Female-ing – Lauren Rogers, A Story Of Hope

Hello, everyone, and welcome to women's radio station. I am your host, Nicole Goodman, and we are here at the femaling show. And today is my first episode here at women's radio station. So I am incredibly excited. I'm incredibly nervous. So just go easy with me and please be kind. And now, because it's such a special landmark episode for me, I wanted to bring you something that I feel incredibly passionate about. And I have asked a personal friend of mine, Lauren Rogers, to join me on today's show, which is called A Story of Hope. Lauren, welcome to women's radio station and femaling. Thank you. I'm pleased to be here. So Lauren has a unique story to share with you all. And one, I am completely honored she has brought here with us. As you know, femaling is about empowering women to accept themselves, understand themselves, and most importantly, be themselves. And there is no other woman more qualified to sit and inspire you to nurture all of these modes of self love. I'm actually getting shivers as I'm giving this intro. For five years, Lauren and her husband Luke tried relentlessly to start a family, only to experience one disappointment and heartbreak after another. But through every heartbreak they endured, I watched my beautiful friend Rose rise and grow with determination and unwavering courage. Today is a story of hope and bravery and one I am so looking forward to having out in the world. Lauren, welcome. Thank you. No tearing up here. I know. I'm already crying. We've got the tissues out. We're going to be fine. I really want to start with, like, a couple of weeks ago, you turned around to me and you said, I would really like to share my story and I would really like to share it with you. And obviously I was incredibly honored and moved that you wanted to bring this here with me and that you trusted me with your story. And I guess the big question is why? Why now? Why did you want to share this story and what was the point of it? Well, I think there were three things why I wanted to share it. One is that IVF is still, in today's world, a taboo subject. Some perceive it as failure. They're embarrassed to say that they can't conceive. People are never wanting to talk about their struggles. And I think it's important for me. I went through such an ordeal that I want other people to know that whilst they were kind of seeing me down the street and thinking, oh, she's been married for three years already and she hasn't conceived, that actually there was a journey that I went through. And it was a very tough journey. And I went through it with my close friends, but I didn't share it with the world because it was very personal. And also I was embarrassed, you know, as a woman. What were you embarrassed about as a woman? Everyone perceives that, you know, you get. You meet someone, you get married, you have a baby. And the last part of that puzzle I couldn't do. And, you know, when someone is telling you constantly, oh, this isn't going to work for you, or, oh, you've had a negative pregnancy test, it was a failure. As a woman, I honestly, I walked out of so many appointments thinking, I can't. Why am I not being a woman? Why am I not achieving what other women can do? And I used to see pregnant women on the street all the time. I used to hear stories of people getting married and falling pregnant on their honeymoon. And I'm like, why it so easy for them? And for me, I cannot do this. So what is supposed to be. And I say that in inverted commas, supposed to be the most natural, easy thing in the world, you felt you were failing at. Yes. Yeah. And it's something that everybody. Well, most people expect. Expect of you. And I'm pleased you brought that word in because there was that expectation, isn't there, because you'd been married and because you'd kind of waited a couple of years. And I remember there were times where we. We would go to a party or we would. You and I would have a social arrangement with other people and you would say, oh, God, I bet they're just all thinking, why doesn't she have a baby? Yeah. All the time, wherever I bumped into someone, I used to, you know, people used to look at me and I used to think, oh, God, they're thinking, is she pregnant? Look at my stomach, you know, And I know that people used to say to like, my sister. Did you notice people used to look at your stomach? Yeah, all the time. All the time. To see if I'd. And in fact, one time I was going through an IVF cycle and I was really bloated and I was bumped into somebody I knew and I was thinking, oh, gosh, she is going to think I'm pregnant. Because I did look really pregnant then because I was so bloated from all the drugs and I kept thinking, oh, God, she's now going to, you know, be waiting for my announcement in the next couple of months and nothing was going to come. Yeah. And I think. Did people say anything to you? Did they? Apart from Your perspective, and obviously you're walking around