Future Classic Women Awards – Nadine Benjamine, Winner For Opera 5th Edition 231023

Hello and welcome to Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte, on Women's Radio Station. The program where we search for the most amazing new female artists on the classical panorama. Today I'm very excited to reveal the winner of the opera section of Future Classic Women Awards 5th edition. But before I tell you who she is, I would like to listen to her first piece of today's interview and let you guess who she might be. Soll mein Sehn' Jesus, der dann in Freuden sich erhebst in der Nacht wie ein mühendes Kind. And the winner of Future Classic Women Awards Opera section is Nadine Benjamin. Hello, Nadine. Oh my goodness, that's amazing. I love it. Thank you so much. Oh wow, I don't know what to say really. Oh gosh, you're very welcome. Very well deserved. All the nominees were incredible, and of course the finalists as well, uh, but you won, you know, by a wonderful language. And the piece that we just heard was from your winning interview. That was Strauss, the third last song, um, Beim Schlafengehen, that you recorded with London City Orchestra and conducted by Thomas Payne. Um, Nadine, so tell us a little bit, where were you when I gave you the news? Oh my gosh. Um, well, I'm currently in Berlin at the moment doing, a show all about 100 female composers. Um, it's with FMK Productions, and the director is Teresa Haiba. And, um, I'm working with some wonderful artists and actors, and it's just really amazing to see how many women composers there actually are and just how their work could be performed more. And also, there are so much stories behind those women. Absolutely. Well, you know, I still remember when I first started this program, Future Classic Women Awards, I was interviewing one of my very first guests and she told me that they proposed that to a major TV broadcast. I'm not going to mention which one. A program dedicated to women composers and women in music. And they said that there was not enough material. Oh my goodness. I cannot believe that. Yes, that was the answer. Yeah. And then we had the amazing organization Donne UK. They were some of my very first guests. Yeah. Telling us, you know, how they found by chance, you know, sometimes it's destiny, this encyclopedia written years ago about women composers. And they started setting up this organization and now they are super successful with concerts at Royal Albert Hall. Yes, exactly. I mean, I think they've done really great work. I've been a part of them as well. And also I'm a composer as well. And I, I forget that I'm a composer. And, you know, one of my works is being, is being performed in this opera. But it's also, I'm seeing my work being performed at different festivals by different— I mean, I think Danae Eleni is performing one as we speak in a festival. So it's just really interesting that I think that a lot of women who compose sometimes don't claim their right as composers. And I have been guilty of that myself. So sometimes we're not seen because we don't see ourselves also. Absolutely. Well, I think, I don't know, it's been with history, really something that has gone on for too many centuries. And I'm so glad to be honest that we're living in this century. Yes. Despite everything that is happening in the world that, I don't know, make you question, you know, why are we here? But you know, when you then enter the magic world of music and the beauty and then a community now of women musicians, women composers, it makes you hope. For the future, isn't it? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I'm singing a wonderful piece by Odalina de la Martinez, um, from her cycle, um, around Sylvia Plath, and it's Comeback. And, you know, and, and it just really shows me that our emotions also can be lived through our work. We just need to celebrate as many women composers as we can do and keep programming and making it visible. Because it's the visibility that makes all the difference. And like you, I'm so glad I'm living now because I also, as a woman, you as a woman, get to also help towards making a difference in that. Absolutely. I think it really comes first of all from us. You know, there are some people that complain and they don't do any action. You are an action lady. Yes. You are making this world a better world. So thank you very much, Nadine. Oh no, thank you. I'm, I would just to you before we started this interview that I really love your work. I love that, you know, you have, you have expanded, um, the thinking around music. You've, you've built this whole conservatoire. I don't know if you'd call it a conservatoire, but just a hub. Yes, it is. Yeah, yeah, a conservatoire, a place where people can come and learn and develop. I mean, that takes huge courage to do something like that, and the faculty that you've been able to get on that, I think, is just Amazing. The work that you do with the awards that you do, and it's just, you're just phenomenal, Stefania. So thank you. I'm going to receive because I, because I know the woman that is giving me that compliment is just as courageous. I'm going to receive it with love. Thank you so much. Ah, Nadine. Nadine, you're too sweet. Now, you know, you are doing so much. You've been going up and down. You're in Berlin right now and you're doing this incredible show. Um, and we're gonna hear so so much, and we're gonna talk about it. Um, but the first piece we're gonna