Nadine Benjamin MBE, Mental Strength over Long Covid and Cancer

Hello and welcome to the fifth edition of Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte on women's radio station, the program where we search for the most amazing female artists on the classical panorama. Today on Future Classic Women Awards, we will be talking to our guest, you know, one of our favorite from future Classic Women Awards, past nominees and winners, Nadine Benjamin. Good morning, Nadine. Good morning. So lovely to be with you. Very nice talking to you. It's been a while, I think, since we talked last time and you've done so many things. I mean, it's incredible how your career just, you know, has gone to the stars. Basically. You've been at the Opera awards, you are a regular of the major opera theaters. So tell us, tell us a little bit. How are you doing? Well, you know what, I'm doing really well. I mean, as we know, like everybody had to. Is still recovering from lockdown. You know, every artist is still coming back to it in their own way. And for myself, really, it's really been about staying focused and staying true to my heart. And having that experience has made me just realize that I've just got to do the things that I love and you know, mostly the things that I love. Singing things like Verdi, Strauss and being in big theaters inside my work as with everybody can, which, you know, is a, you know, to serve in a community of artists over 35. Mm. Yeah. And I just love. Yeah, I'm just loving being in that space at the moment. I'm not sure where you want me to start. So you. Well, first of all, you know, you mentioned the lockdown. Would you like to tell us what you. You brought us a wonderful song that is your own composition together with Michael Kapture Younger and it's called One moment Please. So that's quite exciting is this. I know you've composed other songs, but why have you chosen this one? So, you know, the partnership that I had with Michael, actually, we've just, just literally, because this is just with piano that you'll be hearing this song. We've moved it forward. He's now orchestrated it and we did it for the first time the other day at the Porcelain works, which was just amazing with the English string orchestra. It was really scary at first actually because, you know, the sound world of the piano, which is really percussive sometimes writing compared to the orchestration was so different and. Yeah. But it was just really lovely to put it out there for the first time and I hope it has more life in another way. And the BBC during the lockdown said to me, dean, what have you been doing? We know you do a plethora of. Of things to do with music. How about we listen to one of your compositions? And, you know, Michael and I had been conversing during lockdown and I just, you know, I. He. He sent me this kind of chords on the piano. No, you can write something to this, Nadine. And then I just came back to him with this kind of melody and lyrics, and we just kind of work together to kind of integrate it and see how we could make this piece happen. And One Moment, Please was born. It's about love. It's about lost love. And it's about where your heart is wishing to say sorry. To make up for the past, to make up for that moment. And you realize that it's not going to take anything away. But if that person would just stop and take a moment and heal it, then we could both move on. Well, I would like to listen to the song straight away and then we talk more about these. So let's listen to One Moment, Please. Composed by Nadine Benjamin and Michael Carter Younger. That is a song that she wrote during they lock down. One moment, please. There. There is a fee to pay. One moment, please. Have you got nothing to say? Years. I've waited. For some kind of love. Yes, I belonged for this hope from above. Please let me we speak. Don't turn away from our love. Deep with air it has wings over dust. For some kind of love. Yes, I've longed for this hope from above. So please, so please I'm sorry. So please my heart Please, please forgive me. Forgive me. And this was One Moment, Please sang and performed and composed by Nadine Benjamin and Michael Young. Carter Younger. So, Nadine, you were telling us about the lockdown. Where were you during the lockdown? Were you in London? Yeah. No, I was in East Sussex. I'm a East Sussex gal. I was lucky enough to be by the sea. But I wasn't allowed. Hell, oh, gosh. And I wasn't allowed out because I was told that, you know, that due to my lung condition and my, you know. You know, everything that was happening to me at the time because I. I did get long Covid, unfortunately, that I wasn't allowed to leave the house. Quite interesting to me. But, you know, you. You were on. You were on with me as well during that lockdown period as well, weren't you? Because I did all those interviews as well. I did over 100 interviews. Wow. Artists. And from different, you know, methods and different life spans. And we just I just wanted to make a space or a platform to people to understand that, you know, all was not lost and that there were many careers and many different ways of looking at things in their lives. And so being with people like