Get Booked – Maria Lewis, The Graveyard Shift 110923

Hello and welcome to another episode of Get Booked for Women's and Men's Radio Station. I'm Hazel Butterfield and a huge book fan, so I love doing this show. Get Booked is all about talking to authors, chatting about anything and everything books related and all the joy, enlightenment, and escape that good books can provide. Sit back and let us entertain you with a different guest each week, sharing who they are, what they do, and what inspires them. Today on the show, we are going to be chatting to the author Maria Lewis about The Graveyard Shift. You can find out more about Maria at marialewis.com.au. K-U. From the Queen of Halloween comes a slasher crime for the millennial generation, a delicious mashup of horror and pop culture, an homage to slasher horror movies, and a kick-ass story of two sisters trying to solve a crime that one has been inadvertently caught up in. Tinsel Monroe is the host of the Graveyard Shift a late-night radio show where she and her loyal listeners celebrate the sounds of cult cinema. She has busted her ass to carve out this section of the airwaves, and nothing will keep her from reaching her primetime dreams. That is, until someone gets murdered live on air. A fast-paced, thrilling murder mystery novel paying homage to slasher films of the '90s, The Graveyard Shift is the perfect Halloween read for fans of Riley Sager and Grady Hendrix. Thoroughly loved reading this book. I love sinking my teeth into a bit of a thriller. And, uh, yeah, I cannot wait to chat to Maria later on in the show. Coming up on next week's show, we have the author Gayle Aldwyn, and she has written The Secret Life of Carolyn Russell. A true crime podcaster investigates a decades-old suspected abduction in this powerful psychological suspense novel. 1979, a 16-year-old Carolyn Russell grows increasingly infatuated with her school mathematics teacher who is also giving her private lessons. Then she disappears. 2014, struggling journalist Stephanie Brett creates a true crime podcast focused on the disappearance of Carolyn Russell. By digging deep into this mysterious cold case, her confidence and flagging career are boosted. But after she confronts the suspects and talks to a potential witness, the leads dry up. However, Stephanie refuses to let the story rest. Can a small-time journalist with a shoestring podcast really hope to reconstruct the ultimate fate of Carolyn Russell after all these years? Or are some secrets left buried? Hmm, a kind of a different look at writing these true crime podcasts, the story behind it, an absolutely cracking story. And after that, I have just managed to secure the interview with the author Bernard J. Owens, and he has written the book The Only Thing Wrong with You Is That You Think There's Something Wrong with You. Bernard shares his own personal story of adversity while deep diving yet again into the topics of personal relationships, overcoming mental anguish, setting boundaries Mysteries and more. He's an excellent, excellent writer, and I've just started reading this stuff, and I know it's going to be a thrilling chat. Definitely not one to miss. Now, it's all here at Women's Radio Station, and Men's Radio Station are very lucky to be receiving awards left, right, and center. Please do go check out all of our different shows at womensradiostation.com and mensradiostation.com. Com. More books lined up for the show in the coming months. They're coming in thick and fast. Uh, I'm, I'm constantly reading. It's brilliant. I think the kids are happy because it means that I'm, uh, leaving them to it when they want to sit in their teenage solitude in their rooms or hanging out with their friends. Um, I'm telling myself it's totally fine, Mummy's got books. And another book that I've just received, and it— she's going to be featured on the show very soon, is The Fugitive of Gezi Park. This is Deniz Goran. Ada is haunted by her yearning for Istanbul and by the scars of a night-long interrogation following her arrest at the Gezi Park protests. Now in London, temping at an art fair, she meets Lucien, an eccentric charming but burnt-out gallerist. Since his divorce, Lucien has been relying on drugs and alcohol to mend his broken heart. Ada, meanwhile, dreads the verdict of a forthcoming trial in Istanbul. Day by day, as their passion deepens, they reassess their past choices, and their futures rapidly take shape. Sensual, perceptive, and at times bitingly funny, 'The Fugitive of Gezi Park' explores the nature of trauma and struggle, asking what it takes of us to start all over again. In 2013, police brutality against a peaceful group protesting the destruction of Gezi Park, one of the few public green spaces in Istanbul, prompted an unprecedented wave of demonstrations which spread rapidly across Turkey. Lasting several weeks. The Gezi Park protests are a pivotal moment in the country's volatile recent history and continue to carry huge sentimental value for the citizens of new Turkey. Really looking forward to chatting to that author. And then another one. They're coming in so thick and fast. I am having so much fun just absorbing all the fantastic books that are coming out at the moment. We have Artificial Wisdom by Thomas R. Weaver. It's described as a cracking read full of twists, turns, and thought-provoking ideas, and the best debut to, um, cross many a desk. Now, Artificial Wisdom is a gripping murder mystery techno thriller that takes you on a journey through a future too close for comfort, using the investigative journalism of All the President's Men, the murder mystery of Agatha Christie, and the future landscape of Minority Report. If you love unexpected plot twists and hard-hitting questions about technology and the implications for humanity, this thought-provoking novel by Thomas R. Weaver will keep you turning the pages in search of the truth. So many different shows to look forward to here on Get Booked, and I love the variety, whether it's fiction or non-fiction. Escape or using fiction to help us understand different parts of our future, our past, and social issues. Right, my lovelies. Now it is time for today's guest, Maria Lewis, and her book, The Graveyard Shift: The Killer is out there and they're listening. I love thrillers, and I read this in the perfect setting too, just kind of holidaying alone while also being a radio presenter who is regularly in the studio solo. It's a good old thriller slasher akin to the kind of Scream franchise, but with far better writing, less cheese, and a great dose of pop culture. Now, just how far will some people go to not have their dreams slashed— ah, so I did that— to hold their ground when the world is oversaturated with