listen to is Black Cake by, um, Sylvia Glickman. Um, you're performing these with the pianist Nicole Panizza, and it's with the words of Emily Dickinson. Would you like to tell us a little bit about this piece? Well, it's interesting because I can link it to Berlin as well. We're currently doing it in this show as well. Um, and, and, um, it's— and the way that we've used it in this— the show's called Waiting for Gertrude. And, um, the way that we've used it in this show, show, is to show the domesticity of women, you know, and how the work has to be done before they can actually do their own work, what they love. Oh yeah, which is the composing. Like, so there's that kind of societal domesticity, how you fit into a box and you, you can't come out of it, and you have to perform your role in exactly in this way. And I think the way that Sylvia Glickman, you know, she started a whole publishing company just for women, you know. And, you know, so she's really interesting as a writer herself. So the way that she's done this as a recipe with Emily Dickinson, Emily Dickinson's words, really, I think, illustrates that. Now, a question about Emily Dickinson. Do you like her works? Who doesn't? I do. I mean, for me, her work you know, her words only came to me through the, um, 12 Songs of Emily Dickinson by Aaron Copland. That was where I first met her work. And then, you know, Nicole Panizza, who's actually playing, is, um, a great advocate of Emily Dickinson. She's actually a scholar of it. So it was wonderful to work with her on the album. This comes from the album Emergence, um, and it's all of Emily Dickinson's words done by different composers. Um, uh, and, and, and so it— her words for me just— I found a way to let them light up in my heart and tell stories of, um, people's emotions and the everyday life of living. Beautiful. Let's listen to Black Cake by Sylvia Glickman with the words of Emily Dickinson, sung by our winner of 5th edition of Future Classic Women Awards, Nadine Benjamin. Black cake. Black cake. Two pounds of flour, two pounds of sugar, two pounds of butter, 19 eggs. 19. 5 pounds of raisins, 1 and a quarter pounds of currants, 1 and a quarter pounds of citron, 19. Tinix. Nineteen. One whole pint of brandy. One half pint more, Lizzy! 2 teaspoons nutmeg, 5 teaspoons cloves, mace, and cinnamon. 2 teaspoons nutmeg, 5 teaspoons cloves, mace, and cinnamon. Cinnamon, cinnamon, cinnamon. 2 teaspoons soda. Blend sugar and butter. Blend sugar and butter. Good eggs. Add eggs. Blend dry ingredients, dry ingredients, dry ingredients, dry ingredients, and mix all together. Mix all together. Bake at 250 for 5 to 6 hours. Bake at 250 for 5 to 6 hours. Bake at 250 for 5 to 6 hours. Hello, Milk Pond! Eat immediately, oh, set aside for a manto tu, manto tu, oh, three. Oh, Brandy, on it once awake. Brandy, on it once awake. Awake and tell me thee to leave. Eat. And this was Black Cake, sung by Nadine Benjamin with Nicole Panizza at the piano. Music by Sylvia Glickman and words by Emily Dickinson. Now, you know, we've talked so much about women composers, women in music, but that doesn't mean you love less Verdi, for example. Oh, I love Verdi! Oh my gosh, it's my favorite! It is my favorite too, you know. There is not one opera that I don't like, that I don't love, and you've done so many. We're gonna listen to a couple of beautiful arias, some of my super very favorite ones. But do you have A favorite opera? Oh, I would find that very difficult to say I have a favorite opera, but I have wonderful favorite moments. You know, the prayer, for instance, in Otello, where Desdemona is praying. I mean, I just think that's just an angelic moment. At Traviata, oh my gosh, when she does that 'sempre libera' You know, it's just like— and she sings of this joy even though she's suffering with illness. You know, it's— I just find those— the complexity of his characters, they're, they're singing one thing but they're feeling another. And I think they just recognize people and humanity. I think he's definitely a composer of the people and feelings, no matter which century we go through, are always the same. We all feel love, joy, hurt, pain, you know, betrayal. And I think he really does all of this so well. You know, I was watching Rigoletto at Royal Opera House. Was it this summer? Recently, last year, I think. And I remember watching it with a different eye, you know, being now a mother and watching poor Rigoletto having his daughter being raped and, you know, trying to vindicate her and then having her her dying. Spoiling alert, if you've never seen Rigoletto, go see it. But the music, the quartet that comes in, there is this very strong feeling that tragedies of everyday life, unfortunately, you can read it in the news, etc. So actually, they don't change. And he has this power of reaching you through these incredible harmonies. And I remember when I was studying it that there was this huge rivalry. He didn't feel it, but he kind of thought he wasn't a serious composer like Wagner because his music was too popular, because it was touching too much popular subjects. What do you think about this? I think— I mean, Wagner is fantastic. I don't say no, I love Wagner, but And why do you think there is this concept that if you are popular, you're not serious enough? I think that's a really challenging thing to think about. I think, you know, music is a universal language. And no matter how it turns up in somebody's home or in