was sitting in the middle and around me there were four beautiful, fantastic hip hop dancers. And they were actually. It was not only improvisation. I played bachelor and I played Schubert and I played Rachmaninoff and Sackovich. And they were dancing around me. And that was so amazing because the world, our worlds were different. But the inspiration, we found ourselves in a tremendous way. And it was for the public, very, very impactful, I think. Wow. Now the next piece we're gonna listen to is Shostakovich, the cello Sonata, Opus 40. It's an incredible sonata. It was writt. Lockdown, if you like, with him as well. He just left the city, Moscow, and he went to the countryside in a temporary separation from his wife because he. I don't know if he had an affair or was rumor of an affair with a student during the opera that he was a festival where his opera was performed, Lady Mahbet. And he was also under scrutiny of the government, the Soviet government. So it's a very intense, intense sonata full of meanings. Do you have any special view on this sonata that you know, we're gonna listen to in a moment. Well, I think it's actually the. The piece I played the most in my whole life. Okay. Sonata, actually, it's very amazing. It has a tremendous power. It's sarcastic. It's the image of the Soviet life and also the kind of distance that Stakovich. I mean, we never know what was the real position. Of course, Shostakovich is considered as a Soviet composer and he suffered himself a lot from the Soviet regime. Regime. So in this music there's also. There's always something which is actually difficult to catch between sarcastic and actually freedom. Freedom and non freedom, which are in this mechanical desperation and also a kind of sarcastic smile at the same time. Very amazing. Let's listen then. Shostakovich Cello. Sonata in D minor, the second movement, Allegro. So fun. I love this sonata. And just Akovic in general, he's such a wonderful composer, honestly. I mean, the way he treats the cello, the way he treats the piano. I forgot to ask you, Claire. Did you, since you were a little child, wanted to become. Did you know you wanted to become a cellist or how did it happen? I played the piano like a little girl in families. And one day I heard a concert. It was a small conc. From a friend of ours, my parents. And I just fell immediately in love with the sound of the cello. And I decided right away to play the cello. But I was always hesitating till. Well, actually quite late, maybe 17 or years old, between music and medicine. I was practicing a lot, actually, my cello, many hours every day. But I was thinking maybe I will be a doctor. And actually, in a certain way, what I am doing now with patients and the music is a certain way of putting together these two worlds which are actually my life. Music and the desire to take care. That's incredible. Of course, I'm not a doctor, but I'm still like caregiver, actually, because really working with the care and the nurses. So that was my hesitation. And actually in a certain way, I found my place. Your way back? Yeah. Incredible. Incredible. Now it's time for the odd questions. I'd like to ask if you have any strange hobby to free your mind or relax. Well, I wouldn't say nothing's really strange. Well, actually I love to do, for example, the Tibetan exercises. That's a wonderful thing I found many years ago, which is freeing mind and body and giving a lot of energy. But it's not odd, I would say, and that's not strange. I love to read poems. I love actually to enjoy time with my family, to drink a glass of wine with my husband. Very simple things. It's nothing strange. No, absolutely no. Nothing. And do you have any superstition before going on stage? You know, I always, always think about David Oustra, who actually was. Each time he had to go on the stage, he was. At first, the big hole of the conservatory in Moscow would burn. He was hoping, he was praying that the hole would burn and he would then not go to the concert. Because really. Oh my gosh, the other thing, the other question, and that's actually my question at each concert, why am I not working at the post office? You know, Oysteracht was really thinking, why am I not working at the post office? Means why do I have to go on the stage? It's so terrible. And actually that's the question each time. Why am I in this horrible situation? But of course, when you go on the stage and you start playing goes different. But why I'm not having a post office place. Very calm and no problem. Actually, maybe it's not the case. No, no, but it's true. But somehow it is like a call, isn't it? It's a call to the stage. There is not much you can do about it. It's part of our life as a musician, I mean, I suppose that could be. You could choose just to dedicate yourself to teach, for example, or to doing the music therapy. But somehow the concert hall at the stage is something that is like calling you, isn't