competition and egos. Tinsel Monroe has finally worked her way through the ranks to have her own paid radio show, The Graveyard Shift. Literally. Although a show focused on cult thrillers is going to attract a certain clientele, what unfolds is beyond most radio presenters' level of comfort. Luckily, Tinsel's sister Pandora is on hand with investigative expertise to uncover what the hell is going on. Maria, thank you for joining us on Get Booked. How the devil are you? I'm good. What an amazing intro. I don't know if anyone in my— I don't know if I will take any compliment stronger and more seriously than saying the writing in The Graveyard Shift is better than Scream. That has absolutely tickled my pickle. Oh my God. Definitely better than Scream 3 for sure, but I don't know if I'm quite up to the standard of the others, but I'll take it. It's— I mean, because it was kind of a little bit— I mean, you write characters fantastically, um, and I love how you kind of— there was— I was kind of giggling sometimes in a book about someone getting kind of constantly slashed and people getting murdered left, right, and center, but I think it was kind of like how you brought a lot of normalcy to these kick-ass characters who are still in, you know, shitty relationships and still kind of failing in other areas and smashing it in others. But that's normal, right? And I assume that was quite intentional. Yeah, I just think this idea, and it's a very old school idea, I think the narrative on this is changing. But, you know, separate to this being a slasher, right, each character existing and having their own life, like this is the thing with stories like this is, I think, the best kind of characters and the best sort of immersive storytelling. It doesn't feel like you're at the beginning. It feels like you've immediately stepped into somebody's life. You've stepped into the middle of their story. And this idea that women can have it all is a fairy tale and maybe impossible. And it's just like, I don't know about you, but I've never really had that thing where it's like my career will be going great and my relationships are going great simultaneously. It's like one thing or the other, or like one thing is up, one thing is down, or like, you know, health health might be growing really great, and then something else might be not going so great. And just that feeling, like, the, you know, the, the narrative is that's abnormal, but the reality is that's normal. That's the human experience, right? Is that your life comes in seasons, and there are sometimes that are like career season, sometimes a love season, sometimes a family season, all that kind of stuff. And so I wanted Tinsel and Pandora, both of them specifically, like, obviously Tinsel's our in-character. She's the one who brings the audience into the story, and she's, you know, sort of the driver of narrative. But Pandora is such a big part of her world, and I really wanted those two sisters to feel really real and lived and authentic as they are living through a slasher, you know what I mean? Yeah, it kind of interwoven really, really well and just kind of you kept on getting these surprises of kind of what you would expect a certain character to be or what they would admit to. And then— no, I enjoyed it. I just— it kind of felt a little bit comforting in a weird way of a thriller slash. Well, yeah, I mean, horror movies are my favorite thing in the world. It's like my favorite genre, period, whether that's TV, film, books, whatever. And it is a comfort for me, which I think it is for particularly like women's place in horror, I think it's a comfort for a lot of women, is because you're watching the horror happen to somebody else rather than happen to you. Because, you know, statistically, women are the ones who horror happens to. And so the final girl mechanic has, I think, always been something that's really connected to me because it's like you watch these women who are interesting and complicated and prickly go through stuff and come out the other end. And yes, okay, maybe sometimes that's Michael Myers getting decapitated and somehow he comes back with dead in the next movie. But the, like, central message is, you know, it's there. It's, it's comforting in that way. And I was sort of— I've always been a fan of the literary slasher, but as a genre, it really died off sort of in the '70s and '80s. And, like, you know, I Know What You Did Last Summer was a book that I really loved. And sort of, like, as slashers were taking over in the film space, they were sort of dipping off in publishing. And it's exciting as somebody who loves to consume them and had a lifelong dream of getting to write one, that we're at this intersection now where there's actually like quite a few slashers bubbling up pop culturally in film and television, but also in the literary space, which is wonderful because it means I can like elbow my way in there. Well, I was having a look actually, because you've written quite a few books and I'd say this is quite— this is slightly different, isn't it? What you normally— the normal genre. The Graveyard Shift is my 10th book, and all of my previous books have all been let's say fantasy in some regard. Um, urban fantasy used to be the big term, but that sort of like died off. But like speculative fiction, you know, I've written a superhero book for Marvel. I had a series of 8 novels that was all about different types of women as monsters. So a banshee book, a werewolf book, a witch book, a medium book, a sprite, a selkie, and they all crossed over into like a big finale in book 8. So I'm better known for fantasy and speculative fiction, but genre broadly is the space that I operate in. And you know, books something that has always been my passion, but my primary job is as a screenwriter. And so I primarily work in film and television, writing on TV shows, writing films, stuff like that. And that space, I have done a lot more horror, but it's just really fascinating, like, especially when you do an event or a signing or something like that, or you pop up at a pop culture convention, it's always really fascinating to see where people— like, what's the Venn diagram of intersection of where people know you from? You have your book fans, obviously, but, um, you know, I also— in Australia, I was on this, um, live nightly news show for years called The Feed, which was like youth news. So you have a lot of loyal Feed watchers, and then you have people who know me from more of the film and television stuff, and it's intersex in all that way. But I started out my career as a police reporter at a local newspaper, and so yeah, it had always been something that had been really interesting to me, and I'd always had to do