[Speaker 1] (0:00 - 1:48) Hello, this is Anna Kennedy, and we're at All Things Autism. We're live and we're in Covent Garden, and it's not raining. Wow, yesterday it was just rain, rain, rain, rain, rain, rain. So I'm just back from the Northeast. I spent the weekend with my son Angelo. I'm very unsettled, found it really difficult. But you know, you have to persevere and we have to try new things all the time. And also talking about going to Middlesbrough and caring for Angelo during the night. It's carers week this week and one of the statistics that popped up on Twitter was 61% of carers in the UK said that they suffered physical ill health as a result of caring. Back, but I feel that the carers are the backbone of society looking after their loved ones for little or no money or little or no support. And obviously one of the big things for me is caring for my son is lack of sleep. And it's been 26 years that I've been living on three to four hours a night. So I'm going to talk a little bit more about sleep, about a sheet really, a help sheet. What can I call it? That's options as provided. So I'll be sharing that a little bit later. So my guests today are Fiona Whitelaw and Ella. Eleanor, how do you pronounce your name? Machen. Machen fortune. Machen fortune. Thank you for coming along to see me today. So I'll go over to Fiona Fest. So Fiona, you're a Londoner with a northern background, I believe, and you're a driving force as a writer and you like to tell stories that have not been heard within the voices of those not usually listened to. Your work on stage and screen spans a variety of genres. So tell me a little bit about what you do. And as I've already said to you, I work on film and and in theatre. [Speaker 2] (1:48 - 1:48) Okay. [Speaker 1] (1:49 - 12:08) And one of the things that your listeners might be interested in is that I've devised and delivered quite a lot of theatre projects in care homes and in sheltered housing. And I completely agree with you that that carers are very, very, very important in our society and need to be paid better and looked after. Most definitely. So, Eleanor, you're a young actress with an autistic spectrum condition with a passion for using the arts to tell stories and start conversations. You've also had an accomplished singer and a performer having trained at the British and Irish Institute of Modern Music and the Arts Educational School. Your most recent credits include Eve in the award-winning feature film, Just Charlie and the lead role in Katie in the indie drama Acceptable Damage, which we're going to be talking a little bit more about. So thank you for coming along today. No, thank you for having me. I'm a croaky voice and all. I know you're not very well, so a double thanks for coming along. No, not at all. So tell me a little bit about, can I ask you when you were diagnosed? Because I'm always interested to find out when people are diagnosed. Yeah. So officially, I got my official diagnosis when I was about 10. But I started seeing a specialist from being very, very small, from being a nursery, actually. There's a specialist called Rachel Golding who was quite a prevalent kind of, I think she was a psychologist, a psychiatrist at the time who was dealing with kind of autism and Asperger's. So yeah, my parents kind of first noticed it when I was a baby. Because I wasn't very mobile at all. I was all over the place, but I could speak for about nine months. So I would just chat to people and people would be like, what? Very confused by this chatty baby. But I developed a tick very, very early on, which I think kind of started the ball rolling with my mum and dad. And yeah, so I'm kind of, I suppose I consider myself lucky in that I've sort of always known. Yeah. But that has its pros and cons, as you know. It does. How was it for school for you? Oh, gosh, school was a nightmare. Yeah, I was still kind of in school during the time where people didn't really know much about autism. And because I was high functioning, there was a lot of, a very big lack of understanding. Let's just put it that way. We are making steps forward. We still got a long way to go. Okay, so Fiona, let's talk a little bit about the film. That's why we're here. So why did you make the choice to have Katie who's in the film and to have Asperger's syndrome? For a long time, I'd been making theatre with young people, with learning disabilities and young people on the spectrum. And it was my feeling of being working within that community that basically, similar to what Elena's describing, when people don't properly understand that you have a difference and that you need adjustments. That it was very easy for those people to be treated differently by society. However, the film does have a lead character with Asperger's, but also, I feel very strongly about anybody in society who gets othered, for whatever reason. So I think the film has a kind of broad look at othering in regards to Katie's character, but not just Katie. There are other characters in the film who I feel are... Okay, can you tell me a little bit about the film without giving the plot away? So just a little bit of a background. Yeah, so Katie is a teenager with Asperger's, who dreams of being a rock star. That's her passion. She writes songs. She's very talented. And she wants to realize those ambitions. And she's also a very loving, open, generous person. She's a very positive character. But she's being bullied. She's being attacked on the street. She's being attacked in her house. There is a gang of young people, some of whom she went to school with, attacking her home. And it's been going on for about a year when we meet them in the film. And I think if I tell you any more things, it will give away the plot. Okay, so basically, she's a vulnerable young woman, and she's being bullied. Okay, so how long is the film? It is 78 minutes, I think. Okay, and when was it first, Sean? It was first premiered at Regent Street Cinema early in March, sold out amazing, sold out screening. It was very exciting because making a film is such hard work for everybody involved. And you almost forget that there's going to be something wonderful at the end when you get to the screening. Because even making even all of that is extremely hard work. Well, the screening was how long? 18 months after we actually finished? Yes. Filming. So the film is such a bizarre beast in that way. With theatre, you