Hello, this is Anna Kennedy and we’re talking all things autism and today I have a special guest. We’ll be chatting to Nicola in a little minute and yeah, I’m going to talk to you about lots of different things that’s been going on with the charity and what I’ve been doing. So we have had Dance Day, all my word, the videos that came through were absolutely amazing.

I loved them. They were from all over the country and it was to celebrate Dance Day and the day before was actually International Dance Day. So we had a few videos that crept through, but on Step in the Right Direction Dance Day we celebrated 10 years, 10 years.

We’ve had some amazing videos throughout the years and photographs, people striking a pose, doing their thing, but this time we had something a little bit different. We had Christina Rianoff, who used to be on Strictly, who also supported me when I did the People Strictly. She put a little routine together so that people could copy her and then do their own thing.

So some people actually did that, children, adults, oh I loved it and then they did their own thing. Oh they just did their own thing. It was all to have a bit of fun.

So and one of them was really special because there was two brothers from the Burgess family who I’ve known for a very long time, Josh and Seb, and they were dancing, they were in hospital and then they asked their play therapist and one of the nurses if they could take part in the dance day. So the nurses and the play therapists were dancing in the hospital, in their room. Oh absolutely loved it.

Everyone loved it. They were sharing it. So that just almost brought a tear to my eye.

And talking about a tear, from a tear to here is very, very popular. One of my charity champions, Dawn Avery, she has written a book. She started it when Aston was six years old and then picked it up again during lockdown, finished it and then published her book, which is in paperback and hardback.

And if you’re interested, we’re selling them from the charity website. So it’s www.annaKennedyonline.com called From a Tear to Here. I just wanted to remind you about the Autism Hero Awards.

We’ve had so many nominations come in and they’re still coming in. So there’s 12 different categories. If you would like to nominate someone who you feel that goes the extra mile, whether it’s a parent, whether it’s a carer, whether it’s a professional, whether it’s a business, please send in your nominations.

And you’ve got plenty of time. September, the first week in September is the closing date. And then we will have seven judges that will have the tough, tough task of choosing three finalists from each category.

And then I will choose one person that I feel throughout the year has just done that last year, we had such a lovely mother that Leo Andre that fought to get her son out of an assessment treatment unit. She did and she went over and above. So she was my choice.

And then I will choose someone from our charity as volunteer of the year. So I just wanted to also talk to you about where revamping our Take Vibe campaign, which I started about eight years ago. So we now have our own well-being ambassador, which is the lovely Julianna Weeter.

So if you check out the charity website, you will see that we’ve just posted the Take Vibe revamp. And also I interviewed Casey Ainsworth, who’s one of our ambassadors. And she talks about any anxieties that she may have of us easing down now back into real life or whatever the real normal is going to be for us.

So she talks to me about that. So I just wanted to give you a quote that she gave me, Casey. She said, as lockdown lifts, I find myself feeling anxious about emerging.

If I am anxious, how does that feel for the people I live with on the autism spectrum, just one of the many worries rolling around in my head at two o’clock this morning, and that is before I even get to my own life and work. I find it hard to take time just for myself. However, during lockdown, I started going to a Zoom yoga class early on a Sunday morning and I told everyone in the house I was the one hour in the week when I’m not to be disturbed.

We were chatting about how they chat to us while we’re having a bath or on the toilet or whatever it is. There’s no seem to be any privacy. So what she’s also saying, it’s hard to feel ying or yang if there’s World War three erupting outside the door, it does not always work.

But after a few weeks, they all began to respect my class as I was a firm in reiterating it was my time. Now, it’s not five minutes, it’s a whole hour. And many cannot see their way to doing that.

But it sets me up for the week in so many different ways. And I return to the feeling the practice gives to me on that Sunday morning during the week when things feel more chaotic. Even five minutes of breathing, eyes closed, checking my body for tension and trying to let it go helps me get through the week.

You must take time for you. Breathe. So that was from Casey.

And if you’re interested, I also interviewed Casey on Gateway Radio. All Things Autism with Aston Avery, who’s one of my charity ambassadors. So today my guest is Nicola Carey Shine.

So I’m just going to give you a little bit of her bio and then we’ll chat to Nicola, which is rare to go. So after a decade as a mainstream teacher and a middle manager in an extremely large comprehensive school with a highly challenging pupils, many of whom had undiagnosed special educational needs, people used to say to me, why would you want to put yourself through that? Oh, I don’t envy you. The truth was I loved it.

The bonds I made resonated at a deep down level, knowing the childhood arrived. So angry, anxious and misunderstood. Now had their own toolkit to achieve better life chances.

So welcome, Nicola. Thank you. Oh, thank you for taking the time out of your busy day and your life to talk to me.

So before we go talk about autism, we’ve talked before we talk about your children and all your different projects that you’ve got in the pipeline. Tell me a little bit about who is Nicola Carey Shine? Where were you born? Who are you? Oh, wow. This is your life.

And OK, so I was born in Kent in Sickup and I’m 37 now and an only child. And I was thinking about this question. Actually, I was just thinking about my childhood and I was thinking about my parents, you know, retrospectively, you’d never realize it at the time.

But when you look back, you think, oh, bloody hell, my parents really did try that, you know, they really pushed hard for me because looking back, I’ve I noticed some issues with my with my learning style and problems. But, yeah, I went on to do an art degree at Central St. Martin’s and a teaching degree. And and now I work for myself.

But because I’m a glutton for punishment, I’m doing a master’s in psychology at the same time, which I wouldn’t recommend in a lockdown, actually. So tell me, why did you go into teaching? And I think it’s when I was a kid, I always loved acting and presenting and just interacting with people. And and I think teaching is the best of all of that.