radio work in some capacity, whether whether that was on guest— guesting on other people's shows, or— and as I moved into more film and TV stuff, it was something that popped up all the time. So it was always like the world of radio was always in my life as a function of my job, but crime was always something that I was like covering and doing and familiar with the mechanics of, um, and trying to find a way for the two of them to intersect. And like, okay, yes, it is a slasher and there's always an element of disbelief. But, you know, you see things like the Moscow murders, for instance, and you're like, actually, this stuff happens all the time. Stuff like this happens every day. And young people, people from all different backgrounds, get caught up in this essentially like cycle of terror. And I think there's a lot to talk about in terms of like PTSD and women and how they move through that space. And I was just seeing so many literary slashes um, talking about female trauma that were written by men, or written by men under female pseudonyms. And it was really giving me the shits. And I was like, you know what, okay, I'm like 9 books in now. Like, it's really hard to pivot when you're known for one thing, to shift to another genre. And so I was sort of hoping that horror broadly, which is what the, you know, The Graveyard Shift fits into, wasn't too much of a left turn from what different publishers know me for. And so I was thankful that my agent Ed Wilson was like really able to sort of, you know, fight to get it out there. And this being my first murder mystery, I hope I get to do more because I love the genre and I love getting to sort of like elbow my agenda in there, whether it's pop culturally or diversity or, you know, women and like different ages of women as well. I think is really important, this sort of like idea that everyone's, um, an 18-year-old virgin in stories. I'm just like, actually, there's a whole breadth of world and possibility to get into when you're talking about, um, you know, grown adults. Do you know what I found really interesting and relatable? I mean, also your knowledge of radio and community radio really helped kind of— I was so stressed, no, it was just having this chat because I was like, there's lots of things you can bluff your way through, but this isn't one of them. And also, like, you know, lots of people who have been consuming the book and have been reaching out about their responses to it don't have your background, don't work in radio in space or don't know the technical specifics. And I really shadowed a friend of mine, Hal Lotakefu, who runs the Hip Hop Show in Australia, which is like a sort of— he's one of Australia's hip-hop pioneers. And that show was groundbreaking, and it was the overnight slot. So it was one thing to be like, yes, I have radio experience, but can I shadow someone who works in that exact slot, who is in a studio by themselves, who is the only person in there? And Urban Legend has that scene with Tara Reid where, um, she gets attacked while doing her, uh, sex show at the college campus. And I was just like, it's such a creepy setting, and if you can find a way to sort of stretch it out of just a setting or just a mechanic, I thought that was an interesting space to play in. Uh, yeah, definitely. I mean, the thing is, you, you nailed the whole element of why you wouldn't just— why Tinsel wouldn't just back off when she was in danger because we work our ass off to get into these positions. And some people work in radio for 10, 15, 20 years, still do, where they never get paid, but they love it or they want to bring something to the community. And when you finally get a job where you're getting paid, you're like, you are not going to scare me out of this. And then you have especially women going, I'm fed up of being made to be scared so that I am less than. And that came across in the book. So that kind of not only was it kind of thrilling, but I was kind of getting angry for Tinsel at the same time. I was like, yes, you might get stabbed, but no one's taking that slot from you. Yeah, no. Oh my God. I am. I kind of always have like a thin sheen of rage, sort of like just under the surface in my everyday life. Right. And it's not just within journalism spaces. The things that used to really frustrate me was when you would get, you know, death and rape threats from people who are mad about a film that you wrote about. Or they felt like you weren't giving Zack Snyder enough credit for XYZ thing, and therefore you deserve to die. And it's like you couldn't operate in certain spaces. And it took me a while to sort of really understand that. And these were people who would find out where you lived, show up at events, like really threatening, scary stuff. And it was always this thing that the line that used to piss me off the most was like, oh, they're harmless, or it's harmless, or you need to not take it so seriously. This assumption that 'Women are safe, they're always going to be safe,' and it would always come from men. And it would just really anger me because it is the feeling of unsafety, number one, but also the reality of unsafety, number two. And I have a lot of friends who work in media as well who have gone through similar sorts of things. And so when this is happening to Tinsel and the story is unfolding, it was really important that there was— you could speak to that real-life experience but also speak to the reality of what women go through. But also like how hard you bust your tits to get into those positions. And usually male-dominated spaces. And community radio, God bless, in every city there are people out there who just give up hours of their lives to go and show up and do a show that's, you know, some niche type of like Antarctic reggae or something, you know what I mean? Like they're so passionate about a certain thing and like they donate their time and they donate hours of their lives. And so trying to capture that passion that people have for radio and the reach that it can have as well, because I know people think of it as like an analog thing, but in the internet age, your audience is almost limitless now. If people know everything is on, on the internet, even if it's a local station, you know, I, I have, um, a local radio show where my sister in Spain listens every single week. You know, anyone can listen anywhere. It's completely irrelevant. You're right, you are absolutely everywhere. Yeah, and people are loyal. Like, people who tune into a show, if it's a niche thing and they like you and they like what you're about, they will tune in. And so that was also important for Tinsel's type of show, for it to be super specific and to really like underline that idea of doesn't