somebody's car or what you go and watch in the theater, it's about taste. It's about what people love. It's about being able to be a universal language. And in every, just like in our speaking language, we have different languages and different people understand it in different ways. And I think we need that for music also. The other thing is, is, you know, he compared himself to Wagner, but Wagner was writing in German and he was in— Verdi was writing in Italian. Culturally, they have a different way of landing with people. There is no comparison. There just isn't. So, so, so I think, I, I think, you know, you're talking about what I feel you're talking about is, you know, when people compare themselves as artists. And I think this is a really dangerous place to be, you know. Um, I'm, I'm in 12-step recovery, and so we always say compare and despair, you know. So the moment you're comparing yourself to somebody else, you're taking your eye off your gift. That you're here to do your gift. There is only one person that can do you, and that is you. No one else has the same DNA. No one else has the same soul. You are unique. The message that you have been given by universe to deliver is yours and yours only. And the message, we need to hear it so we can identify with it. We need different ways of identifying because not everybody hears it in the same way. So I think there is no comparison. I just think I love his music. I just find him a composer of the people, and I believe I'm a singer of the people as well. So the dynamic of how I meet his music just really opens me up. And I think then the audience recognize that as well. And, you know, and when we talk about tradition or traditional music, I believe, you know, one of the reasons why I started Everybody Can, which is started as an opera company basically, um, but it's, but it's, but it's, um, it was, its main purpose was to do traditional opera but through the lens of today's challenges and issues and opportunities so we could actually be able to identify with that traditional music. Because as I said earlier, the the, um, the, the feelings are the same, you know. But this has now developed into a mentoring company, a concert series, and recently now we're just about to do the development awards as well, um, the Everybody Can, the Robert Presley Development Awards as well. So Everybody Can, you know, it's inspired for me through Verdi because I just feel that He was also someone who, um, got into, uh, standing up for what he believed in. And for me, I believe in Everybody Can. Um, the age group that I believe in is the age group between 35 to 65. Um, and I just feel inspired to serve this community and to provide a space. And I feel like they're the forgotten age group because no, I feel like not enough people are working with that age group. This is where we transition. This This is where we make new avenues. This is where we wake up in some way, you know. Absolutely. And we take charge of our own selves. So yeah, I'm really excited actually by tradition, but I'm also excited about meeting new works as well at the same time. Well, with these words, why don't we listen to "Visi d'arte," "I lived for the art," sung by Oscar in Verdi by the wonderful Nadine Benjamin. And this was "Visite d'Arte" by Verdi from the opera Tosca, sung by Tosca, and in this case by our wonderful Tosca that is Nadine Benjamin. Nadine, I have a million questions I don't think we have enough time, but one of these is because, you know, I had the wonderful, you know, privilege to go to the Gramophone Awards. And I've been sitting with a person that I've known from before that is Black Lives in Music. And, you know, we were talking about representation, the access as well to education. How was your introduction to opera? And in particular visse d'arte, you know, when you think about visse d'arte, I don't know you, but me, I think first of all to Maria Callas. Yes. Was that something that would stop you from wanting to do it because Maria Callas wasn't like you, if you like? No. This is a radio program. Some people, they should know that, you know, how you look like, go and search Nadine Benjamin. She's a wonderful, wonderful singer. Um, but there you go. Sorry if I ask you this, but this is very much, you know, a contemporary, um, subject. And when we talk about everybody can, it's about age, but it's also about, you know, coming from different cultures, not necessarily, you know, the color of your skin, but as well your background, you know, being from a privileged background, from a musical family or not, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, well, you know, you know, I won't go into the long story of my, of my thing, but I do believe that there wasn't enough access for me to start. But I was very fortunate in that my mother had put me into a YTS scheme when I was 16, you know, um, where I was, I was put in a place where, you know, I had to learn the, the skills of being in a corporate space. Now, because I had those skills, you know, when I woke up to the idea that I really wish to sing opera, I could transport those skills into making that a route for me. Not in the musical sense, but in the organization and planning of how I would get there. You know, so that for me, so I wrote a business plan about how I would become an opera singer. Amazing. Yeah. And so that was the tool I could use. And then that way I asked for some support and I wrote over 150 letters and some