kind of have that immediate gratification, don't you? You don't have that with film at all. It's very bizarre. So what kind of feedback have you had from audiences who've watched it? It's been predominantly a big conversation starter. I mean, we had a screening out in, was it Harlow? The one that we went to, and the couple, there was a couple in the audience, and they just popped in to see it. And it kind of transpired that the woman of the couple, she was doing some work on young people with autism. And they stayed to chat to us afterwards. And they kind of were just like, so happy and pleased to finally see something where you're telling a story that has somebody with autism or ASD, or I suppose is what you want to call it, everybody's got different words that they like. I know I have my terms, I like them. But yeah, so that was really amazing. And it was really, it's so easy when you're involved in a project, especially for as long as Fiona and I have been involved with this project, because I met Fiona doing this when it was a script for a play, many, many years ago. And when you've been with a project for such a long time, and it means so much to you, then to finally hear kind of, as you might say, an average Joe, you know, really getting something from the film and just being really pleased to see finally some stories being told with those kinds of characters. At the forefront, it just makes you just feel like you're doing your job right. And you know, I think I know I don't feel like I ever see characters that represent me on screen. So it was really nice that somebody else could see that. And I knowledge that. So that was wonderful. Yeah, there's more and more programs and films now that have got characters in with autism. Mostly the A word has been quite successful, even though it got quite a bit of backlash. And usually you see the backlash on Twitter, social media can be fantastic, but can also be very negative. So I think people need to be open minded. And it's just like, if we're talking about autism, if the public is talking about autism, isn't that a positive thing that we're highlighting, you know, the awareness raising, the acceptance, isn't that what it's all about? That's the way I look at it. So there's going to be a third screening of the A word, I believe, happening. I've been to both premiers. I thought it was very well done. And there's lots of other films that I've seen. The Good Doctor, I think that's on Sky. That's something else that I've watched. So I think that anything that they're all males, though, aren't they? Yeah, they are males with autism. I think that's a big thing for me is that I'm really pleased that I'm really happy that these stories are being told. Please don't get me wrong that, but I'm just kind of ready for the tropes to go away. Yeah. So yeah, I'm kind of ready to see us explore the spectrum more. Have you actually watched it? Because I know some actors don't actually watch themselves on film. Have you watched it? Oh, I've seen acceptable damage many times. Too many times. Thank you very much. You're quite critical of yourself. Yes, incredibly. God, I hate watching myself. The very first time we had just an industry screening for cinema bookers and things, Ellie was like, I'm just going to sit on the stairs right at the back in case I need to run away. I'm like, okay. I honestly, I was so uncomfortable. I just sat on these little stairs hidden away from everybody at the back of the screening room because I was just like, oh God, well, if it's too much and I need to, yeah. So yeah, I don't like watching myself. No, I don't think most actors don't like watching themselves. It must be quite scary, though. So something that's come from a seed, then it's gone to a script and then it goes on screen. It must be quite nerve wracking money spent, time spent, editing, rendering, or whatever else you want to go into. It must be. So I don't know. I think I'd probably be sick the night before. Yeah. So I'm so pleased that you've come in to talk to me about it. So we're going to talk a little bit more about it in the second half. So if people are listening in and would like to ask questions, there's going to be a piece written and there's going to be on the charity website. So if you're interested in reading it in the next few days, it's going to be on www.annakennedyonline.com. If you'd like to be one of my speakers on the radio show, All Things Autism, please write it into me again at Anna Kennedy Online, or I'm on Twitter at Anna Kennedy One, Instagram, Anna Kennedy OBE, or Anna Kennedy Online on Facebook. We're going to be sharing your Twitter feed. And so if people want to talk to you and ask you questions of somebody might be interested in acting, they might like to chat to you well enough and say what they need to do. So we are going to be moving on now to the second part very soon. Welcome to Women's Radio Station. I'm Sarah Louise Ryan and welcome to Love Lessons Live on Women's Radio Station. [Speaker 2] (12:08 - 12:11) Hello and welcome to Future Classic Women Awards with news. [Speaker 1] (12:11 - 20:24) Hello and welcome to June May is listening. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy, and we're at Women's Radio Station supporting women's wellbeing and we're talking all things autism. Women, the possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. Hi, I'm Farguni Desai of Action Coach. Are you a business owner with more than five employees? Do you want to grow your business? I'm a London based business coach who helps small and medium sized businesses to grow and make a profit. I will help you identify the strengths and weaknesses in your business and then work with you to improve it using a structured framework. To find out more, contact me on 07721 654 640 and book your one hour complimentary one-to-one coaching session. Thank you. Hi, I'm Tracy Weeden of Brown Hill Insurance Group. We are an award winning family run insurance broker covering a wide range of insurance products ranging from commercial lines to personal household, high net worth and fine art. You can contact us on 0208 658 4334 or visit our website www.brownhillgroup.co.uk for your free no obligation quotation. At Brown Hills we've got you covered. Hi, I'm Hazel Butterfield, a blogger, book lover and mental health advocate, and you can listen to my show Get Booked here at Women's Radio Station daily at 5am and 5pm. Throughout