matter. Like, her audience reach is international essentially, and locally it's almost like she's a little bit ahead of the curve because the station doesn't quite get it. Um, but the people who listen get it. The people who are passionate about horror movies and pop culture are really passionate about it in the same way people are passionate about, you know, ukuleles or something. You know, the thing— if you love a thing, you love a thing. Well, do you know one thing I love about this, though, is that if you find a way to connect with somebody, connectivity is brilliant for your well-being. Again, if it is just about ukuleles and you find your people that can be so incredibly powerful. But I mean, going back to what you said about, you know, women wanting to be strong, but, you know, we've also got to be safe as well. I had a situation recently where my son's girlfriend, we always chat so much and she kind of sees me as this woman who kind of doesn't take any crap on whatever. And we kind of take the mickey out of my son a little bit because he's a know-it-all. But he was important. You have to let them know who's in charge, and it's women. Yes. Yeah. And occasionally, like, he'll say to me, right, I'm going to be half an hour late from going out today, I'm walking my girlfriend home. And she'll go, can you believe it, he thinks in this day and age that, you know, he's got to walk me home? And I just turned around and went, honey, and unfortunately he kind of does, because it's safer for him to walk home than it is for you. That's just the sad fact of it. I hold my ground and stand up for you in so many different ways. But my, my 6-foot son is safer walking the streets at 9 o'clock at night than you as a 16-year-old girl. Yeah. Oh, fair enough. And she backed off. It's one of those things where you do get mad about having to be cautious and precautious. But it is that whole thing of like, you know, you have a friend who's going out on a date with someone that they haven't met met before, and they're texting you that person's name, where they're going, their address, all their details. Like, you never want to assume that the worst is going to happen, but at the same time, the podcast My Favorite Murder has this motto, uh, stay sexy, don't get murdered. And I think that like sort of mantra is actually really great because it's, yeah, like, yeah, stay sexy, live your life, get out there, do the things that you need to do, but also be conscious of just because you feel like you deserve to live a life and be safe and be happy and go about your business, that doesn't mean that there aren't people out there who are severely cooked inside. And it's just one of those things, like always, you know, never jog at night, never jog with headphones at night, like being really conscious of your surroundings all the time. And, um, you know, like in Australia we're not allowed like pepper spray and stuff like that's technically illegal. And so it's actually really like, you almost can't have any self-protection with you at any point. And I'm like, you know, to be perfectly honest, I carry a switchblade. And it's not like I'm walking out there like I'm in fucking West Side Story, ready to be like, you know, when you're a jet, you're a jet. But at the same time, if I ever felt threatened or I ever got into a situation, having some kind of mechanism there that I could help myself is important because because the reality is sometimes there isn't anybody there to help you. And you always want to assume the best of people, but I think it's also important to just be conscious of the realities of the world and the realities of like where you're living, what city, what time it is, all that kind of stuff. It's, it's a minefield of just making sure that you're giving yourself the best advantage, whether it's you do martial arts. So you make sure that you— unfortunately, you make sure you've got that extra bit of money to get a taxi because it's just a damn sight safer. You send the picture to somebody of the taxi you're getting in, and it's just common sense. Women kind of do it automatically now. Yeah, and it was something that I really wanted to show in the book where, like, Tinsel, she lives in Melbourne, which is one of my favorite cities in the world. Melbourne's a bit like a wannabe London like it really wants to be London really hard. And it's funny because it's like the city— yeah, the people who established Melbourne were from London. And so it's really interesting when you see the architecture and things, you're like, oh, okay, this is a bit try-hard, but I like it. And, um, I really wanted to have that sort of shift where it's like the way she moved through the city at the start of the book compared to the midpoint compared to the end is different as her circumstance changes. And the way that city that you grow to love and your suburb that you grow to love and the local bar that you go to or the local tattoo shop or whatever, the way that those places shift in almost like insidiousness or danger based on what you're going through and what's happening. Parks that seem beautiful and open and safe and bring a sense of happiness and great picnics with friends can be completely different once you've been through some stuff. And completely different depending on the time of day and who you're with. And just sort of those ways that situationally things can really change, particularly as a woman, but also particularly as a woman of color. It can be really fucking brutal out there. Uh, yes, because also you're not actually taken as seriously as much. It's just there's so many different elements that we've got to watch out for and It's knackering. I mean, I did a show last week about— I interviewed an author who wrote a book on generation anxiety, and she's just like, we have too much knowledge, we know too much. And so it scares the hell out of us. And it's to our detriment, right? Oh, one of my favorite phrases with my best mate is log off, babe. And it's just one of those things where you can sort of see the other person sort of start to spiral online and you just got to send them a text and be like, log off, babe. 