yourself and coaches and, you know, entrepreneurs, you know, people that were really adapt to keeping their finger on the pulse and swifting and pivoting and changing was really amazing. But it also helped for artists to see that, you know, people in those positions still had other things that they had to deal with, whether they be emotional or the challenges of life and get to really hear their quick tips on how to deal with them. Can I ask you a very personal question then? You know, when you were told that you got long Covid being a singer and not opera singer, how were you feeling? Were you scared? I wasn't scared. I wouldn't say that I was scared, but I, you know, I'm very. I suppose one of my kind of privileges is that I studied last 22 years as a life coach. So I'm all about the mind and how the mind works and the focus of the mind. So I suppose for me it was how am I going to work with this in my life so I can still do what I love? So I was. Those were the questions I was asking. And what came up for me was, I've got long Covid, this is what's happening. I need to serve. So actually my singing went to one side and I realized that all this training that I had done as a certified high performance coach, an accredited NLP mind coach, a physical intelligence coach, I even trained as a psychotherapist for a couple years, a transpersonal psychotherapist, you know, so. And I realized that, you know, I had all this knowledge and actually this is where I was most needed. This was the place the everybody can place was most needed. And. And during that time, so I did eventually do some singing, ended up at Scottish opera, doing the Mother and the Witch in Hansel and Gretel. We did it without an audience, but we did. It was live streamed and that was really powerful. I ended up on the Royal Opera House stage for the first time as a soloist, working with Katie Mitchell. And so it was. There was lots of things I got to do because my focus was on serving and specifically not on singing. It was just like, what are my other skills as an artist that can serve this industry to get us through? So then the long Covid became a mission for me, I suppose, of how I could change the paradigm, the thinking around it. Well, I think this Covid is going to be remembered in history, really about how the whole world stood still. This is something that never ever happened before. And maybe if you can think about it like during the glacial era where suddenly all the dinosaurs disappeared. So somehow we had a very brief challeng that would destroy all humanity and instead we got together. So that was very, very powerful. And it's amazing that you could do it through your music. And as you said, yes, the mission being a musician is not just being a passion, isn't it? It's really a mission to share something, to share a message, to share harmony, to share being together. And in this case of COVID I guess it was a moment, a mission, Hope. Yes. And that's what my name means, you know, Stefania. My name, Nadine, means hope. Oh, I didn't know that. Wow, that's. That's crazy. That's impressive. Well, so Nadine, the next song that we're gonna listen to is by Schlafingen and it's one of Stau's four last songs. And this is a special, special performance that is together, you know, in connection with the copy. Would you like to tell us about this? Yeah. So I was, you know, some. We'd gone back to theaters a little bit and. And this was only last year. My gosh, it seems like forever, but it was only last year. Oh, wow. And it was. I was with the London City Orchestra, they're an amazing orchestra in London. And they ask. They had asked me four years ago to sing the four last songs with them. But in the middle Covid happened, etc. As soon as we got out of it a bit, they asked me to come and sing those songs with them. Unbeknownst to them and to most people at that time, what had happened is in that time I had been told I only had two weeks to three months to live. And I had from the long Covid, it had affected all of my organs. And so I had bronchiolitis, I had trigeminal. Trigeminal neuralgia. I had water on my heart. So the doctors were saying, we don't advise you to sing. It's not a good idea, because if you overstress yourself, you could die in a second. Wow. It was quite a big thing for me. And you know, and I kind of thought, actually, I've just got to have faith by himself. The four last songs are kind of like my calling card in the. In the world. I find them really easy to sing. I remember the first time I sang them was At Dartington. It's a summer school and. But it's also a festival. And I got to sing them for the first time in the festival with orchestra with Diego Masson, who was conducting. And I remembered that he gave me such a gift with these. With these songs. And so it ended up, I think, again, that they came up again when a very famous singer couldn't sing them. And I was asked at the last moment could I come and sing them, And I. I turned up and went and sang them at another engagement. And the audience said, we came expecting to be disappointed, but we were not. And I just realized that these songs have such an emotional thing for my heart, my voice, and my craft. And I