So you’re you’re you’re having that really great buzz with people constantly. But then you get the added bonus of the light bulb moment. I know a lot of teachers mentioned that and just seeing someone go, oh, like the way you just told me that I totally get it now.

And that is the best feeling in the world. And just, you know, yeah, there’s a lot of stress that comes with it. But you go home kind of knowing that you genuinely have made a difference and and also had fun, hopefully.

So it’s the best job. So it can be. I was just going to say, if someone wants to go into teaching, what sort of things would you need to be able to do? Or what, you know, what what’s the cost? Talk to me a little bit about that.

If someone is listening in and think, I think I might like to be a teacher. I might like to be a special educational needs and disability to support children. What would you need to do? I would say it’s extremely vocational.

So, yes, you do need to have had you have to have a degree in the subject that you want to teach in, but as your experience expands, you can then teach different age sets to the one that you trained with. But I would say the most important thing is that you are you know that in a year’s time, you’re still going to be wanting to do it. A lot of people enter it and then burn out.

Or they think it’s something that it doesn’t end up following that path. It’s very, very hard going. But ultimately, you know, if you’re the kind of person that loves working with children and loves seeing them do well, then you’re going to be passionate about it and it should click.

And the other thing is, I’d say it’s all about, you know, this going on strictly as well, it’s all about even if you’re scared inside, just totally acting like, yeah, I’m totally fine. Nothing’s going to faze me. So I understand if you don’t mind me saying that you’ve got ADHD.

I have. Yes, very chronically. So sorry if I ramble at a tangent.

No, no, no, no. So when were you diagnosed and was it as a child or was it as an adult? It was as an adult. And interestingly, I kind of knew from maybe from my early 20s when I became aware of what that condition was and then going on to become an S.E.N. specialist teacher, I was obviously very aware of the perimeters and the descriptions and the behaviours, even, you know, some of the more stranger physical sides of it.

So I kind of knew anyway. But when I went to do my master’s, it hit me very hard how it must feel for my younger students, because I’m doing things like statistics and things that make me come out in hives that I absolutely hate. And so having to do that has made me realise just how how chronic it is.

And then that’s when I decided to get the full assessment. And I was told I was sort of off the charts, really. So that kind of surprised me, even though I knew I had it.

And it’s reminding me what it feels like for students who are learning when they’re not doing their favourite subject. So if you had to look back when you were at school, what difficulties did you have because of your ADHD? Can you remember? So now with hindsight, you’ve got the diagnosis, you think, oh, that’s why that was difficult. Oh, that’s why I used to find that difficult.

Yeah, definitely, definitely. I don’t I know not everywhere does this anymore. And I think it’s it’s quite an unusual thing in that Kent definitely does 11 pluses, but not many places do anymore.

But the 11 plus is a selective test in order to get into a grammar school. And I’d perform really well in speaking and presenting, but I failed my 11 plus and my parents were really surprised and they really took on an appeal to help me get into a grammar school because they felt that was right for me, but because I was able to show my intelligence, but just not in the way that was required in certain situations. So even filling in answer forms, if I’ve got something, you know, those forms you get that look like lottery tickets.

Oh, yeah. If you have to go across and fill something in like that, my brain completely jumbles it up and I get anxious that I’ve actually filled in the right answer. And it’s not a reading issue or a visual issue.

It’s a it’s a processing issue. And I’d often answer an assignment in a completely different way that was asked. So they always enjoy what I handed in, but it wasn’t the right thing.

But I think everybody, as soon as they see any type of form, it sort of think, oh, here we go. Yeah. And especially when you know it’s like this test is going to decide what school you’re going to go to, and there’s a lot riding on it.

It just it just put me into like a freeze. You know, what have I done it right? Have I done it right? What’s that out the window? Oh, there’s, you know, there’s a bird flying past. And I just I look back now and I think, oh, bless you.

Like that was obviously quite a challenge, but I didn’t realize why at the time. So I believe you’ve got two kids. So tell me a little bit about your children.

Yeah, they are. What’s it someone said? I had made me laugh and I’d die for them. But because of them as well as something like that.

Yeah, they are absolute loves of my life, obviously. Artie was born when I was working in a secondary school that I’d been in for about 10 years. And I know parents will relate to this, but it just changes you, doesn’t it? The moment you see them.

And I had such this enormous love for him immediately. And I just thought I I don’t think I can go back from this maternity leave. I don’t want to leave you anyway, but I also don’t want to go back where I don’t agree with the way everything’s set out.

And I don’t want to be a disingenuous person because when you grow up and go to school, I want the best for you. So, yeah, it sounds a bit worthy. But when he was born, Artie, my first born, I actually he was the one that gave me the guts to quit my job and to set up because I thought if I’m going to be a true to myself, let’s do it now.

OK, so how old is Artie? He is just literally about to turn five on Wednesday. Oh, OK. And do you got a second child? Yes.

And then Isadora came a couple of years after and she’s a little whirlwind, a little little ball of energy. They both are. So I highly suspect Artie at least has ADHD from mummy.

So it’s a very, very busy, noisy house. Oh, but never boring then. Never boring.

Oh, you can’t know. No. We had some people come around to view the house yesterday and Artie decided to take all his clothes off and do some press ups for the lady, so that’s just standard.

So tell me about why you wanted to go in the special educational needs world. So you were in mainstream. Yeah.

Were you a middle manager? Was that what you said? I was a middle manager. Yes. So the school I was at was really huge.

So I was ahead of year. But in a year group, there was about, if I recall, about three hundred and sixty six kids. So it was like actually having a whole school within each year group.