it? And you can't refuse it. Yes, it's calling you. And it's actually also a way of keeping you the best you can in this Excellency, because you can't do it twice. Actually, it's the same demanding thing when you play for ill people. I don't think you must be less good when you're doing things in hospital. I think, on the contrary, it has to be the same quality and even maybe sometimes better. Because, you know, when I play for people, they ask me sometimes such odd things. For example, I remember for a few months there was a woman asking me in the hospital, can you please play this piece? But as slow as you can, not in the right tempo, as slow as you can, and as piano as you can. And can you imagine if you hadn't got skills to do that? I mean, technique. Because she wanted to have an experience and of herself, and she had the feeling it was the only way of doing it through slow and piano. That's such a strange. Which is very interesting. So that's also cool. And Actually being on the stage prepares you in a certain way respond to such things. Absolutely. Now, what would you say was the funniest or most embarrassing moment in your career? There are many, if I think maybe I would say. Once I was in Russia for a concert with my quartet. I played nine years Helios Quartet. It was flute and to constrict trio. And we had a tour in Russia and it was in a town in Nizhny Novgorod and we played there. And the four first rose of this. Of the hall were with all the French delegation and. And I we were playing and actually at the end when we were doing a reading, I mean salutation to the public, I understood that I had lost my underskirt. What? How so that was very embarrassing. And I couldn't move because I thought if I move, it's going to fall on the floor. And so I didn't move. And then the altist, my very good friend, said, but what is happening? I said, I lost my underskirt. I lost my. And then the quartet was greeting the public for a very long time because I didn't know how to lead the stage. But then suddenly I decided to go. And then it fell on the floor. It was like. Very funny. Yeah. Because as a cellist you're also holding the cello and the bow, so you don't have enough hands. Really. I couldn't. It was very, very funny. Now, what is your next project or recording or concert? Well, you know, as I wrote my book and that was the big deal of being. Becoming a writer because it's a literature exercise. It's not like only telling what I did, but it was also connected with the poetry. Now this book is going to be performed in the theater. So I am invited to play all the music I'm talking about in the book with an actor playing actually my book, the Schubert treatment, Schubert dressing. She's gonna read the book. Which is gonna do exactly? Well, I don't know because the project now being just started. But she. The. This. She doesn't want to do much things. She just. She thinks that the text is enough to be just recited. Yeah. So it's going to be a fantastic collaboration between poetry, literature and cello. And I'm going to play myself. I have other things. The Schubert CD I want to do also because of my book and all the different pieces I play in the hospital for the patients are going to be recorded. Even if I am very convinced that the fact that I'm playing live makes a big difference because the vibration of the cello goes deep into the bodies of the people and transforms actually for a moment, this body of sufferings into a body of emotions and sensations. But still, a CD is a wonderful thing to be done and I'm actually now preparing it also with my husband and daughter. That's gonna be fun. We call the schubertvio. Well, we can't wait to read your book in English and maybe to be able even to see your theater performance. That's gonna be superb. Well, let's finish our interview with the last movement that is also the last piece of your recent release of Shostakovich Cello Sonata Apus 40, the Allegro, the fourth movement, it. Fantastic. And this was Shostakovich the last movement of the Cello Sonata in D Minor with Claire Au Pair and Rustin Cycloloft from their latest album Fire Light with Master Core Records. If you have any questions that you would like to our guests or nomination for our Future Classic Women awards, please email presentersomensradiostation.com or tweet us womensradiostn thanks to our guest cellist Claire Aupert for the great chat and the beautiful music play today. Thank you for invitation. It was wonderful to talk to you. Well, thank you for your wonderful job and the wonderful music that you are spreading around the world with your Pensemon Chubert. You've been listening to Future Classic Women Awards on women's radio station live every day at 10am and 10pm London time. If you want to listen to it again or catch up on our previous programs, you can head to the presenters page. Stefania Pasamonte Future Classic Women Awards on womensregiostation.com thank you for listening.