'Log off the internet.' Both, you know, I always get annoyed when people say the phrase like the internet isn't real because it is, and like so much of our jobs and our lives. But at the same time, it's just like sometimes you just gotta log off, babe. You just gotta go outside and touch some grass and smell some fresh air and, you know, go hang out with real people and, um, in a small pub or something and just like peace out for a bit. I do, but sometimes because I've got to promote the shows. I know sometimes I like to interact with authors, or there's many other shows. I do film reviews as well. And so I do have to be on social media quite a bit, and I have to every now and again, especially if I'm with like my kids or something, I just leave my phone at home because if we need something, the kids have got it, you know. And yeah, I just, I, I need to know that I have no way of picking up the phone. I don't need to picture every last pretty tree that the dog pees up because, you know, she's gonna do it again. Um, and you You just, you need to zone out because it's so dangerous. I mean, I've seen the effect of when I forced my kids to not be on their phone for 48 hours. The first 24 hours I thought they were going to kill me, and then all of a sudden they turned into really nice kids who were like, hi Mum, this is nice, why don't we play noughts and crosses or something? I'm like, that's so funny, it's so weird. Uh, but yeah, locking off every now and again, I mean, a bit like what saying before, before we came on air about how sometimes I just kind of crash into social media and do loads and then I zone out again for a little bit. I mean, you know, heaven, heaven bless scheduled posts. That's the thing that often saves me, you know, like social media is a part of the job, but it's also like, it's where I interact with friends who live in different parts of the world. And when you catch up with people sometimes through social media, particularly like COVID, it was the thing the power of voice memos, the friendships you were able to maintain by being able to send people voice memos to like little friendship podcasts, really. Like if they were in Canada and on different time zone and you could, you know, send them an update about whatever boring thing was happening in your life and they could send something back. But yeah, scheduled posts have been a godsend. And especially like, um, I think I've just with the Graveyard Shift, like we're just starting to kick off promotion in earnest now. And so, you know, you have like a long lead time and like, okay, you've got this thing, that thing. These events, that thing. But it's also, I just come off the back of doing Marble Press as well, back to back. And it's really, um, challenging. But at the same time, like, I have been doing this, I've been in this business for a while. So it's like, know better, do better. But being, uh, really protective of your space and really protective of your time and just being like, okay, I'm on in the morning for a bit and I'm on in the evening for a bit and then in between or other side it's just like, it's crickets. Yeah, but also sometimes you kind of need it for research because I'm sure you must come across things on social media and go, well, that'll be a great character, because you do write quite complex characters, quite endearing, and some of them like even maybe bordering on annoying. But you're going to get that from social media, right? Where else are you going to do your research other than the pub. Yeah, real life, honestly. You know, like, um, the, the actual— speaking of the local pub, like, the, the pub that Tinsel lives above in the book, The Pinnacle, is a real pub and, you know, is my favorite local pub. And, you know, has like the bell tower and everything. And all the staff members that work at The Pinnacle in the book are real people that were, you know, wove into the tapestry. And you, you know, 99% of readers aren't going to know that, um, because they've never been there and they haven't seen that stuff. But for me, it's just like ingraining that, like, again, another little element of reality amongst all the hyperreality, you know. Was there a particular character that you preferred writing? I mean, Tinsel seems like an obvious choice, but it's nice to kind of— I, I have a lot of writers who tell me that they like writing the worst people. They're the best fun. Oh well, Tinsel's awesome because she is the conduit for the audience in terms of the pop cultural connections, right? So when these different murders are happening at locations in and around Melbourne— Melbourne, Australia is the birthplace of cinema. A lot of people don't know that, but the very first feature film ever made came from Melbourne in 1903, and it was about Ned Kelly, of course, because Australians are obsessed with Ned Kelly. But I was trying to sort of tap into that kind of forgotten history of Australia and film while also connecting that to what's happening currently with film. And so Tinsel was the character to do that. She was the mechanism to do that through because she was the one with the pop culture show. But I had a lot of fun writing Pandora as well, um, her sister, because there's just things that sisters can say to each other that nobody else can say to each other. Like, no one will be is lovely but also rude, or is like, it's kind but also brutally honest to you as a sibling. And having— I love you, but you're a dick. Exactly. Yes, yes. Like, 1-800-DUMP-HIM, you know what I mean? Like, only a sister's gonna say that too. But, uh, having Pandora be the one who was the expert in crime and having, um, Tinsel be the one who was the expert in pop culture meant that neither character was too overburdened with expertise, but also that they were then forced to work together to try and solve this. They essentially couldn't get to the bottom of it without the other. And I thought that was really important because I think a lot of times pop culture scholarship and pop culture analysis gets looked down upon because it's just like, oh, it's just, you know, it's just the media, it's just shows, or it's just whatever. But it's vital. It's really like a— this essentially like a time capsule of who we are in any given moment and where we're heading. Um, even just like the discourse at the moment around Riverdale, an objectively nuts show that is like taking characters to hell and back. And, you know, it's just finalized and it's like final episode, and the 4 main characters were in an, um, E&M relationship, an ethical non-monogamous relationship. They're a quad. And the way people have been— the show ended weeks ago— and the way people can't let this discourse go, I'm like, it's really fascinating. It's really— it says a lot about where we are right now and where people are right now and where people are in the discourse in a way that it's like, what else can do stuff like that? Pop culture is awesome because of the conversations that it can start and the types of relationships and people that it can show. I love that. Yeah, I love pop culture. I mean, I'm covered in pop culture tattoos, so, you know, really gotta wear it. I feel like you really wove a lot of you into The Great Godshift in so many ways. At one point you were describing something, an outfit