said, why turn down this opportunity to sing them with orchestra at the Cadogan Hall? You know, I need to show up. I'm going to do it. And, you know, if I fell down dead in that moment on the stage, I would be doing it in a. In a moment of something that I. I'm here to tell the tale. And I wasn't, you know, I wasn't completely happy with my performance, but I. But I remember just saying, no, this is the best of what I have right now. And live performances like that, you. What we're going to hear is a live performance. Yeah. And it's just to remember that I had all those things wrong with me at that moment, or all those things happening to me at that moment. My body was kind of failing. And I also, at that time, had had a tumor on my brain as well. And all of these things were happening to me all at the same time. And I still got up and sang and my voice still worked, and my craft, because it's bigger than me. As artists, we recognize that what we do is bigger than us. That's. That's an incredible story. And I. You cannot comment. To be honest, there is nothing you can add to what you shared with us, apart from the fact it's incredible, the power that sometimes is pushing you to do something. We were talking about mission, and despite anything that can happen to you physically, as a person, no matter what, if you are destined to do this, you will be doing it. And I'm glad you're still here with us. I was very lucky. You know, my spouse and I, we were able to just keep asking the right questions, surgeons go and see the. The right doctors. I'm really lucky to have someone in my life that really cares and loves me and have mentors and people around me that do the same. And I would be nowhere without the people in my life. Wonderful. Well, let's listen to Strauss Pim Schlafingen with the. Sang by the beautiful Nadine Benjamin with the London Symphony Orchestra and conducted by Thomas Pine. Ra. Sam. Satan. And this was Strauss by Schlafingen, sang by our guest Nadine Benjamin with the London Symphony Orchestra conducted by Thomas Pyne live at Cadog and all. Nadine actually didn't ask you what does it mean by Schlagengen? It. We have all the different Spring, summer, it's. So the four last songs are kind of like a season. Well, I call them a season of life. I see. Yeah. When I. When I. When I think of them, we start at the beginning with going through life and like coming out in the birth. And the next song goes on to kind of being like a teenager. And then we come to blame Schlafingen and we look at us being in the center of our life and going, oh, what. What has happened? Because. Because by going sorry means, you know, going to sleep. And. And you look. It's like somebody looking back at all their life. What happened. So that's where we. What's. That's what we. I suppose where I was in part of my life just looking back and going, what happened? And am I ready to sleep? I wasn't ready to sleep, but I thought it was very active. Wonderful. Well, the next song we're gonna listen to that you wrote for us is the complete opposite is Ritorna Vincitoro by Aida Verdi. And this is definitely, I think, is a kind of summarizing what you've done. So you came back as a winner. Tell us a little bit. This is from your 2018 Love and Prayer album that you recorded with Nadine Benjamin Opera Ensemble. But tell us a little bit more about, you know, your journey so far. Where are you today? So you mentioned you performed at the. On stage at Rare Opera House. Was that the most exciting thing you've done so far or is there more? I think there's always more. And, you know, we're evolving humans. Humanity is an evolving. And I just went recently to great success Eno English National Opera with what's been going on with them. Their season has been. Their last two seasons have just been phenomenal. And they've had packed houses and we. I just did a show called Blue written by Janine Tesori and written. And the libretto is by Tazewell Thompson. And it talks about, you know, the. The. The journey of a family and the. I played the mother in this family and I had such an amazing journey with this piece because we were talking about what was going on with, in the States with police officers and young black men, the lives of, of them, and what the family or the mother and the parents have to keep reminding. This boy, the father was also a police officer, so he was a black police officer as well. And we look at just the different phases of the church and the society and community and family and what that means to lose a child and what that means to want to protect the ones that you love. And it really cost me this show because it meant I had to look at what was going on around me and, you know, and allow my heart to be really taken on a journey and to see the suffering that happens, but also the celebration of what happens when a community sticks together and gets things changed. So, yeah, it's a powerful, powerful story. I hope we get to put it on again at. You know, I know that it was life changing for audiences and I've since spoken to so many people who have said to me, Nadine, I really didn't take the time to think, you know, what this, this, how this would affect someone's life