my shows we'll talk about the books I've read, new releases, chapter authors, publishers and book enthusiasts, all with a theme and aim of supporting women's emotional well-being. If you have a book to tell us about, get in touch at presenters at womensradiostation.com. Join me on my show and share my love of books and writing. Hi, I'm Valentina Barbachi and I'm the executive director of Media Matters for Women. We're a registered charity operating in Sierra Leone and the Democratic Republic of Congo, and we produce and share podcasts via Bluetooth and mobile phones, focusing specifically on women and girls excluded from information due to extreme poverty. We empower those living in rural areas with media that transforms how they access, own and share information. To find out more and be part of this movement, come check out our website at mediamattersforwomen.org. You're listening to Women's Radio Stations, creating a global network for the empowerment of women and we want you to be involved. Join us on Instagram and Twitter at Women's Radio Station, that's Women's Radio STN, or Facebook Women's Radio Station to keep up to date with all our exciting programmes. Hello, this is Anna Kennedy and we're talking all things autism. We're live in Covent Garden. At the beginning of the show I briefly spoke about Carers Week. You might want to know what is Carers Week? It's an annual campaign to raise awareness of caring. A lot of people care for their loved ones and they don't realise they can actually apply for benefits because they think, oh well I'm caring for my husband or my wife or my daughter or my son, but you can actually check out to make sure that you're not entitled to anything. There are challenges from paid carers and to recognise the contribution that they make to families and the community. So if you check out Carers Week and Google it, you'll find out lots of information on there and apparently there are 6.5 million people in the UK who are carers. They'll be looking after a family member or a friend with a disability, mental or physical illness or who needs extra help as they grow older. So Eleanor, tell me a little bit about the challenges you faced playing this particular role? I always think as an actor, any role that you have has its own challenges of course. I think for me a big one, because this is my second time on screen playing autistic as it were, and I think it's really important to make sure that you are not bringing too much of yourself to the part because ultimately Katie's not me and Katie's experiences whilst there are some very very very similar correlations are not the same as my lived experience. And so trying to make sure that you are playing the absolute truth of that character whilst also using the understanding and experience that you have being someone that lives with the same neurological disorder, sorry I never know what the right term to use is, but it's really challenging because I mean, myself and Fiona talked a lot about Katie and the definite similarities with us as people, which is why I loved her so much. And I loved that she was a positive character, I loved that in the face of all adversity she remains this kind of beacon of light and just truth and she's just an inherently good person and I think that's really wonderful to have somebody with autism kind of portrayed in that way. So it was hard because I'm very cynical that Katie was not, and so it's always hard trying to separate yourself. I know there were a couple of scenes where I had to be very very very, basically had to have a meltdown and being able, oh horrible, it was hard, it was really really hard because you kind of have to put yourself, I mean no fairly more than that, knows anyone with autism or if you're living with autism, meltdowns are the worst and they are really, they can make you feel very unsafe and so you need to be made to feel very very safe if you're going to then replicate all of those on screen. And so the kind of couple of times I had to do that within the film, I very much had to take on the idea of you're being an actor right now, you're not being Elle, you're not being you, if you're a good actor you should be able to draw on your experience but not make it dangerous for yourself. So that was definitely hard, really really hard. So having the meltdown, did you have to have sort of a little bit of time to yourself afterwards because imagine it would take everything out of you? I sat at the top of the stairs sobbing into the gaffer's arms, who was lovely. Yeah before one of the scenes I kind of sat, I had some music on and I just asked to have some space for myself and yeah a big thing for me was just being able to have my own space which isn't always that possible on a low budget film set where you're crammed into corridors and things but I made it work. That's the most difficult part I would say of looking after my youngest son Angelo because obviously he's got minimal verbal skills so he can't tell me. So for example when we were driving to Middlesbrough and there was so much traffic it normally takes me four hours and it took me seven hours to get there and then halfway there we were on the motorway and he just went into a meltdown and he sits at the back because he tends to touch everything when I'm and he I just thought I can't do anything and it just made me feel so helpless and he's slapping his head he was getting so upset slapping his ears and then I just thought I was just trying to do whatever I could turn everything off and as in music wise and just thought I've just got to go with it here and just sort of afterwards you could see he was totally drained and then I was just sort of saying it's okay Angelo but you just do the best you can concentrating on the road as well as watching him through the mirror to make sure he's [Speaker 2] (20:24 - 20:24) okay. [Speaker 1] (20:25 - 20:47) These are the sort of things that people don't realize when you have a you know and he's he's not a child he's an adult and he started to do new things now where for example he's in the bath and he started turning the hot water tap on he's never done that before and these are the things you have to be on alert all the time. I find that really interesting so are you saying about him developing new things? Yeah. That started happening to me recently. [Speaker 2] (20:47 - 20:47) Okay. [Speaker 1] (20:49 - 59:36) I'm like I didn't think this was