that you were wearing to, I think, a premiere. And I think I looked at your socials and I'm like, I'm sure that's pretty much what you were wearing in the book. I wish. That dress, and I know the exact dress you're talking about because it was, it was in my, like, aspirational, would love to buy, but I don't really quite have, like, my tits are a little bit too, like, I just, I couldn't make that dress work. Work, right? I'm a bit wet too well endowed. And it's the— that's the beautiful, like, aspect of writing books is you can give characters things that you can't have. For instance, I would love to have a cool little, like, mod bob like Tinsel has. I really love to do her whole rockabilly thing. But, you know, I'm mixed race, I've got Polynesian hair, it's all over the shop. I can't have that sort of, like, order. And, like, you know, it's just— it is what it is. But, like, that dress was from this website called Unique Vintage, which basically does a lot of, um, vintage recreation clothing. And a lot of stuff I buy from them is very different, but that was just one of those dresses where you're just like, you're wasting time listening to a podcast, scrolling through things that you're not going to buy, online shopping, and I just saw that dress and I was like, wow, that is incredible. A rust-colored dress against her skin and the light at the Capitol, which is this very specific location. And I was like, I'm putting that, you know, I'll put little— I'll save files into books, because I think oftentimes, like, what people wear is important to the story. It tells you a lot about— yeah. And like, you know, my first character, um, ever, like, first lead character ever, was a, uh, a Scottish werewolf called Tommy Grayson. And she was, you know, well, she wore studs and leather, and she was a bit of a badass. And like, you know, you're sort of stereotypical Faith from Buffy kind of badass, but it was all like hard edges, hard fabrics, torn denim, band shirts, stuff like that. And then a character down the line, um, Caspar, who was a woman who could communicate with spirits, she was all floaty fabrics, you know what I mean? She was always dressing for comfort, and she was always dressing in things that looked beautiful in motion, really feminine but also kind of witchy. And the things that that can say about different people, I think and the characters that you're trying to create is really important. You know, Pandora is always stressing— envisioning what is actually going on, isn't it? I mean, I kind of felt that's the sign of a good book when you sometimes aren't quite sure where you've seen the movie or not. Oh, that's the highest compliment for me ever. Yeah, because I visualize everything, right? And I think it's also because, you know, I'm spending majority of my time writing screenplays and that is by definition, to do that job well, you need to be visualizing it. And sometimes you are literally writing the screenplay while what you're writing is getting storyboarded, while you're like, the shots are being planned and the production's about to be greenlit, go underway. So it's almost like incidental. I can't help but write visually in a way that I'm always like, I'm seeing it in my head. And for something like The Graveyard Shift, which is so much of a love letter to not just the pop culture I love, but the city I love, and that age and that era. And they're just, you know, having all those elements of like, okay, yes, it is a murder mystery, but it's also a lot about love, you know, love between two characters who can be falling in love, but love between sisters, love dynamics, everything. Yes, exactly. I think it really came across. I absolutely loved it. I just want to point out to all of listeners to pop on to marialewis.com.au to find out more about you. I've got so much I want to ask you, but we've run out of time. So I even wanted to know what the next book was, but you're gonna have to just send it to me and come back on the show again. I can tell you real quick because it's out in a few months. It's, um, an Assassin's Creed novel, uh, called Mirage, um, Daughter of No One, which is about Roshan, who's one of the characters in the Assassin's Creed universe. And she ties into next game that's coming from Ubisoft. So it's a very, again, a very different book to sort of what I'm known for. And, um, it's set in 800s Persia. So, oh wow, yeah, really hard pivot from The Graveyard Shift. But if an opportunity comes along to write for Assassin's Creed, you gotta take that with both hands. Oh, I love that. Absolutely. Do you know what? I've thoroughly loved chatting to you today. I've loved chatting to you. Oh, it's been such a good convo. You've asked such good questions, and it's just You know, you spend so long writing these books and writing these stories hoping that somebody connects to it as much as you do, and I really appreciate it. I totally did. Thank you so much for joining us on Network for Women's and Men's Radio Station. Thank you. That was today's guest, Maria Lewis, chatting to us about her book The Graveyard Shift, available now. You can find out more about her at marialewis.com.au. And here is a little author read extract. Yo, what's up? My name's Maria Lewis. I'm the author of The Graveyard Shift, which is a pop cultural slasher and I'm gonna read you a chunk from it. Um, BTWs, I'm notoriously bit shit at this, so you'll just have to bear with me. "Is that necessary?" Rochelle asked as the younger detective slid a small digital voice recorder onto the table. "It is, I'm afraid. This is just a line of inquiry at the moment, but having our conversation on file will help us down the line." 'It's fine,' Tinsel told them both. 'Really, I want to help any way I can as soon as I know what this is about.' 'I'm Detective James and this is Detective Senior Sergeant Durani,' he said, smiling at her in a way that was friendly but also highlighted the laugh lines around his eyes. The older cop took over, flipping open a small notepad as he consulted what was written there. Last night, or this morning rather, shortly after midnight, the neighbors of Amira Brandt called police to report a disturbance at her property. Officers at the scene discovered Miss Brandt deceased. Due to the nature of her injuries, we're treating the matter as a homicide. The name flagged something in Tinsel's mind, but she couldn't immediately recall what it was as she concentrated on the information detected detectives were telling her. Her mobile device was discovered near the body, the last call being registered to this station, we believe, shortly before her time of death. The number is 1-800-448-36, Tinsel finished, earning an interested stare from the officer. That's our call line, Rochelle said. When we run competitions or have people dial into the show, that's the number they It's 1-800-HIT-FM. Miss Brandt dialed this number and was on the line for several minutes. Detective Senior Sergeant Durani frowned. We were told here by your station manager that you're the only one who works the overnight shift. Is that right? The graveyard shift, Tinsel corrected. That's what my show is called. I work from 11 through to the breakfast show at 6. It's supposed to be the dead zone. "Do you remember speaking to anyone last night?" Detective James asked. "Were there any—" "I know her," she whispered, shock spreading through Tinsel's limbs as she realized why the victim's name was familiar. Detective James leaned forward in his chair. "You know Miss Brant?" "I mean, not know her know her," Tinsel clarified, "but she called into the show last night. She's called in a few times." 