really made me change not just my own family life, but how I treat other people in the world. So it was very successful in that, in that space. But it's, but it's, but it's also. We worked with a director called Tineuku Craig and she, she is from the theatre and she, she also does some musical theatre as well, which was great. And Janita's always mostly a musical theatre writer, opera. So we had these, we had. The storytelling was just so great because it was, you know, some of the, you know, allowed me to express other musical genres that I've been involved in, which were jazz and pop and blues and, you know, and to really expand myself on stage. So it really allowed me to step in fully as a, as a full artist. And Taniku Craig, the way she looked at the text meant that everybody was always on the same page and the ensemble were just us as an ensemble. The whole. We're just so great together. Well, you know, I'm a huge, huge fan of the English National Opera. I think it's like the best way to bring opera to the bigger audience because it's all in English, you know, as, you know, Italian is one of the main languages used to be, at least for opera. And language was a barrier for the audience to understand it completely. In music in general, in classical music, you have the opportunity, you know, the fact that there is no words when it's instrumental, so you just have to go with your feelings. But when you have an opera and there is a story that is told to you, sometimes the words are as important as the music itself. So to be able to understand the words, I think it's something that really, it needs to be protected. And what is incredible is that only the English National Opera, and if you like the uk, are the one translating operas in their language. No other country does that. And that's a big miss because sometimes you don't have. It's not as easy to follow the subtitle, for example, because they're in the wrong position, etc. So I mean, all these trouble that happened with the English National Opera are being pushed out of London and we're still talking about these. I mean, did you perform at the London Coliseum near Trafalgar Square? Did you? Yes, that's where Blue was. Exactly. And that's such a fantastic theater. It's in the heart of London and I think this deserves to stay there, to be honest. I understand that there is other cities that will benefit from having the English National Opera there, but then there is the English National Tour opera, isn't it? So they tour always. So then they could countries. I mean, I think we must never forget that English National Opera are always wishing to reach audiences all over the world. Exactly. They've put themselves, you know, I sang at the Eurovision this year because of them and you know, that was international, you know, so there is, you know, I know within Eno's mission is to make sure that they bring opera to everyone. And that was the, the ethos of English National Opera when it was first started, that the English National Opera was for the people. Yes. Opera in its original state was for the people. So it's really important that we don't take away that landmark, so to speak, that home of the people. That building is phenomenal to sing. Yes. Yeah, it's, it's, it's so wonderful for the Voice and, and it's home to our British artists as well. You know, the UK based artists, the ones that were, you know, trained here. And it's, it's a great performance ground for them to then take their artistry all over the world, sharing it in another level, on a European level, on an international level. So, you know, I think, I think there's been something missed here. We're not, we're not seeing the full picture like yourself. I completely understand that. We have to, you know, make sure that everyone else is supported as well within the Community. It's not about just saying we take away from one, so one. So one stays. And it's nothing to do with that. It's about appreciating the quality of what we have here in the UK and to also allow that to flourish so that other countries, other cities feel great enough to come and perform with us as well. Absolutely. All right, so now we're gonna listen to Ritorna Vincitor. That's in Italian, and that's from Aida by Verdi. If our audience doesn't know. Would you like to put, you know, the context of when Aida is singing Ritorna Vincitore? Yes. She's at this point in the opera where it's kind of at the beginning. She's on stage. Well, I'm on stage alone, shall I say? And I'm having to choose between the man I love and the queen I serve, you know, or the princess that I'm serving at the time. But I'm also wanting to serve my father as well. I'm actually a princess who has been enslaved in another community. And. And I'm. I'm asking, what do I do? Do I. Do I support the man that I love who isn't on my father's side or support my father? Or do I. Do I just do what is in my own heart and. And. And serve myself? So I think she talks about here return victorious. Yes, he will return victorious, but at what cost? And how do I, in my mentality, because it talks about how my brain is confused and I feel really pulled in this at this time. And then I. And then we come to a point in the