supposed to happen. Yeah. I thought I thought I'd got it all out not out my sister but like I thought I knew everything that I knew about how my autism affects me. Yeah. And I'm still finding new little I've got a new tick now which I find it's it's easier to disguise my new one my new stem rather. Okay. It's easier to disguise but I do it incessantly now and it's really funny because I it's just one that's just come out of the blue. Okay. But yeah it's interesting isn't it? So Fiona if you don't mind me asking Eleanor what feedback been like about Eleanor's character Katie and how she plays the character? You can put your hand over your ears I mean the feedback that we've had from everybody about the performances in the in the film has been stunning and in fact somebody rang me yesterday while I was in the bank and was just going on and somebody who's told me this several times but was like I can't imagine those actors as anybody else she's just completely overwhelmed with the story. We've had and we still keep getting feedback and that was somebody who came to the premiere in March. Okay. And the other most significant feedback that we've had from as Eleanor put it ordinary Joe's as in not anybody we know not anybody in the film business has been about the representation in the film so not just a representation of having Eleanor play Katie but also the diversity within the cast we have a character who's deaf who's played by a deaf actress and quite a lot of people have mentioned another of the characters Roxy because he's a very positive character and often young people are portrayed in a very negative way in the media and people have really noticed the difference in this film. But I think we've given the title of the film so it's called Accidental Damage. Acceptable damage. You tell about three hours sleep. Acceptable damage so why that title? A very long time ago the working title for the project was The Last Acceptable Victim and then I changed it during the development to Acceptable Damage and I think of it in terms of when there's a war you describe casualties human casualties as collateral damage and to me in our society at the moment there are groups of people who are like social collateral damage and people who are not being looked after well enough whose well-being is not being considered and that's why. Thank you for that. So if people are interested in finding a little bit more about the film or they'd like to come and see it where can they look? We're hoping to have some more cinema screenings later on in the year but for now our film is released by Evolutionary Films. It's been in some Cineworld cinemas and as I mentioned in Regent Street Cinema but you can also watch it online. Oh you can? So you can watch it on Amazon, you can watch it on Sky Store, you can watch it on Google and I believe iTunes as well so it's pretty easy to find. Okay and there's the trailers if somebody wants to have a look at the trailer. If you want to watch the trailer you could probably just google it, it will come up, it's on YouTube, there are reviews, you can follow us on Twitter at acceptabled if you want to know news about it there's a Facebook page it's pretty easy to find. Okay so we were talking about the possibility of doing a screening for people on the spectrum so maybe when you have more details you can share it with me and I can put it on the charity website so if people keep checking it out and then that's something we have wanted to do right from right from day dot right from the beginning so yeah. Have there been any challenges Eleanor about playing this character apart from the meltdowns? Is there anything you just think oh I don't know if I can do that? Yeah okay again with not wanting to give too much away there is a particular scene in the film that I was always slightly nervous about okay because it kind of involved a lot of negativity being thrown my way and we had an incredibly tight and rigorous filming schedule so being allowed the time to practice what was going to happen in a safe way wasn't that possible okay and so that was there was a brief moment where I thought to myself like okay am I going to be all right after this but I am also a professional actor so I then you know you crack on and you cry at home instead. So where was it actually filmed? All over the place wasn't it yeah yeah so a lot of the filming happened in London and also just just outside okay yeah I'm a great advocate as people know for performing arts because it started off with my anti-bullying campaign give us a break so that's where Autumn's Got Talent was born so we're really excited that in two weeks time we're going to St Ives and we're going to be doing the Autumn's Got Talent road show so we've got performers so we've got singers we've got dancers we have a magician and Harvey Price who is Katie Price so he's going to be performing on stage so that'll be amazing so that's exciting he came to watch our show at the mermaid theater he absolutely loved it and you know what he was so sweet because he was shouting words of encouragement to the performers on stage so that was so lovely so we're excited about that I'm going to be working with Phil Barnet and kids or us and St Ives is such a beautiful place as well so it'll almost be like a mini holiday for me so two nights away from my family that's the only time that I'm away from my family um in the uh so that's like a little holiday for me the only thing I don't like about St Ives are their seagulls they are the biggest seagulls I've ever seen so but I'm really looking forward to it and so is my team again if you want to be one of my um guests on um women's radio station and please contact me on www.annakennedy online welcome to the women's radio station supporting women's well-being women's radio station is all about diversity from opinions career ethnicity education and most importantly women's well-being we aim to celebrate the individuality of every woman everywhere providing opportunities and the platform for your voice visit our website women's radio station for more information hi I'm Liz Van Linden the UK travel consultant for hazelmaid travel people come to me as they want unique experiences and a personalized service this happens from the moment that they inquire till they come back here I work with luxury tour operators you can contact me on 07825 4412 12 and Liz spelled L I S at hazelmaid travel.co.uk I'm