And I was originally an art art specialist. And because of my relationships with the children, I got asked to work with children that had not quite been given. They hadn’t got EHCP.

They hadn’t been diagnosed, but they were at risk of permanent exclusion. So within the mainstream school, there was this little unit where these children that were definitely going to struggle would go. And I got asked to teach them.

And I had lots of people genuinely saying, oh, my God, what? No, you don’t want to do that. They throw chairs at people and they’re just, you know, they’re really aggressive. And I absolutely loved it.

It was it it made me so passionate and it sort of changed the direction of where I wanted to go, because they you could see the difference where if they went to a teacher that didn’t get them, they’d have a terrible day, a terrible, you know, experience that day. And yet if there was someone that did understand and they’d sit and enjoy themselves and all this soft side would come out. And I thought it’s just the way you approach somebody.

And it was a light bulb moment for me that I wanted more of that. OK, can you remember the very first child with special educational needs that you taught? I think then there must have been a lot because there was a very high level on the SCN register, but in mainstream. But I think there was one particular occasion where there was a young boy who was undiagnosed and he he got under the table at one point and he got very distressed.

And obviously, the other children were very interested in why he was doing that. And it could have caused a complete hullabaloo because, you know, he’d got under the table. But I just decided to downplay it and I gave him some paper to write draw me what was wrong when he was ready.

And I was only a few years in at that point. But, yeah, he just calmed everything down. And then when he came out, we we sort of bonded and we sorted and worked through what was wrong and I thought I could imagine that situation going very badly wrong in a different pair of hands, if you see what I mean.

Yeah, yeah, totally get what you’re saying. So talk to me about the frustrations that you have. So you left mainstream because you used to work with special educational needs.

So what is it about mainstream made you leave and think this is not for me. I want to work with children with special educational needs. Why was it that mainstream didn’t work for you? And I think we’ve got a national teaching retention crisis.

I think a lot of the good eggs are leaving because they’re finding the whole establishment very, very bureaucratic. And so you’re sort of getting people being put into positions of management who, you know, not really about the kids, they’re more about it’s a trust or it’s an academy and they and they are all about box ticking, which I do understand they have that responsibility, but it became you know, at the detriment of the kids. And I don’t think there’s there’s enough people in the mainstream system now that truly want to take that time to get to know the kids personally.

And it’s very much a business. OK, and that’s had a very bad effect on relationships and just things that I think are a basic pedagogy and relationship kind of common sense is just seems to have gone out the window and it’s about saving money at every possible opportunity, which again, I understand, but, you know, sometimes that costs more in the long run. Can you give me a bit of an example? So say, for example, you’re a mainstream teacher.

What is it that you’ve got to do? Because I’ve heard this so many times where they say it’s not about teaching anymore, it’s about paying, it’s about tick boxing. It’s about, you know, saving money. And I just don’t have enough time to spend with the children.

It’s almost like the children are getting in the way. Yeah, you’re there to teach them. Yeah.

Yeah. It’s an example of how it impacts on your day. Yeah, you’ve hit the nail on the head there.

I think it’s not obviously not just my experience. I think it’s universal now where, you know, here’s an example. So it was a very deprived area where I worked.

There was a lot of behavioral problems. And I was more kind of interested in getting the child to, you know, get a rapport with that child, get them some boundaries. You know, that’s all needs to be in place before you try anything else.

And they that the management would be very focused on, you know, what? You need to use a green pen to mark. And you need to make sure that they’ve answered your sticker and said X, Y and Z in their reply to your marking. And it was just it was like removed from what was actually going on and what needed to be happening.

And I thought you’re obsessing about the wrong things. We need to get these basics established first before we start worrying about, you know, what kind of pen to use and how many times the child’s answered a sticker. OK, totally get where you’re coming from, because I’ve heard it from so many different teachers now where they just said, I just want to teach, I don’t want to do all this other stuff.

And it’s become very prescriptive as well. So when I first started, you would be given a theme or a scheme of work. We need to cover these skills.

But how you go about it is up to you. You’re trusted as a professional. And to fast forward to when I left, it was lesson one.

You need to teach this, this and this lesson two will be this, this and this. And I just thought there’s no room for creativity. So you’re not actually allowing new teachers to find their their passion and their way of delivering.

I think that’s a big factor as well in why so many people are leaving. OK, so you want to open your own school. So to me about when did this idea start? What’s involved and where are you at? So, yeah, when I was was born, that’s when I decided I didn’t want to go back.

So initially I set it up as a as a tuition center, if you like. So my poor husband had to put up with me changing our house and creating a classroom and, you know, knocking walls down and changing things. Bless him.

But, yeah, it grew really quickly. So I sort of went round with Aarti when he was nursing with me and just introduced myself to a lot of people, let them know what I was doing. Art courses for therapy, things like that.

And it just it just it grew enormously within the first three months. I then became oversubscribed and then gradually I moved into doing screening assessments to help children. You know, to help the parents identify if there is a learning barrier.

So talk to me about a screen assessment. And the reason I’m saying this is because quite a few people that listen in, their parents of children that have just been diagnosed. So it’s all new to them.

So talk to me about what is a screening assessment? What does that mean? OK, so because I don’t work for the NHS, I can’t say, you know, I’ve put my stamp on it, you know, I’ve certified you with this condition. But I’ve never been wrong. So what I will do is I will spend an hour doing observations with the child, working through some activities, spotting things, talking through the parents with what I think is an underlying issue or an example.

Talk about a child without giving a name. So it’s just, again, just to break it down so that people that are listening and thinking or what is it was that she’s looking for? I think I’ll mention particularly there’s there’s I’ve seen hundreds and hundreds now, but I would say one of the biggest things is girls tend to mask things very easily. So a lot of parents will come to me and say, I’m pulling my hair out because my little girl, she’s good as gold all day in school.