feeling like you're failing as a woman somehow. Did anyone actually say anything to you of like, well, when's the baby due? Or when are you having a family? Or was there added pressure there? People didn't say, when's the baby due? Because they didn't want to assume I was pregnant because I wasn't. But I had a. It was a lot of. You know, there was one instance where I was introduced to somebody. I got left with her to make small talk, and her first thing she said to me is, so how many kids do you have? And it was a leading question. The only answer I could give them was none. And instead of someone saying to you, do you have any kids? Where I can go, no, not at the moment. To say, to ask somebody, how many kids? Very presumptuous. Yes. And I. That it killed me, that question, because I was like, well, hold on a minute, I don't have any. And it shut her up. And it. Then we then were sat in for two minutes with awkward silence because, you know. So when you said none, what happened then must have been like a lead balloon. Yeah. We just sat there in silence because I was like, I'm not expanding on this. I have none. And that's it. And you've asked me an uncomfortable question. You can sit with it. Exactly. Exactly. And I think. I bet she learned something in that moment as well. Yes, she did, because she said to the other friend that we were with, oh, I think I put my foot in it. And I just want people to know that. Never assume, never. You know, it doesn't need. That question, doesn't need to be asked. And, you know, I was thinking about it this morning, thinking, when you're married, you wear a ring. That's your badge of honour to say to other people, I'm married. But when you're a mother, you don't have that badge of honor. And so therefore, people feel the right to ask those questions. But actually, no one knows what other people's struggles are. And I think that's a really important thing to always be mindful. Don't always assume that people have kids, and some people don't want kids, but also don't assume, like, my single friends will always say, you know, when they first meet someone, oh, you know, you're married. They assume that they've got their life sewn up in the way that society dictates, and society expects us to be married and have our family and all of that, and they feel like that's a failure on their part. But, you know, some people are happier being on their own. I just think, and I love what you're pointing to, that actually we just need to be mindful of people's choices and people's paths and everyone's path goes in a different direction. Yeah, absolutely. So you want to. You want to get this story out in the world. Just so that just sum it up for me. I want to, you know, I didn't talk openly to the world. I spoke to, obviously, my friends and my family about my journey. And I feel that it's important that people know what others have. Can go through to get to the end result. I also think I want to give people hope. You know, my journey was, as you'll hear and I'll talk about, was very, very turbulent. And I want to give hope that you've got to, you know, you've got to keep going and you've got. And it's a journey. And if people always talk about an IVF journey, and it is a journey because there are ups, there are downs, there are, you know, you think you're going to go then down a different path and you go down that different path and then you come back a different path and it's a whole journey. And I always remember someone saying to me right at the beginning, you're in your journey, you're in your story, and one day you're going to be able to tell your story, which is today. But today, then I was in my journey. Journey, and I. And I was in that journey for a long, long time. I didn't expect to be in that journey. How long time? How long were you in it, Phil? It was about four and a half years. So. Yeah, from start, start to finish, four and a half years. And, you know, it's. It's a hard thing, but I want to be able to. You know, I got a lot of knockbacks and I just kept getting up and going. You did. And that is why I was so happy to have you on the show, because as I said in my intro, you had such determination and such courage with you at all times. And I know that, you know, there were moments where it wasn't plain sailing for you. I mean, that is. That is quite a stretch to say that, but even to me, one of your closest, nearest and dearest, even I didn't see the extent at how it was manifesting in you and how it was playing on you and how heavy it was weighing on you, I guess. Yeah. And it's also not just on me. It was on my husband, too. Yes. And I think a lot of people oversee that, that, you know, it was hard on him whilst his body wasn't going through what my body was going through together, it put on major, major pressure on our relationship. And it. You know, he. Every time we got a negative, it hurt him as much as it hurt me. But no one really always asked. No one ever asked, how's Luke with