area where I just say, please, God, have pity on me. Show me what to do. Allow me to be guided. Let me serve in the right way. Wonderful. So let's listen to Ritorno Vincitor from Aida. Of. Sam sa. Ram. Sa. Sam ra. Sa. K. How glorious this was Returna Vincitor from Aida Baiberdi, sang by our fantastic Nadine Benjamin. This was from her 2018 love and prayer album with the Nadine Benjamin Opera Ensemble, conducted by Kamal Khan. Nadine. So Aida, she was an Egyptian princess. Now there is another Egyptian queen, Cleopatra, on Netflix. Everyone is talking about these. Was Aida your favorite princess? Or for example, what we're gonna listen to after that is gonna be from Otallo Verdi. You're gonna be Desdemona, the beautiful wife of the doge of Venice. Well, Desdemona is something I'm going to be doing with the English National Opera coming up. I'm really looking forward to that because English National Opera are going to be doing the Seven Deaths of Maria Callas by Marina Abramovic. So I am going to be playing Desdemona. I see. It was really funny actually because Desdemona has been quite controversial for me and it's one of the reasons why Everybody can my mentoring company is is there the Everybody can mentoring company is there to serve the community of over of singers and creatives and conductors and directors and people over the age of 35 as to me they seem to be the forgotten age group. They could be new parents coming back into the industry. Some only have only developed enough to do what they wish to do at this time. Some have been sick, some have been had long Covid Some are their voices now just change. Some are just feeling that, that they have space and there's no platform for them. So what Everybody can has done is created a platform through the Everybody can content series has now started and it started in May. There's going to be a section in May, a section in July, a section in October culminating with a competition on the 18th of November and to celebrate over 35s within our industry beautiful classical music. And our next concert is a free concert. So all the concerts are free, we do them free because we want to make sure that the people are seen and that there's no, there's no barrier to them being seen because you never ever know who's in the audience. And we have an amazing mezzo. She was one of the runner ups in the Verdi competition with Fulham Opera, the Robert Presley Prize Verdi competition. Her name is Siv Iren Mizund and she will be accompanied on piano by Andrew Robinson who is one of our great coaches in the uk. She will be doing a program of song and opera from Verdi to Undine Smithmore to Leslie Adams to loads of wonderful composers from 7 till 8pm on Tuesday 30 May at the St Paul's Church, Covent Garden. And so please go and support if you can But I say this because St. Paul's Covent Garden have been the place that have been my vehicle every year for the last 15 years. I've done a free recital there in December and I remember being told and at the, at the time when I started everybody can and we did an opera and we did Desdemona and we did it through, we did it through the Otello, we did it through the eyes of domestic violence and post traumatic stress disorder and somebody said oh, why are you doing that? You're never going to sing Desdemona. You're black and you shouldn't be, you know, so that nobody's ever going to hire you as Desdemona. And, you know, you never say never to Nadine Benjamin, because she will just. Just like, I love that. To show you that it's possible because she believes that everybody can. So I put on Otello and I played Desdemona. And now on a main stage, I'm going to be singing Desdemona. So. So it's, you know, everybody can. Is really important. It's over 35, to be honest. Nadine. Nadine, to be honest with you, I think no one would believe you. You could be the stamina, because I cannot see someone to kill you like ote will do with the stamina because you're too strong. That's why not. Not for your color, but because everyone can see on stage yet not the fable little woman that can be killed by an abusive husband. But the thing is, is, you know, I have been with an abusive husband. I have been in that situation. You know, I have had vulnerability as a woman. And, you know, as artists, we bring our lives on stage, we bring our vulnerabilities on stage, you know, and just because we have strength in one area, we have a vulnerability that is also our strength. And showing everybody, which is why everybody can, for me, was really important, this mentorship level that as I can share with people how I've dealt with my challenges, how I've dealt with my opportunities, and also take them through a high performance program because I'm a certified high performance coach, where they get to go away each week, and I work with them for three months, and they get to go away each week and really look at why their lives are the way they are. And then they get to do some homework on it and come back to me the following week. And then we talk about courage, we talk about purpose, we talk about their goals, you know, we talk about the health. Health. You know, we take. I take people on a journey with me that gives