And then she’ll come home and be extremely violent or, you know, to the point where these are these aren’t parents that are just letting their kids do whatever and there’s no structure. They’re trying their damnedest to to get some kind of, you know, routine and nothing’s working. And quite often girls are very good at masking ASD and ADHD.

And so therefore the parents are not getting any help in school or not getting referred by the doctor. And then they’ll come to me and I’ll say, yeah, I agree with you. I’ve spotted this, this and this.

It’s very subtle, but she’s masking. And then as she gets to know me, I’ll get to know her, you know, the other triggers and then we’ll have I call it like super nanny. So parents will keep a diary for the week and then we’ll meet up and we’ll go through what’s been a trigger or what’s been a really good day or what’s kicked off and sort of pick it apart and set up strategies.

OK, so apparently if they want to keep a diary, I think that’s a good idea because you can actually then pinpoint what the trigger was. So what sort of things are they looking for if they want to keep a diary? I would say a mixture of use your phone because you’ve always got your phone on you anyway. Phones are really good too.

If your child’s having a particular kind of meltdown or is it showing signs of stimming or something like that, you can say, look to the doctor. Yes, you’re you’re not seeing it, but this is what we see at home. And also I would keep life simple for yourself.

Make it bullet points. So it could just be like Monday you know, through the plate on the floor because there was yellow food or something like that. So then we can then talk about that.

And along with the history, you need to know the family history. And there just isn’t time in the doctors to go through all of this. OK, so you carry on with talking to me about opening your school.

So what is it, where are you at and what is it that you’d like to do? And what would you like to basically teach? So I think we’ve sort of reached maximum capacity at the moment where I need to get bigger land and bigger I need to start taking on staff because I have got I’m working seven days a week now and I need and there’s so many children, especially post pandemic that I need in urgently needing help. So, yeah, we’ve we’ve found the perfect spot, which means we’re going to be able to do lots of outdoor things, so things that are going to be getting rid of lots of pent up energy, getting self confidence, doing painting courses outside, bushcrafting. So things that are going to make children feel, you know, they’ve had a lot of self-esteem issues up to this point and they’re going to start to feel like they can basically take on whatever age group are you looking at? I cover all the way from five up to I’ve had five to 18.

So the whole spectrum, basically. So you want the school to be age five to 18. It’s more like a forest school.

It will have elements of that because it will have the outdoor learning aspect. But it will really be very I guess the words holistic or complementary. So there’ll be literacy and numeracy covered in kind of quite unique ways.

But also I’m going to be doing an acting masterclass soon. So for our charity, we work with autism so that they can come along and let out some of those pandemic, you know, the emotions that have all been pent up from that. So there’ll be therapy for the parents as in they’ll get a bit of respite.

Maybe come along and do some art. There’ll be outdoor activities. They’ll be learning in the more traditional sense.

So it’s going to be a sort of 360. All right. So you’re going to run your own curriculum.

Yeah. OK, so how are you going to juggle? Because I’ve done this, obviously, many times ago. How are you going to juggle with two kids and setting up a school? How are you going to do that? How are you going to do it? I know how I did it, but how are you going to do it? Ah, alcohol.

No, lots and lots of coffee, I think. No, I think the worst of it. Well, I say that then we had lockdown, but the worst of it, I think, was when both of them were very, very young and juggling then.

But I dealt with that by Aarti and Dora have always been very much part of the school. So they’ll quite often go and sit on the laps of my pupils who might be having a stressful day and stroke their face or that, you know, they are part of the family. So there isn’t that kind of line between work and home.

So they’re not critical to mainstream schooling? No, Aarti has just started. He’s only just he’s four. So he’s only just just experiencing that and not yet.

But, yeah, they’ve always been part of and I think that’s been a beauty of it, actually, that they’ve they quite often calm my pupils down and they quite often bring out the best in them because they feel not threatened by them. Right. OK.

So, yeah, it’s bloody hard. They’re not going to lie. I shouldn’t have said that word, should I? Um, no, it’s very hard and it’s it’s very draining and I do have to make sure that I’m taking some time out, even if it’s literally five minutes out in the garden, just with no noise.

Right. So this piece of land, you’ve got a piece of land. Well, you hope to have a piece of land.

Yeah, hope to have this building. So talk to me about the building. What’s it like and what was it before? So it’s it’s two cottages that have been put together.

And the bit we want to use is currently they’re using as a gym, but we’re going to be turning that into our sort of learning area. And it’s got an annex across on the land. There’s two acres of land and the annex is going to be where I will be doing the screeners and the observations and coaching sessions with parents.

OK, and then the land will be for whenever we’re doing outdoors activities and things like that. And there is also the possibility they have got a pool there. So I’m looking into hydrotherapy, but I’m going to have to pick your brains because I’ve never taken on staff before and, you know, getting to that’s not quite tough to get the right staff together and working together as a team, because sometimes, obviously, it’s a long time ago when I first set up the school, which was 1998, 1999.

Obviously, I was learning as I was going along. I’d never done it before. I didn’t know how to write an advert for a head teacher.

And it was just constant research, research, research. And then I learned that sometimes when you get a CV from a teacher and it’s absolutely brilliant, you think, oh, they sound the perfect thing. Then obviously they get a reference and it’s a glowing reference.

And a lot of the time the glowing references bang on, but then sometimes a glowing reference is not what it appears to be. They’re not somebody that works as part of a team. Or it might be that they’ve written them a glowing reference because basically they don’t want them to leave.

Yeah. But it’s all these things that you didn’t even think about. So it’s a big, big learning curve.