people wrote me back, some people didn't, but one woman came and stood by my side and said, I will support you for a few years. You know, and, you know, and just pay for your lessons because I can see that, wow, you're not getting into any conservatoire and I can see that you really mean what you say and I'm so grateful for that, you know, I really, really, really am grateful for that. Um, and I think one of the reasons why I started Everybody Can was because I really believe in mentorship. And when I started, there was no one there either to mentor because I was 35 and everybody thinks that you're past it in classical singing. If you start at that age, there's no, there wasn't any room for me at that stage. And so, you know, and so I said, I don't know how to mentor, you know, opera, but I do know how to mentor these, these, these organizational and these planning and the mindset. And so that's how I started Everybody Can, you know, which then formed into an opera company. And I still mentor at least, oh gosh, about 50 people a year. Wow. And I take them on for 3 months, you know, and we work together and they're, you know, they have huge change because we're dealing also with a mindset. And I believe that there is lots of space being made now, but we still have to keep our eye open. For, um, you know, when the spaces start to shut down. Because what I'm beginning to see is sometimes when people get a bit exhausted of, oh, have I minded that, or have I taken attention of that, you know, the, the attention can kind of wane. And I think what we have to do is consistently be aware, are we being inclusive? Are we, um, providing equal platforms regardless of age, regardless of culture, regardless of ability, regardless of economic, you know, are we providing enough space for people? And I think this is really, really important. But, you know, I was talking with some friends, agents for opera, for example, and they were telling me how unfortunately they look The way you look is, it's very important in the opera itself because it's a visual medium. So for example, if you had a very short tenor, rarely you would hire a very tall soprano because it would make the tenor look ridiculous or vice versa, you know, if you had, so it would, there is, is not much about just the music itself, unfortunately, is also about the role because you are cast a little bit like actors, isn't it? Depending on how is the leading actor and what part you need to do. Yeah. And I, you know, and I think the vocality of some people, you can't put two voices that don't really match together because we're looking for harmony. We're really looking for harmony. We're looking for an experience. And a sound experience that really soothes our ears, that doesn't clash our ears, you know? So there has to be huge thought process on how we put casting together. However, I don't think that that should exclude, you know, people that would not be perceived as the norm into those spaces because I believe that there's a match and a vocal match for everyone in terms of what kind of production you wish to put on. And I think sometimes it's good to take risks and get courageous about casting. I mean, for instance, you've just played Tosca, Vi si dà a te. I'm gonna be off to Australia next year in May. I'm gonna be singing with Opera Australia in Melbourne, and I'm gonna be singing the role of Tosca. To 7,000 people. That's amazing. 7,000 people an hour, you know. Wow. And I know that that company, you know, in terms of their casting— I mean, I'm all the other way over the other side of the world, so let's even think about it in that, you know, this company is visibly making an effort to look beyond where they are, who they've got in their port, and they're also making space available for others to be seen on the other side of the world. And I think that's how the art form needs to be, is that we're constantly moving around so everybody can share in the experience of the art that we're creating. Because as I said, each one of our sounds is so unique. Absolutely. Well, there is another show you're doing, uh, you're gonna be doing soon, that is The Seven Deaths of Maria Callas. Yes, about our favorite soprano. And would you like to tell us about, uh, this incredible project that makes, um, opera with art? Yeah, well, Maria Callas, I mean, she's one of, you know, as well as my teacher, music teacher at school, a secondary school, who said, you can sing like this one day. She played me The Magic Flute, the Queen of the Night's Aria, Magic Flute. And she left that with me before I left secondary school. But, um, Maria Callas, I heard her sing Casta Diva, and I think she was in Paris at the time. And, um, she started Casta Diva, and it's an old recording. You can find it somewhere on YouTube. It's in black and white. I know that recording very well. It's one of my favorites. Oh my goodness. And she has this voice. Yes. I could have my eyes closed. I would recognize and know it's Maria Callas singing. Oh, and that's what I mean about this uniqueness. You know it's her voice. You know it's her voice. She hasn't tried to be anyone else. She hasn't tried to replicate anybody else. She's singing from her soul. She was one of our first real singing actresses. Yeah. And she even didn't mind about the color of some of her voice. She didn't always make her voice sound pretty, you know, which went against some people's, uh, thought process on how people should sing. So I