'Was there anything unusual about the call?' the older detective questioned. The silence was heavy as Tinsel attempted to take another sip of tea, her hand shaking enough that it was noticeable to the other people in the room. 'Tinsel,' Rochelle started, straightening up in her chair. 'I thought it was a prank,' she whispered, eyes wide as she looked at the two detectives. 'It was a Halloween show, you know. There's always at least one or two people calling in pretending to be Hannibal Lecter or 'When was this?' Detective Senior Sergeant Durani was scribbling notes. 'Uh, I have to check the logs, but around 12:30, maybe a little bit later.' 'And you were alone in the studio?' 'No, I mean, usually I am, but Louisa Kerser was there as well. She stayed late after her shift. She heard the call too.' 'Louisa hosts the Aperitif,' Rochelle supplied. 'It's the mid-evening show from 6 until 11 after dry Wait, Detective James said, putting up his hand. What do you mean heard the call? It was live, Tinsel explained. I opened up the lines and a woman called Mara Brandt rang through to try and win tickets to a movie premiere. Walk me through what was said exactly. It was a question about a rap song. She answered and then— I don't know. I thought she had dropped off the line. She went quiet. I prompted her and she spoke up and Tinsel's throat felt thick as she swallowed, realizing for the first time just what she might have heard. Rochelle's hand touched her wrist gently, a gesture of sympathy. Her eyes felt like they were filling to the brim, and she blinked rapidly, trying to keep it together. Thank you so much for joining me, your host Hazel Butterfield, for today's Get Booked from Women's and Men's Radio Station. As ever, leading us out to the end of the show is a little snippet of one of our previous shows. Remember, you can pop on to womensradiostation.com/shows/getbooked to catch up on all of our previous full shows. Okay, next up on Get Booked for Women's and Men's Radio Station, embrace yourself for what I know so many of you will need to hear about. We have the author of Generation Anxiety, Dr. Lauren Cook. Now, this book came at the perfect time for me, just as one of my episodes was kicking off. The relatable prose, it's really helpful in consuming the knowledge and guidance that Lauren has to impart, a voice that guides without judgment, in fact very openly incorporating And Dr. Cook's own issues with anxiety, unpacking and reframing our sadness and anxiety, looking at harnessing and focusing on the good in our life, learning to seek out joy where we can and is appropriate, and helping us to run towards our issues rather than running away scared. If we face our fears, we take away its power and And I'm so excited about this conversation. Firstly, congratulations on honestly, hand on heart, a very good book. And welcome to the show. Now I'm so happy to be here. Thank you. Great. I mean, honestly, it was, it was so interesting because I went on holiday recently and I started having these anxiety episodes and it was just when your PR person said, Hazel, do you want to read this book and interview? And I was like, oh my God. I need this now, and it genuinely really helped me. You should be so incredibly proud of the way you've put the information together. I think it's so easy for people to follow the information and to find something within the many chapters that's relatable to themselves. It means a lot to me. Thank you so much. And you're welcome. And I think the best way to kick off today is possibly talking about why why is anxiety so prominent in today's society everywhere? Yeah, everyone is noticing a spike up in their anxiety, and that was why I decided to name the book as such, Generation Anxiety. And, you know, sometimes people will say, well, every generation has had stressors, traumatic events. Why are we more anxious now? And I write a lot in the book about that. You look at what's called the generational power these incidents that are happening very much feel out of control. You know, when we look at what's happening with the climate crisis around the world, we're seeing higher incidents of violence happen. I'm, I'm here in the US and, you know, the gun violence that we have here in this country, for example, is incredibly concerning. So you have all these situations. It's understandable that people are feeling anxious because the situation feels out of control. And what happens when we feel out of control? We feel helpless and we feel hopeless, which is a recipe to be anxious. And it's where the fear comes in. And unfortunately as well, another reason why it's so prominent is just because we have access to the information so quickly, so readily. And actually it's not just coming through the main news channels, it's coming through, I don't know, Dave down the road through TikTok. And anybody with access to social media can say what they want want, with whatever spin they want. And I'm constantly policing the information my children are telling me about things that are happening. I'm saying, it— that's just not real, it's not the fact, or they're completely— well, it's clickbait, isn't it? Um, but I mean, it's not just about TikTok. There really are some horrific things out there, and some things maybe in the past we, we didn't necessarily know about so much, but life more hectic. The more we see each other's lives, the more pressure we feel to be that person on Instagram, or to show that we're having it all and killing it all. Or, you know, bullying is now not just— you can't just walk away from the playground to get away from it. You can't just stay indoors because, you know, you can see why people are anxious because you sometimes can't get away from— yeah, Yes, yes. And at the same time, people are so isolated, right? Like, we're inundated with social