Tamina Zaman founder of empower and enrich when it comes to money do you clam up or get confused do you wish you could save more money or are you hoping you have enough for retirement you are not alone many women want to be smarter with their cash but just don't know where to start at empower and enrich.org you will find a host of options to help you take charge of your finances and learn how to put your money to work for you in an easy affordable way get in touch with me at empower and enrich.org and let's change your future together hi I'm Carolyn van Beers please join me for a brand new show here on women's radio station it's mother's hour if like me you're a mum juggling far too many balls and dropping most of them this is definitely the show for you we'll examine the highs and lows of motherhood and make sure you laugh out loud as we take on this 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even my guests today or Elena and Fiona so I was talking a little bit about sleep difficulties I was reading that sleep difficulties are reportedly experienced by as many as 18% of children and young people with autism and as a result most parents will also struggle with their own sleep obviously the topic of the day is sleep today because I've had not very much at all this last week so top tips I was reading is be consistent follow the same bedtime routine keep the environment simple and relaxing find a way to reward good behavior in the moment when it happens try to avoid your child napping in the day I tried to catnap I just can't seem to do it um try to avoid nighttime drinks and snacks now Angelo has always drunk just lemonade or a little bit of orange juice and he watches his brother drink Pepsi max and I didn't know that Pepsi max is like drinking those energy drinks apparently it's got lots of ginseng so I'm thinking no Angelo that's not happening now so and also don't be put off things initially if they get worse change can take time so if you go onto the options website they have lots of help sheets on there um so that's a little bit of a snippet from one of their sleep help sheets so I might need to go and look some of that up oh yeah some sleep remedy so Fiona and Ellie whoever wants to go first what projects are you working on next I am looking excited yeah I am I'm always excited a number of different things um as a writer I'm about to embark on writing a one woman show for a deaf actress that's about um uh the nurse in Romeo and Juliet after Juliet has died I had my first meeting about that on Thursday so that'll be exciting I'm um edging towards um making a film uh which current working title is tin goods um it's about um women against pick closures so women in the in the minor strike 84 85 and today I just had an email from a really amazing actress who is happy for me to put her her to associate her name with the project for one of the characters so I can't say who it is but it's very very exciting and it takes a long time to make a project happen so step by step by step so that's your northern roots with the mining is it coming out there possibly what about you um so I actually have another kind of film in the pipeline at the minute that I'm associated with um it's called penny walked um currently trying to get part of the funding for it at the moment we've got a lot um but we just need a little bit more um kind of through crowdfunding and things to make it happen but this is also about um a young woman so she's a bit older okay she's kind of a young adult um who has us burgers and um it's kind of got a mixture of like fantasy of kind of element in it in that she um she draws and kind of escapes into her kind of world that she draws and creates um but I mean the script's absolutely beautiful um and um you know really really really hope that this can get made because we just need some more stuff out there with females with you know with no diversity I don't think that's enough you think crowdfunding I always worry about crowdfunding and I'm thinking does it actually work can you get the funding so I mean this isn't specifically my project um this is um seahorse films who um did just charlie which is my first feature um that kind of did really well um and it's it's a short film that they're doing um and um I've kind of I'm kind of consulting on it and we'll probably also be in it okay um and so yeah I mean this is the first time that I know the company has had to use crowdfunding yeah um and it's been a little bit like what do we do with this um I know I have some friends who are um kind of youtubers and influencers and they do really well whenever they do anything with crowdfunding okay but I think unless you really know how to use social media and get people hyped up for what you're creating it's hard it's really hard I think you need to be consistent as well I think with me I've been on social media for such a long time and people tend to think that somebody does my social media but no I do it all myself because I'm mad and um I just think it has to come from me because it's like it's my you know my day to day what I'm doing my project so and I enjoy doing it um so yeah so that's something you do sometimes get some very little negative feedback because you've got people that I call keyboard warriors you've got people that are sitting on the fence and it's just like I've never been nasty to anyone well I hope I haven't intentionally been horrible to anyone and I just think why why do people have to do that I just I just don't understand so but um that's just me wanting a little bit there can I just ask you one question um Eleanor do you like to call Eleanor or Ellie or don't you mind I go by many many names Eleanor, Elle, Ellie, Jellybean, Squidge any of the above if I'm so um say if somebody's interested who's on the spectrum that might like to go into the world of performing arts where would you say that they start that's a big question I mean I started off doing amateur dramatics and went to a youth theatre okay um I would recommend smaller youth theatres yeah um rather than your big kind of I mean I don't want to drop any names but there are some kind of larger Saturday school type things I that do cost a lot of money and I I didn't really get on very well in that environment okay um I went to a much smaller youth theatre um and I just think if you are it's just about finding your people right it's about finding a place that suits like