really believe that she was really committed to being an artist, and I think that's where we transition from just singing into artistry. And, um, I remember watching that recording and the way, you know, she could have turned around— the chorus came in a little bit later and a bit out of time, and she just gently beats this gracious woman, and she just says, come with me, I'm holding you, I'm like a rock, I'm here for you, don't wave 'Come with me,' and then they just follow her. And again, it's back into harmony straight away. And I remember watching that leadership, because it is a form of leadership also, and I remember watching it and going, 'I wish to be like her. She is my idol.' I have a— I have one of her robes, um, that I got in an auction. I've got one of her bracelets. That I got in an auction also. She's very dear to me. So to be able to be chosen to do— there's 7 sopranos doing this role also. One will be singing "Visi darte." I will be singing the "Desdemona," the prayer that I was talking about, and the "Ave Maria." And we'll be working with Marina Abramović. Now, again, we have another great performance artist. Artist. She takes risks even with her life. She takes risks to, to let art speak. There couldn't be a better match in, in terms of telling this life story. I'm so ex— you can hear I'm so excited. And it's that English— English National Opera, and, um, and that will be in November. And I will also be at the Royal Academy of Arts as well. The Royal Academy of Arts speaking with Marina Abramović at one of their talks as well. So I'm very honored to be doing that also. One question. You're going to be at the English National Opera. Are you going to sing Ave Maria in English? No, it's going to be in Italiano. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's got to be in Italian. I think, I think on this occasion, because of the way that we're doing this work, I mean, I think the arias are going to be Visi d'arte, Ave Maria, Casta Diva. There'll be some Carmen. So it's all everybody's favorite arias in one space, in one night. Wow. You've got to get there. I'm going to be there. I'm going to be there for sure. Yeah, no, Marina Abramović is one of my favorite artists. I love art. It has this power, like music, but in a different way, to just blow your mind, make you think. And she's one of the most powerful artists I think of today. Her history is incredible, the defiance of any status quo. And yeah, I highly recommend it. But I just wanted to talk— just last question, although I would stay with you forever and ever. The English National Opera, it's such an institution. First of all, the Coliseum is an amazing theatre. I love it. It's so beautiful. And I've been there watching operas, Italian operas sung in English. And there is this incredible way of, you know, reaching out to a wider audience when you sing in English. So you allow everyone to be able to understand it. Because I'm privileged, you know, being Italian, to be able to understand the opera, often the text itself is as powerful as the music. So what do you think about having operas being translated? I think it's really important. I think, you know, in London we've been very privileged actually that the Royal Opera House does everything in, you know, its cultural language. And then the, the English National Opera has made space for everything to be in English because we're in England. And, you know, so, and I think that again is a universal. It breaks the boundary as well, and it makes it more accessible to, to everybody. Everybody then feels welcome. And, um, whereas sometimes people who go to the Royal Opera House, you know, might not feel welcome because it's in another language, even though there are subtitles, you know, but it's, it's a different experience. To someone literally going to the opera and saying, I can understand every single word. The English National Opera's place in opera is so huge because of that one thing. Um, and the level of excellence that you get is the same that you would get at Royal Opera House. So just because it's sung in English doesn't make the, um, performance any less spectacular. English National Opera, even during rehearsals, will have an English coach inside the rehearsals to make sure that you are being fully understood and that you are honouring the language in the way that it needs to be heard so the audience can receive it in a way that will hit their heart and their emotions. And I just think, you know, it would be such a shame shame to lose that. Yeah, I mean, I'm fortunate enough to understand French as well. I don't speak German. I wish I could speak German to understand Wagner, but there the music just blows me away. So it has a different power there. But you know, when I go sing a musical, for example, a musical is, if you like, a popular version of the opera. Opera, because there is a bit like the, you know, the earlier operas where you had the recitative and then, you know, the part where you're acting and speaking, and then you have the area where you're singing. Then the opera developed, the romantic opera, and it's just all the song. So, so the musical, if you like, is like a step back and then bringing you back to the beauty of watching a play with fantastic music. Um, so I think, you know, the, the language is so important to be accessible and to open up, uh, the opera to the bigger world. And, and so the role of the English National Opera and the position as well next