windows of opportunity for them to say, oh, gosh, I could do this differently. Oh, my God, it's actually accessible to me. This is open to me as well, my thinking, you know, I can change my mind, you know, and so. And I believe that the competitions and everything, they stop at 35. I mean, for me, it's about making a safe space where people feel that they can come and sing again, where people feel that they can come and play again, you know, and whether they can rediscover and uncover hidden Qualities. Sorry. No, no, you're perfectly right. You know, this above 35, aging is such a, you know, a stigma. And we see it with people on television. We see with the presenters in TV show, they're saying that after a certain age, they don't hire you anymore. They only want them young. Look at the young and beautiful. Same with actors, that there were no parts in movies for older people apart from being, you know, side characters and not main characters. And people forget that we have the same exact problem in music. And so unless by 35, you are already, you know, broken up as an artist, you have a career that is already successful, you basically give up and, and, you know, threw away years and years of work that you've been doing and sacrifice that you've been doing to reach the level that you reached. And if you're lucky, maybe you can continue teaching. But many of them, they don't even go on teaching. They just change all together. Yeah, but I'm living proof that that's not true. Exactly. Yeah, you know, I'm living proof that actually, you know, you know, and I have a disability. I severely dyspraxic. I'm also Tourette's, you know, I come from, you know, you know, a very unprivileged background, you know, but, you know, but my mindset, the way I think is what has brought me forward. And I think it's really important that, you know, we spend as much time as we can really empowering our. Not just our over 35s, but also our under 35s in that way, that they have a choice and that they are their own gatekeeper keepers, actually. And I mean, I look at the work that you do, Stefania, and it's amazing. You're there, you're out there every day. You don't. You're not sitting on your heels or resting on your laurels, you know, and you have a family, you have children, you, you know, but you, but you don't. You don't. You don't make that something that stops you from being all that you can be. And you are one of our inspirational people in this industry. So, you know, it's. It's about letting us. Let's. Let's. Let's lose the script. Let's lose script that has been projected upon us. Let's start writing new scripts, new areas, new content, new music that expresses who we are now, not who we used to be. We are in a stage where social media can make any musician a star, can make any musician heard, you know, and Most musicians, you know, it's for me it's not even about, you know, can somebody be a star? You know, I really think that's important as well. Not to lay too heavy a weight on that. Do you wish to be a popular amateur singer? Someone who sings in a choir or an extra chorus member or a full time chorus member or professional jobbing singer or artist or you're a teacher but you sing. But you only sing one to three times a year because you, you want to practice your craft or you're just going to be a professional singer focused or a professional artist, focus on concerts and or one of the other. There are so many avenues to being who you wish to become, but it is that person's choice. They do have to choose, then they have to commit and then they have to practice committing. Yes, that's very true. That's very true. Well, let's listen now. Ave Maria from Otallo by Verdi sung by our fantastic guest Nadine Benjamin Wither Nadine Benjamin opera ensemble conductor Kamal Khan from Love and Praise album. Mar. Samor. Sam. No words to describe this fantastic piece by Verdi. This was Ave Maria from Otello sang by our own testimonial that is Nadine Benjamin with that Nadine Benjamin open ensemble conducted by Kamal Khan from her 2018 album Love. If you have any questions, unfortunately we are at the end of our future Classic Women awards so I would like to give a very big thanks for guest Nadine Benjamin for the great chat and the beautiful music play today. Thank you so much. It has been such a pleasure to be on this show. I love coming on here. You've got all such, such amazing. You just make it so easy to just be with you. It's amazing. Thank you so much. Thank you Nadine for everything you're doing for every everybody can I love your passion and if you can go and see this wonderful concert series organized by our fantastic guest Nadine Benjamin. If you have any questions that you would like to ask to our guest or nomination for our future Classical Women Awards, please email present us@womensradiostation.com or tweet us @womensradiostn. You've been listening to future Classic Women Awards of Women's Radio radio station live every day at 10aM and 10pM London time. And if you would like to listen to it again or catch up on our previous program, you can head to the presenter page Stefania Pasamonte Future Classic Women Awards on womensradiostation. Com. Thank you for listening.