with with all of us um somewhere that actually wants to nurture you um and I think there is no formula I think a big thing I always say and a big thing I've learned is to not be afraid to ask for what I need yeah um it was something that I kind of had sort of beaten out on me a little bit when I was young and not literally just to point out very definitely mummy and daddy were amazing um but you know I had a lot of teachers and things that'd be like oh I was just being dramatic or oh you're fine you don't and so I became afraid to ask for what I needed and I didn't really believe in how I felt I didn't believe in my own experience I thought I was doing something wrong and it's taken me a long time it's taken till my adult years to realize no you need to be able to ask for what you need and so I think that's a big thing that I would say to anyone with Asperger's um or autism that wants to kind of pursue your creative career it is hard it is not easy um you need to have people that are loving and positive and supportive around you um but don't be afraid to ask for what you need listen to yourself listen to what's going on in your mind and your body and if something isn't right say it I think for a lot of people it's a fantastic way of learning coping mechanisms and skills um and I am a big advocate for the arts for anyone and everyone um so you've played three characters who are on the spectrum can you see yourself playing a character that's not on the spectrum that's play a lot of characters that are not on the spectrum yes um I am I mean first and foremost I'm an actor I kind of it's again only in more recent years that I've really started to announce that I I am an actress with ASD um before that again I always felt like oh but if I tell people they're going to think I'm not going to be able to do something or whatever and then it comes out halfway through a rehearsal process and everyone's like what no you're not and I'm like yes actually I am but thank you for that um it's not a compliment you telling me that you wouldn't have realized thanks very much okay but um no I mean I've played tons of parts that don't um and I welcome them with open arms because it means I get to do something that's um challenging well actually I find them I find playing characters that aren't a lot less challenging yeah okay way less interesting yeah so um Fiona what were the challenges for you of trying to write something that was representing a neurodiverse character on the screen so what sort challenges did you have that's really interesting question um I think I don't I don't feel that there were so much challenges when I was when I was writing it because um for a long time which actually picks up on on you asking Ellie about um about training um if if you have ASD um for a long time I had worked with with groups of young people who were on the spectrum and had other um neuro neuro diverse differences making theater so I was regularly immersed in that in that community so it's uh it's something I was very I was very familiar with but also very passionate to to tell a story that that was properly representative and then later on um when when when it became a film um I'd always asked asked Elena if she would if she would play the role so I was able to to check things with her and ask her and ask her about it and I think the thing one of the things that I said uh during one of the Q&A's at the screening somebody asked about um the ending of our film and and why we chose to tell that story and it is again echoing what Ellen has said this is only one story that has a character in it with Asperger's we need more we need lots of different stories with different endings and different outcomes and different representations because you can never tell the whole experience of somebody who's neurodiverse um in in in in peace yeah you can't possibly and yeah I I I would love to see more work where somebody in your own diverse themself is writing it or or directing it or I think that's really important oh thank you um when I went to visit um Teeside my hometown Middlesbrough um I met up with a lovely young woman um her name's Alison Wombell and she's a blogger uh she's just recently been diagnosed with autism and and she has two autistic children she's a blogger so I just wanted to give her a shout out because we were having a chat and she gave she shared some ideas with me and um she if you're interested in looking at her blogs or on instagram just look up chasing rainbows or she has my heart I like that one she has my heart so yeah I met that and she's amazing woman and she does um instagram videos short ones talking about you know how her autism affects her so please um check her out she's called Alison Wombell spelled w o m b w e double l so just to remind people what's your twitter handle again it's it's at acceptable d so at acceptable capital d all capital d okay so people can check that out and they can see updates of what's happening exactly with the film so yeah we're going to be talking a little bit more now it's just going so fast this week today so thank you very much and um we're going to be going to the next part soon welcome to women's radio station I'm Sarah Louise Ryan and welcome to love lessons live on women's radio station hello and welcome to future classic women awards with news hello and welcome to June May is listening hi this is Anna Kennedy and we're at women's radio station supporting women's well-being and we're talking all things autism women the possibilities are endless that's what makes us different hi I'm Farguni Desai of Action Coach are you a business owner with more than five employees do you want to grow your business I'm a London-based business coach who helps small and medium-sized businesses to grow and make a profit I will help you identify the strengths and weaknesses in your business and then work with you to improve it using a structured framework to find out more contact me on 07721-654-640 and book your one-hour complementary one-to-one coaching session thank you hi I'm Tracey Weeden of Brown here insurance group we are an award-winning family run insurance broker covering a wide range of insurance products ranging from commercial lines to personal household high net worth and fine art you can contact us on 0208-658-4334 or visit our website www.brownhillgroup.co.uk for your free no obligation quotation at brown hills we've got you covered hi I'm