And then also dealing with Department for Education and everything else that’s involved and all the rigmarole that you need to go through. That can be quite hard as well. But once you start and if you’re driven and enthusiastic and passionate enough, you can get through anything.

So definitely. So you’ve got to go fund me, Link. Tell me tell me a little bit about that and how much have you raised so far and how and how much more do you need? So on my go fund me and all my social media, I shall make sure is available on your page so I forget to say what that is.

But yeah, that’s been great. Actually, there’s been people putting on pub quizzes to raise money. There’s been all sorts going on.

But we’ve managed to all together with parents. I’ve had parents investing as well who I’ve helped their child with their speech or various issues. And I’ve had loads of people chipping in.

And thus far we’ve got about 350K, which is just mind blowing. But obviously, there’s so much more needed to think of that you need. I think in the last count, I think we need another 75, 75, sorry, 75,000.

Yeah, sorry. I should say that on. Yeah, not P. Yeah.

That’s not P. That would be amazing. So how much time? Sorry, could you say that again? I was just going to say, how long have you got to raise that money to secure everything? We’ve got the body of it. We just need to make sure we can sustain ourselves.

So it’s more a case of we don’t want to get in and then collapse after a year. So it’s not, you know, it’s not going to fail. So we need to make sure we’ve got enough for staff and we’ve got enough because, you know, that’s going to be integral.

I have got staff that I’ve already already spoken to people that I funnily enough worked at the last place. I was at who left for very similar reasons. So I know they’re good.

I know they know their onions. So I’ve already said to them about coming with me. But yeah, it’s a case of I just need to make sure that this dream doesn’t collapse after a year because it’s going to make such a difference to people.

Yeah. And the thing is, is the local authority going to fund places for the children to go there or is it private that people have to fund their child? How does it work? At the moment, we’re a CIC. So we can apply for funding and support in that way.

And then once things have developed a little bit more, I think the best route is for us to apply to become independent. OK, so people are saying what does CIC mean? So CIC is a community interest company. So that allows you to put forward proposals for places like the National Lottery or for the Arts Council.

If you can prove what you’re doing is actually going to benefit the community, there can be support available for that. And yeah, I just think it’s one of those you need. We need that capital upfront, but it’s going to be something that pays over itself again and again, because it’s going to be already I’m having people stopping me in the street, which is which is quite funny.

So saying, can I come? So if people listening in are interested in finding out a little bit more, I believe your website is www.thelearntoshineschool.co.uk. Just say that again, www.thelearntoshineschool.co.uk. So are you on social media? And if you are, where can people find you? Yes, definitely. I’m on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram. I’ve also got a YouTube channel as well because I try to put videos up discussing various conditions and ways to help support parents.

So that would be worth looking at. So learn. Did you want me to give the? Yeah.

So if you’re looking on Twitter, is it just learn to shine? I’ve got on Twitter, it’s learn and shine. Not all one word. OK, and Instagram is underscore learn to shine underscore.

And yeah, you’ve said the website. Yeah. And Facebook is just one time and learn shine.

Yeah. OK. So where why do you why did you choose that name? Learn shine shines in my surname.

OK. And then, yeah, it was one of those well started was in between. Yeah, he was having a little nap and I was nap and I was busy building a website, not knowing what the hell I was doing.

Yeah, I thought I need a I need a catchy name. Oh, shine. Yeah, go for it.

So is that what the school is going to be called when you open it? Yes. So learn the learn to shine school. So when is your aim to open? What is if someone said to you, right, he’s a magic wand.

He’s the seventy five grand. When are you going to? In theory, well, I’m already operating, but obviously on a very small scale now. But when we move to the bigger premises, in theory, I’d like to be starting for September.

But we’re not going to run to normal term times because it will be people coming in for a few hours here, having a bit of, you know, outdoor time or an art lesson or, you know, so it will be a sort of canteen of of education from hopefully from September. OK, so if you’re a mainstream school and you think, well, I’ve got a child that’s doing quite well, but they could do with some of what Nicola is doing as well. Would you be open to them coming, like, say a day a week to you and then four days at mainstream or a few hours? However, is would you be on for something like that? Absolutely.

I encourage that because I think that makes such a difference to the child’s well-being. And I think if schools are willing to because sometimes they don’t want to say that they can’t cope and they don’t want to admit that they’re not the ones to provide it. If they’re able to do that, I would open welcome them with open arms because it makes the world of difference, as you know, to a child’s well-being, if they’re going in and having a release and an enjoyment, then please come.

OK, so talk to me about lockdown because a lot of people have been struggling. Some people have found it actually OK. Some people have actually enjoyed being in lockdown.

What’s the experience been like for you in lockdown? And in a lot of ways, it’s been very similar because I’m constantly working with with two two little menaces climbing over my head. But teaching over Zoom has been was has been a strange experience, I’d say, because especially when I’m doing art, you know, you can’t always see what exactly what someone’s doing. And then, you know, normally I would be in a room with them and we can be bouncing off of each other.

So that’s a strange experience. In some ways, it’s kind of forced you like the things you just can’t do. So you just have to put up with it.

So but yeah, being on Zoom a lot is some ways more convenient. But in a lot of ways, you don’t get the same teaching quality, I don’t think. No.

So has it has an impact on you as a family as well? I think having no acts like my family, my mum and dad live in France and I miss them terribly. I’ve not seen them for over a year and not being able to see, yeah, not being able to see family, I think is the absolute worst part of it for us. But also not having a break, because I think I know you write about this as well.

I know, you know, like having your your little bit of time out for yourself. And when when you can’t have it at all, because everybody’s you know, needing you constantly 24 seven, that can be really hard. And I think that does that does take a toll when it’s been over a year.