media, so we see people talking in their faces, but we're not actually having like real deep face-to-face conversations and engagements as much anymore. So many people feel so lonely and isolated, and I think that's a big difference for these generations too. There's always been hard things going on, but at least we had community in that. People don't have community as much anymore, and who their best friends are, they're, they're missing those people. And they have too much time, as you say, when they are lonely or isolated, to ruminate over things that possibly we wouldn't have time to think about, and it can send us a little bit crazy. I mean, um, I'm very lucky that I live in a part of London that has quite a high level of community spirit. Even like the local shops have hundreds and hundreds of people who are fully aware of who they are, and it just seems to be a little bit more friendly. You can walk into any one of 10 pubs and you'll probably know somebody in it. It's, it's kind of a bizarre sector of London, and I do feel quite lucky. But, you know, I also have friends who, they don't go out anywhere, and all they have for their information, for their interactions, is online. And it's scary. It's really scary. Right. It is. It absolutely is. And that's something I write about in the book is we have to build deeper relationships with people where, like you say, you go in and you know someone at the store and you can have a conversation. I think that's part of the anxiety too. When we don't know each other, we lack trust with each other. And so now everybody is on edge with everyone else. Are you someone I can trust? Are you someone that's safe? And that just keeps our brain on constant high alert, and that's exhausting mentally but also physically too. It's the fear of the unknown. And if we're intentionally staying away from people because we're keeping— keep on being told, you know, don't go out and do this, don't do this, it's too dangerous, don't travel abroad, it's— yeah, it's kind of something that is a really dangerous circle, I guess. Um, but something that I found quite interesting, I mean, I suffer with different levels of anxiety. I can really get my head in a good space and I can think rationally. And I do want to talk about how you talk about deciphering between rational and irrational fears, but sometimes you just need someone to speak to you properly and calmly. And I kind of— I got this in this book. The one thing I was worried about, it would just happen to be I was reading that chapter about, okay, think about that happening. What would be the— what if the worst happened? Unpack it and think about how you deal with it. You know, if your partner of 10 years did split up with you, what would happen? And you would survive. Why would you be splitting up anyway? So I think it— what I think you talked about, the kind of the 10 minutes, the 10 hours, and the kind of the 10 years. Yes, the 10, 10, 10. Yeah, exactly. If you actually break it down and say, actually, if this did happen, or if you did get ill, how would you deal with it? And then you suddenly realize, but I would deal with it, and it would be okay. It would be a bit rubbish for a bit, but you'd figure it out. And then you suddenly said you stop panicking, and then the levels come down, and then you can think rationally again. And I, I must say, Rob, it's so helpful, because in theory I know that information, but we need someone to tell it to us as well in a way that's going to get a reminder. Yeah. And I found that— I'm so glad that stood out. It's so— well, and, you know, I, I see that with clients. They struggle with that, right? Of like, what if my worst fears came true? And that's one thing I wanted to include in the book, why we include very confidential, you know, de-identified narratives of client experiences, um, you know, really protecting people's identities, but to show the reader I do see people's worst fears come true, and they do get through to it on the other side. You know, I think we often really doubt our human grit and resilience, but it's pretty powerful. And I see that a lot as a clinician, just how capable people are. And they look back and they say, oh yeah, like, that was really hard, but I got through it. I got through it. The problem is, is that when we are suffering with anxiety, rational thought doesn't necessarily come that easily to us. And I also thought it was good that you talked about— I mean, there are the benefits of talking therapy, but you also talk about the alternative ways of gaining your power back, whether it is using, um, medication or facing your fears in such a variety of different ways. And I did— one thing that I absolutely love doing, and I try and do it with my friends all the time, is reframing. And not only did you talk about reframing, but you gave scenarios where people could actually identify themselves in a scenario and try and think about how they can best— either if they're helping a friend who's got anxiety, being an enabler, or, you know, different ways that people can actually help themselves or help other people. It's helpful. Right, right. Oh, good, good, good. Yeah, you know, I'm a bit of a behaviorist at heart because our brain gives us all kinds of unhelpful messages all the time. And that's something that I wanted to normalize because a lot of people think, what's wrong with me that I'm having these negative thoughts? And it's like, no, this is just the human brain. Like, this is what it tends to do. It's a nightmare. So you can— right, you can either show yourself behaviorally that you are capable of those things that you're afraid of doing, and also, like you're saying, reframe those thoughts, shift perspective, because we can't control the initial thought. What we can control is the response to that thought. That's the intervention point. Uh, so I'm so happy to hear that part stood out for you because I think a lot of people, they really buy into the negative thoughts the brain is telling them, and then understandably we feel anxious or depressed as a result of that. Well, that's when it comes into, again, what you talk about in the book about reconditioning the brain, you you know, focusing on daily gratitude. And it is just a case of relearning a nicer way to speak to ourselves as well. And if we focus on what's good rather than what's bad— and it does take, it does take practice because your brain is just one big muscle and you've just got to kind of work it and work it to get it to work in a better way. But it's— we do need a reminder. We know we need to speak to ourselves better, but I think sometimes with the science behind it, it pushes us forward to do it more and understand what it's actually doing to us.