Hazel Butterfield a blogger book lover and mental health advocate and you can listen to my show get booked here at women's radio station daily at 5 am and 5 pm throughout my shows we'll talk about the books I've read new releases chapter authors publishers and book enthusiasts all with a scene and aim of supporting women's emotional well-being if you have a book to tell us about get in touch at presenters at women's radio station dot com join me on my show and share my love of books and writing hi I'm Valentina Barracci and I'm the executive director of media matters for women we're a registered charity operating in Sierra Leone and the democratic republic of congo and we produce and share podcasts via bluetooth on mobile phones focusing specifically on women and girls excluded from information due to extreme poverty we empower those living in rural areas with media that transforms how they access own and share information to find out more and be part of this movement come check out our website at media matters for women dot org you're listening to women's radio stations supporting women's well-being women's radio stations creating a global network for the empowerment of women and we want you to be involved join us on instagram and twitter at women's radio station that's women's radio stn or facebook women's radio station to keep up to date with all our exciting programs hello this is anna kennedy and we're talking all things autism we're live at cotton garden and my guests today are fiona and elena before i go over to them both i just wanted to share a little bit about daisy chain which is a charity that i'm patron of that i visited at the northeast so when i go and see my mum and my sister i visit daisy chain and i met the new ceo niraj sharma they've got a fantastic place there it was established as a charity in 2003 and the dream of the founder leslie whose son jacob is diagnosed at autism at an early age sadly leslie wasn't able to see the finished product because she died of cancer so she dreamt of having a haven for children with autism a place where they could go to experience something in life that would give them a pleasure and it was just especially for them for parents as well for carers for siblings and support and they have a resources library it's a fantastic site it was just a barren piece of land and they've created a farm it's just got all sorts there there's got embedded trampolines which angela thoroughly enjoyed um so yeah it's got so now many these many years later the charity provides a range of support of services for adults as well that were um actually working there and they've got a super store and what happens is all the community give their second hand furniture whatever it is that they've got it's all really good quality stuff so as i say as we were walking around angela spotted this huge bear and he wanted it so we bought it so like dvds you know all the old dvds that might not be able to get in shops anymore so it's a fantastic facility so if you live in the northeast check out on google daisy chain so over to you girls so what are the barriers to getting a representative work made and seen and also how do you how do you like adapt the work environment in a film must be hard oh that's two big questions so first of all i would say that quite often in the media and on social media people people in power i guess i i could i could say that people um in charge of buildings or funds we'll talk about how they want to see work that's more representative okay speaking as um a filmmaker and artist and and playwright actually getting people to put on and program that work is is a real uphill struggle and i'm a very positive person as i know ellen is and i won't give up but actually um i i have yet to realize the stage version of the of of this story which i'm hoping to be working with with mind the gap um bradford on later later later on it's still in its very early stages but it is very very challenging to get work made and more recently there was a lot of um there was a big twitter storm about a theater production that was representing someone with autism and at the time i was contacting various media outlets to say would you because it was just just before our premiere would you like to talk about this positive story where we have um a young woman who has asperger's being portrayed by an actress with asperger's no interest at all oh dear not good no no okay so making the work environment such as a film set properly accessible um how how did you go about that what did you do i think i mean access is something that is hugely important to me and i feel that it's something i'm learning about all the time um we had a deaf actress on the film as well and um i was able to interpret for her that day because um it was a very very small moment in the film um and i discussed it with her and she felt that that would be that would be okay because um i i um i do use bsl a little bit um but in terms of um providing an environment that was that was that was helpful and looked after emina's well-being i think it's something that was well that was hugely important to me and i don't think doing all the scenes that were the most intense um very very close together was very very challenging when you're when you're making a film there are lots of external pressures on you from all kinds of things like when when you've got the location when the other actors are available making all these schedules is very hard but i i feel that um that that i i did my best but i would like i would like to have done better okay you know i think there's always work in progress absolutely because because um yeah i i don't think anybody's ever ever gets everything completely right and we learn every time we make a creative project yeah we learn how we could have done things better yeah it's like when we do autumn's got talent we've been doing it for eight years and every year we think oh we need to change that a little bit exactly it depends on um the performer as well who we bring in and where they're traveling from and all that sort of thing so how about you what would you say i mean i think um in terms of kind of um getting work as a as a neurodiverse person um it's hard because there is still a big stigma around what that actually is and what that means i think people struggle with things that they can't see um and when you can't see it it's really hard to understand it and