Yeah. So what’s it been like in France for your mum and dad? Because obviously I’ve heard that, you know, they’ve had some awful stories going on there and about the the wave and everything. So how has it been for them? Have they been OK? Yeah, they’re physically OK.

It’s very strange that they live out in the middle of nowhere. So in a funny way, it’s not really been that different for them. But apart from they go to the shops and things, everybody’s obviously all encased in cellophane, et cetera.

But yeah, what’s very, very annoying is that they’ve been getting their letters from the GP here saying, please come and have your jobs. You’re in the vulnerable group. But because they’re in France, they’re not being offered it and they can’t get over.

So we’re in this catch 22 of you know, can’t really move on. And that’s been really frustrating. So if you’re if I’ve got some parents listening in now and they think their son or their daughter might be autistic or have ADHD, what advice would you give to them? I would say 100 percent listen to your instinct, because I think a lot of since lockdown, I think a lot of parents have seen firsthand how much of a struggle school and learning is for their child because they’re watching them try and follow a team’s lesson or or something.

And, you know, they’re seeing, oh, wow, they really are struggling. It’s not that they’re being naughty. They just can’t, you know, they can’t do this.

And if you feel that there’s something amiss, that is probably right. And I think we often get convinced by people in authority who might brush it off and say, you know, we’ll just watch see how they get on for the next six months. And that can really make them quite a lot of damage in six months.

If there isn’t intervention. So I’d say if you feel like that, there’s a reason you feel like that. And you could be being put off because you’re going to cost the school or the NHS money.

So they don’t want to push it right now. So, yeah, if you feel that there’s something there, there probably is and get help. I’m saying what’s the waiting time like where you live in Medway and in Kent for a diagnosis.

So say you go to your GP and you ask for a referral. How long are people waiting in that area? You know, it’s quite long and it varies as well. A lot of parents are finding they’re not even getting past the school stage.

The schools are saying, oh, there’s not a problem. We’ve seen them have a good day, singular. So therefore they must be fine.

Some parents, I think the shortest. And that’s because I did a pre-screener with the family. That was about 18 months.

But I have heard recently up to six years. So there’s an incredible variance in where you are, how supportive the school want to be, how supportive your GP wants to be. And that’s something that frustrates me because it shouldn’t be down to who you’re speaking to.

There should be a criteria for everyone. Yeah, definitely. I know I’ve spoken to so many different families from various different areas and it is very much a postcode lottery.

You’ve got some parents who are really lucky. They only waited six months or under a year. Then you’ve got others who are waiting three years, five years.

Obviously, we did that survey quite some time ago and it was on average five years. And I’ve seen some other organisations that have done surveys on diagnosis. And again, it’s between two to five years.

So it’s a long time in a child, especially when they’re young, because obviously all the books that you read about talk about early intervention is crucial for our children. So and it’s also it’s cutting your nose off to spite your face, because if that was if that was more forthcoming, then a lot of the other issues, so behavioural issues, kids, you know, by that time, five years later, lots of children without their diagnosis or the compassion or the understanding have been kicked out of school and then they become a statistic. You know, like what they’re in, they’re excluded.

They can’t go anywhere else. And then that causes lots of ramifications for your life chances. So then that all costs money in the long run.

So it’s it’s actually putting off by putting off it creates much bigger problems. So talk to me about I know you do workshops. So if people are interested in joining your workshops, talk to me about some of the workshops that you’re offering.

So is it open to the public or is it only open to your like a membership that you’ve got? How does that work? Oh, no, it’s open to the public. Anybody that that wants or feels that they’re going to benefit. I try to rotate what we’re doing, but I call them my enrichment days are available.

So it’s it’s about having fun, but also about getting boosting skills and boosting a CV. So on the last one we had feels like forever ago now. We had like Steel Drum Workshop.

We had Tim Prendergast, who’s a blind Paralympian, came and brought his gold medal to the kids. We’ve had talks from the police. We’ve had heart surgery, not real life surgery, obviously.

I’m not not that weird. But yeah, there’s been lots and lots of very eclectic specialists coming in so that, you know, you can either just come along and enjoy it or come away with your certificate and a whole load of skills. You can add to your CV if you have had time out of school.

OK, but do you do workshops online as well? Yeah, there’s stuff online we can do and there’s art groups that run weekly as well. And that’s for all abilities. That’s not, you know, you don’t have to have a specialist ability or anything like that.

And we’re going to be doing a master class in acting soon with a guy called Jake Curran, who’s who’s appeared in quite a lot of films. And he’s our ambassador for the drama department. So he’s going to come along and and do some crazy stuff.

OK, so are your children back now at school? Well, your school? Pretty much, yeah. We’ve still sort of got some strange adaptions, some are still sort of having half Zoom lessons, half in person. And some of us have got masks and some haven’t.

It’s all a very it’s almost the new normal, but I don’t want it to be. So talk to me about obviously, you’re a busy bee and we have been talking about time out. So talk to me about before lockdown.

What did you used to do for your own time out for your own? Like, this is me. This is Nicola. I’m not a man.

I’m not a carer. I’m not a teacher. I just want to do something for me.

What do you do? What do you do before lockdown? And then after lockdown, sorry, during lockdown, I’m saying, what do you do? Because obviously a lot of people haven’t been able to do what they would normally do and they’ve had to look at something else to help them have a bit of time out. So what did what did Nicola do before we went into lockdown for time out? I definitely did practice what I preached, and I would do try at least once a week to do some artwork. And I think mainly because I’m studying when the kiddies have gone to bed, I’m now focusing on my master’s assignment, so I can’t do this anymore.