to the Trafalgar Square, next to the West End theaters, is so iconic, it's so unique. To me, deserves to stay there. There was this huge debate about, you know, making the English National Opera go somewhere else. But we, I believe we cannot lose London, the Coliseum, for the home of the English National Opera. I mean, if English National Opera hadn't been there, I would never have got a looking into opera. There wouldn't have been a space for me. English National Opera made a space for me so I could be visible. And because they did that, I'm now visible all over the world. I mean, I greatly— it would be such a huge loss. Yeah, and there is another aspect to it. The Royal Opera House is very international. You have opera singers from all around the world, the best of the best of the world, while the English National Opera is dedicated to British artists. To, to the British school, to the British culture. And so it's really very much about being, you know, bringing opera to the British audience. Yes, but it's, it's, it's, it's the people's opera, you know. I just, I just, yeah, it's the people's opera, it's the People's Opera House, and everybody, everybody who who in that everybody needs to be fighting to make sure that that stays in its space and stays alive. So that if there is anybody listening that can do anything to support it, please, please, please do that because, you know, it'd be a huge loss. It would be just such a huge loss. Absolutely. Well, last question, Nadine. Do you have any time to rest? Because you're doing so much. Are you gonna take a holiday or soon or it's just work, work, work? Well, the season started now, so I'm going to be doing the Four Last Songs with Sinfonia Viva on the 18th of October. I'm going to be doing Amelia in Un Ballo in Maschera at Cadogan Hall on the 22nd of October with the wonderful Anthony Niggis at the helm conducting. And the Strauss Four Last Songs is also with the phenomenal Olivia Clarke. So another, um, fellow from English National Opera. So, you know, this is where we get— begin to see how their work really infiltrates. And Anthony Niggis used to be with that, with English National Opera as well. So it really is a home of some of these artists that we get to see now doing this incredible work. Um, but I, I, because I'm a coach and I've been a coach for the last 22 years in high performance, in NLP, in physical intelligence, um, scheduling my time, you know, to within an inch of my life, to include my rest time. So I always put a moment or block time in my diary to say, okay, this is when I'm gonna sleep, this is when I'm gonna watch Netflix. Yeah, so I'm always very mindful, and I also meditate in the morning, and I meditate in the evening, and I do a a lot of self-writing as well. I get into my breath. So there are always points of rest. They're not always long points of rest, but they're, they're where I know I can check in with my body, get back into my power, and take charge of my life. Ah, so beautiful. There couldn't be a better, you know, um, advice to all of us. I forget about that sometimes. Life take over on you. And definitely we need to feel and listen to our body because unfortunately we're not just made of soul, we're also made of a body that needs to be respected and needs to be rested and taken care. And then our mind. There is this wonderful saying from the Latins that says, "Mens sana in corpore sano," a beautiful mind, a healthy mind in a healthy body. So wonderful. Thank you so much, Nadine, again. And well, let's listen to Ave Maria by Othello by Verdi to conclude our interview. And so this is going to be performed for the 7th Death of Maria Callas in November at the English National Opera with our wonderful winner of the opera section of Future Classical Awards, Nadine Benjamin. Thank you so much, Stefania. A pleasure to be here, and thank you for this award. It means a lot. Thank you. Let's listen to Ave Maria by Otello. Sia benedetto il frutto, o benedetta di Tue materne viscere, Gesù. For this is our strong freedom, that we cannot bend the knee. At your sorrows. Oi, prega por nós. Ave Maria. And this was Ave Maria in Otello by Verdi, sung by the winner of the 5th edition of Future Classical Man Awards, Nadine Benjamin. Thank you, Nadine, for this wonderful interview. Oh, it's been a pleasure. I mean, I just, I love speaking to you. I think you are incredible. Um, so I love, love, love speaking to you. I'll make time for you anytime. But just to say, if anybody's around on Sunday the 19th of November, the Everybody Can Development Awards will have its final from 3 till 6 at St. Paul's in Covent Garden, which is known as the Actors Church I would love as many people to be there as possible. And also come and support the concert series that is also at St. Paul's Covent Garden for singers aged between 35 to 65. You know, it's— go and have a look on their website. It's all there. Ah, fantastic. Thank you very much. Nominations are now open for the 6th edition of Future Classic Women Awards. To nominate your favourite artist, please email presenters@womensradiostation.com or tweet us @WomensRadioSTN. You've been listening to Future Classic Women Awards. Women's Radio Station live every day at 10 AM and 10 PM London time. And if you'd like to listen to it again or catch up on the previous programs, please head to my presenter's page, Stefania Passamonte, Future Classic Women Awards, on womensradiostation.com. Thank you for listening.