so i think that's why you know there's a big diversity push in the industry at the moment which is fantastic and we need it but that kind of people with disabilities are still on the bottom rung it's not it's sometimes it's a bit tokenistic i think it's a bit of a ticker ticker exercise so if they have the proof is in the pudding the way i look at it and that's the big issue that i have i often feel like i'm this is going to sound awful but i i sometimes feel like i'm not disabled enough yeah um and then what do you do when you're an actor and you're just trying to do your job and and work um and you're not meeting enough boxes but then having said that there's still you know there are people making fantastic work i do like another one but yeah absolutely so there are there are things being um there are things happening um sorry my chest is uh really not happy today um when we were on set yeah that was a big thing okay again that's sort of where i learned well not where i learned but that reminded me that i need to i can't expect people to anticipate my needs yeah it would be great if they did yeah they're not mind readers they're not mind readers and because i am verbal yeah and i am able to communicate even if it's hard for me i need to take responsibility and ask for what i need and tell people what i need as well okay um so can i ask you because obviously it can be quite draining what you do and i know by my eldest son patrick when he goes to work he needs time out when he comes back home and doesn't want to talk all that sort of thing so what do you do to relax to help you get on an even keel if you like i'm also quite non-verbal when i come home i often have to not be touched or spoken to yeah for a little while until i kind of shake off my my work persona yeah as it were um a big thing for me i kind of found my mindful thing over the past couple of years and i love crosswords and sedoku they really really really help me massively trust me mad no i find it so calming i think it's because i have like one sole focus and because it's very methodical you're having to really use your brain yeah it allows me to tune out okay other things right and stops my mind from worrying and allows me to just and then i but also it's there's a there's a result isn't there there's an accomplishment yeah in well i've completed the sedoku table i've completed the crossword table yeah it's um it's it's very satisfying it sort of turns another new one as well how is it um it's a real love for me now i find it really cathartic and really helps me find a sense of of calm within the chaos that's my brain so yeah yeah me i would say dancing walking and watching rubbish telly so i can zone out how about you fiona um i would say meditation oh i've tried that that doesn't work when we know i can't meditate i can't meditate i find that really helpful though i wouldn't say that's a relaxation that's more of a discipline to help my mind you tend to have as a creative person i do have quite a wizzy mind and i need to i often say to my other half i i wish my brain had a switch when i could turn it off yeah i have very vivid dreams and nightmares yeah but the same thing i really like walking um in the countryside i like swimming i love to swim in the sea even when it's really cold oh dear i can't swim me too i find water really really therapeutic water is a big sensory thing for me yeah um i had a bath last night and i honestly i splash around like my boyfriend will come past the door and be like yeah okay i'm just having a splash i just love how it feels yeah okay yeah with angela um sometimes water's great for him and then sometimes it's almost like he's been scolded when you're washing his hands and brushing his teeth it's just like some days are great and other days it's just he's like pulling his hands away from the tap even though it might be cold and i try to get it in the right sort of level but it's no matter what you do it's it's just i know it must be awful to live day to day like that way and yeah it's just have an impact of sensory overload so um how long did it take to make the film oh do you mean the actual shooting or the whole process the whole thing just like process yes so in 2017 which is the year that we shot the film okay i um was writing the screenplay and i was probably on draft one or two around february and then by the time we got to may when we went to the can film festival to um to endeavor to to raise money for it um i was at uh for a week in july okay and then you go post production and we completed at the end of that year so that's the actual making of okay but then everything that happens after that yeah that takes some time the editing and and actually for us this is actually fairly quick to actually where we are at sometimes it takes a lot longer yeah i just wanted to say thank you so much for sharing um everything really is about talking about what it's like for you as an actress talking about what it's like for you to make a film and i'm just also looking forward now i've heard a little bit about it so i'm looking forward to watching it so again if people are interested to follow you on twitter can you just remind them at acceptable d so at acceptable d capital d and if anyone wants to ask any questions you can put it through the charity website and then i'll pass it on to you we'll also be writing an article about what's happening today any links we've spoken about we'll be sharing on the charity website just to remind you www.anna kennedy online.com again i'd like to say thank you thank you thank you i need sleep thank you so much to both of you for coming along and joining us it's been great so again if you want to be one of my guest speakers please contact me on the charity website bye everyone welcome to the women's radio station supporting women's well-being women's radio station is all about diversity from opinions career ethnicity education and most importantly women's well-being we aim to celebrate the individuality of every woman everywhere providing opportunities and the platform for your voice visit our website women's radio station.com for more information hi i'm liz van linden the uk travel consultant for hazelmere travel people come to me as they want unique experiences and a personalized service this happens from the moment that they inquire till they come back home i work with luxury 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