But I definitely say to parents or anyone listening, art doesn’t have to be for, you know, certain kind of person. You know, I sometimes if I’m a bit stressed out or or I’m feeling a bit annoyed from the day, I’ll literally get like a teabag, chuck it on a bit of paper and I might throw some nail varnish on it and just have a play with a bit of cardboard and that’s if I don’t know what I’m going to do. And I just need to have a bit of sensory play.

Right. And then I let it dry and then I see what I can see in the picture and add a bit more pen to it and have a little play, because I think as adults, we’re encouraged not to play, aren’t we? Yeah, and that’s dreadful. We should we should definitely involve that more.

But then during lockdown, I think you just count your blessings for five minutes. So this is so tragic, but I’m going to tell you, just don’t tell anyone else listening, I would watch Neighbours. That’s my that’s my.

I’ve never watched Neighbours. Oh, you’ve got to watch it. How are you going to watch it? Yes, I’d have a coffee and watch and watch Neighbours for 20 minutes.

And that would be my little my little buzz. Well, I’m into Netflix. Now, I didn’t know anything about Netflix.

It was my son, Patrick, because he wanted to watch certain series that was on Netflix. He said, Oh, can we have Netflix? Can we have Netflix? And I said, OK, then. And now I’m totally into Netflix.

So, oh, no, my husband and I, that’s when we have a bit of time together. So we watch a particular series like we watch Sons of Anarchy or we’ve watched I can’t even remember that much, that many different series. So we just like watch one a night if we can.

It’s not always possible. And then you have to like stop the thing. You know, say if Angelo might want my support or, you know, he might have got up to something and then I’ll just say, just pause it.

Just don’t want to miss what happens. So you end up watching it all broken up, don’t you? Like one episode in 15 parts with you, 45 minutes. And it’s like two hours later, you haven’t even got halfway through.

Yeah, I feel you. Yeah, I recommend the capture. It’s a BBC should be on the BBC box set.

My husband did a lot of props work and design work on that. And that is brilliant. That’s the capture on BBC.

And it’s about deep faking. So it’s quite scary about how they can fix CCTV and digital images to set people up. Oh, OK.

I’ll have to look at that one. Yeah. So during lockdown, there was a lot of people that were doing baking and all sorts, even that people have never baked before.

So it was a school that contacted me because Angelo, as everyone who follows me knows, he absolutely loves cake, hiding a man. And then I forget where I put the cake. And it was a school called high school and they have created a lockdown cookbook for students with autistic spectrum conditions.

So Angelo is a very big fan of Angel Cake and also Victoria Sponge. So they’ve put a really lovely lockdown cookbook. So people are interested and they would like to buy the cookbook.

It’s I think it’s four pound, 50 or five pounds. So if you’re interested, check out Cumbran High School on Twitter. If not, just send me a message via the charity website, which is www.annaKennedyOnline.com. And I’ll give you the link.

And it was also signed off by John Jenkins, who was in the Great British Bake Off and also Tom Carridge, which is a Michelin star celebrity chef. And some of the things that the kids have made are amazing. They’ve got pictures as well.

So it’s all very visual. So nice chili. There’s like Ryan’s spaghetti bolognese, Melissa’s mozzarella nuggets, Daniel’s all day wrap, Tom’s Russian plove.

And then at the very back, there’s Angelo’s Victoria Sponge. And I showed it to him and he could he just like smiled. And he had a really good look because there’s a picture of him holding this huge Victoria Sponge.

Oh, I want one now you’re saying that. Very proud that Angelo has been part of this lockdown cookbook. And also just wanted to say a couple of things about people who were in collaboration with with the charity.

So if you are interested in obviously finding clothes without labels, please check out Born Anxious. So it’s www.bornanxious.co.uk. It was actually a founder is Kelly Bowker. Lovely lady.

Her son Oscar has autism and she’s got so many different regions on there. And we just launched the Dance Like No One’s Watching range, which we absolutely love because everyone knows I love my dancing, which is my dime out. So if you want to check it out, lots of different things on their Harvey Price as well.

He’s got a range because he’s got a love of frogs. So he’s got his little range, the Harvey range with frogs on it. There’s also another t-shirt company called the No Apology t-shirt, which I was part of the campaign, which is the Autism Threads.

So it’s a stylish, tasteful and it’s got captions and logos for t-shirt, prints and accessories. So it provides visual clues, supporting the wearer and the carer, helping others understand generic t-shirts and prints for everyone, raising positive awareness and acceptance and starting conversations. So that’s www.autismthreads.co.uk. And the last organization we’re in collaboration with is Mood Bears.

Really, really lovely bears. Very well made. All different emotions and speech and language therapists use them.

They use them in hospitals. So if you’re interested, check out Mood Bears. So it’s www.moodbears.co.uk. And if you type my name, Anna, and then OBE and capital letters in the instructions, you get 10 percent off the bear.

So they’ve got Hope Bear, they’ve got Sad Bear, Happy Bear, Love Bear. They’ve got Far Too Serious, Giggly Bear. Oh, just so lovely.

And they’ve got smaller versions now that they’ve just launched as well. So you’ve got the Big Bear and the Mini Bear. So check that out.

So I’m excited about your school and I’m hoping that you’re going to be able to get the funding because obviously I can hear you’re very, very passionate about it. So if people are interested and they would like to donate to Nicola as project, I’m just going to share the information again. So it’s the website www.thelearntoshineschool.co.uk. If you’re on Twitter, it’s Learn Shine.

And if you’re on Facebook, it is, oh, where is it? Facebook, it’s Learn to Shine. Sorry, just Learn Shine again on Facebook. So there’s quite a few different links for you to check out.

And also the YouTube, you want to check that out as well. So it’s a big dream for you, isn’t it, Nicola? There’s something that you really want to do. How does your husband feel about it? Is he like right behind you or is he thinking, oh, God, what’s she up to now? Oh, poor Rob.

Yeah, I think after all these years together, he’s just like, whatever you say you’re going to go out and do, I just know it’s happening. So I just kind of have to come along. Like I’m on the ride.

I don’t have a choice. But no, he’s brilliant. He knows how passionate I am.

And he just says it’s not a case of if it’s a case of when with you. So I just think, yeah, that does make a world of difference. And to have a partner that’s like, you know, we both took a massive leap of faith, quit our safe jobs to do things that make our hearts happy.

So I think that’s quite your job. Yeah. And not at the same time, thankfully.

But yeah, he was in he was in the he was ex-military, then the police. And it was a similar story that, you know, everything’s bureaucratic now. And he just didn’t like it.

And it was, you know, he and now he does film and TV work. He loves it. So you’ve got to have a partner that supports you, haven’t you? Most definitely.

And I did hear that you were selling your house. So what are you actually going to move to the school? Yeah, we’re going to be on site. We’re going all in because it’s just it is so important.

I’m literally like, I know this sounds like I’m just saying this, but I keep it keeps me awake at night. I’m getting parents saying the school aren’t doing this, that they’re not letting them have this and they’re trying to put us off this. And I just this is such a massive problem right now.

It needs to happen. So how’s that going to work, then, if you’re going to move to the school? How are you going to how’s the layout going to be? Talk to me about that. Oh, it’s going to be separate.

So where we are is going to be in a different part. So it’s it will be, you know, I mean, Rob’s. Flexible, but not that flexible.

So you’re not going to be sleeping in the classroom on top of a desk? No, no, no, no, nothing like that. OK, so whereabouts is this building? Tell me. So this is going to be in Medway.

So, yeah, there’s a big need for it there, I think. Definitely. Oh, so that sounds really exciting.

So when you open the school, I hope you’re going to invite me to come. Of course I am. Because I would love to see it.

I would love to. Well, you’re one of my I’m going to say I’m just saying this now. But, you know, after I saw you on the TV back when you did Strictly, I just think you’re a wonderful human being doing what you’re doing.

And I thought I said to Rob, she’s like me. She loves them so much. You know, you’ve got that drive.

And of course, I would love to have you come down. Oh, that’s exciting. So hopefully next year you’ll be in that building.

You’ll have your own separate place where you’re going to be living. And then so how many kids do you think it’s going to be able to cater for? What do you reckon? It’s going to be I don’t want to water down the experience. So I’m going to say there wouldn’t be more than 15 children in any particular activity any one time, because then you start doing what I’m what I’m fighting against, which is, you know, quality over quantity.

Yeah. So, yeah. And it will be people popping in for some kids will only come in for for art classes, some kids will only come in for screeners.

So it’ll just be I think there’s going to be a community feel to it rather than a set number. That makes sense. Yeah.

Do you think you could be able to do maybe out of our school and summer school and all that? Definitely. I don’t I don’t ever stop. So I don’t stop for half terms or holidays.

I just keep going. So I think you need to you’re already not you’re already a little bit on the back foot or behind anyway. So we need to make sure that we give you every hour we can.

So what way do you think the community can support you where you’re living? So you obviously the parents want you to open it and they want their children to come to you. But what way do you think the community where you’re living can support you if you wanted to give a shout out to anybody who’s listening in? The co-op where we are have been absolutely fantastic. They’ve always supported the enrichment days and provided like little snacks and lunches for the kids.

Because at the moment I’m doing this all off financially off my own back. So people have been really brilliant like that and offering, you know, people that come down to do displays and things quite often leave something behind for us to use. But I would say things like schools.

Schools are not always you know, they should try and make use of what’s happening here and say, you know, that’s available, some of our kids need it, let’s work together and see it as a positive thing. OK, and what about equipment wise? If you were looking for donations of equipment, what sort of stuff would you need? Yes, tables, desks and little chairs at the moment is my next thing, actually. So thank you for reminding me about that.

So desks and chairs would be awesome. Anything else? Go on. New computer, yeah.

New computer. Yeah, it’s going to be a continuous thing, I guess. So, you know, once you’ve got the basic furniture, stationery is the next thing and just keeping up with with what we need.

Because I do like to sort of evolve the program to whatever the kids need best. So it’s hard to to put a shopping list. So always contact you or they could just donate money because obviously what you need at the minute is that 75K.

So just to remind everyone quickly, because we’re coming to the end of the program, it’s www.thelearntoshineschool.co.uk and you’re all over social media. So please, please help Nicola. She needs the support so she can open her dream.

And sounds all very, very exciting. So I just want to say, Nicola, thank you very much. It’s been a pleasure talking to you and your you remind me of a mini me.

Oh, that’s that’s lovely. Thank you. So all the best to your family as well.

And I hope you get to see your mum and dad very soon, because I know I’ve missed seeing my mum in Middlesbrough because I’m seeing her since I can’t even remember. But that was probably really nearly 18 months. So it’s so hard.

Yeah. So I just want to wish you all the best, all the best to your family. And yeah, I hope you raise that 75,000 because obviously that’s key for you to be able to move in there and set up your school, the Learn to Shine School.

Oh, how amazing is that? You’re a virtual hug, a pandemic hug. Thank you. So thank you, everyone, for listening in and keep safe, keep strong.

We’re nearly there. There’s not long to go. Hopefully for our new normal, whatever that is.

Thank you, everyone. And bye bye. Thanks, Nicola.

Bye bye.