this? Yeah. Did they know? A few people did, but not many did. I. I don't think I did. Be honest. I don't know. I can't remember then. I didn't. You know, I. My concern was with you because you were the one that was pumping yourself full of the drugs. You were the one that was going to. Having to go for all these scans, and you were the one that was physically going through it. And I guess, yes, that is. That is on me and on everybody else who kind of overlooked. Plus, Luke is like. He's always got a smile on his face. He's just the loveliest, loveliest guy. He's happy, he's easygoing. So he also, along with you, gave a public impression that everything was okay. And I'm really pleased that you're pointing to that. It was his struggle as well as yours, because I think as much as the IVF journey is going, you know, is going unspoken about, or people are starting to talk about it a bit more now, and it's becoming less taboo, but I think that he also has his IVF story. Yeah, doesn't he? He does. And it's his story to own as much as it's yours. Yeah. And with you and him, did you appreciate that he was going through it as well? Because you were the one that was pumping yourself. You were the hormonal one. Like, did you understand from his perspective throughout the whole journey as well? At certain points, I did. When he broke down, or certain points when he kind of needed to go off and go for a run and everything else. But for a long. Sometimes I didn't. And sometimes he would just be, you know, doing his own thing, and I'd be the one feeling. Feeling all the pain, feeling all the stress, you know, hormonal and everything else. And sometimes I resented that because I thought his life was carrying on, but other times I then picked up on it. And I think it's important to mention that Luke did relieve his stress. He's very into exercises. He was doing Ironman. He was doing triathlons. So he was relieving his stress in that respect and it was giving him a massive focus so he could, he had the ability to focus elsewhere, whereas you didn't. So for you it was a lot harder. Yeah, exactly. And that's not his fault. That's just the way he worked. He found a release and he found the way that he had to deal with it. So we're gonna cut to a break in a couple of seconds and when we come back, Lauren, we're going to get into the nitty gritty of your story, what you went through, all of those negative test results and you're going to, I hope, share with us exactly what happened step by step. Okay? Welcome to women's radio Station. 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We are here at the Femaling show and I am your host Nicole Goodman and I am joined by the incredible Lauren Rogers. And today's show is called A Story of Hope. Lauren is now going to share her story with us about how her journey and fertility and the absolute reality of what that brought for her and her husband. Lauren, welcome back. Thank you. So I guess I want to start your story with when did you first realize that this was going to be harder than you thought? Well, I was diagnosed pretty much when I was just in my early teens with pcos, which is polycystic ovaries syndrome. And it basically means that your ovaries are covered in cysts. And falling pregnant naturally is very hard because the sperm can't get to your ovaries. It can't get to your. There are so many cysts and follicles that it can't get there. So I was told pretty much like I was 13, I think by the doctor that I would always struggle to fall pregnant. And I always knew that in the back of my head when I met Luke and we got married, we kind of, I came off the pill and everything, right, like about six months before we got married and thought, well, you never know, you know, maybe my body does work. I'll be a pregnant bride. Yes. I didn't care. I didn't care. I wanted to just try anyway. And also you met Luke that little bit later, didn't you? Yes, I met Luke when I was 38. So you were ready? I was ready, yeah. But by this we got married in May 2015. By the summer of that year I thought, right, let's just call the doctor and see what we can do. We called the NHS first and actually luckily the NHS in my area, so I was in Camden, offered you three rounds of IVF on them as long as you were under 40. Now I was at the time 38, but what I didn't appreciate was there was the six to nine month waiting list. So what we really. And we just said, okay, well we'll just continue to try and then we will start after the six to nine months. So we didn't really start until June 2016, which was a year after we got married. And actually, in my first IVF cycle with the nhs, I fell pregnant. So I got what in IVF speak is called a bfp, Big Fat Positive. And I'll talk about all of the acronyms that IVF people all know about. But yeah, I got a Big Fat Positive. And I was delighted. And I kept saying to people, it's so weird. I don't know anyone that's ever fallen pregnant. First time with IVF was this through your 40th birthday? Yes. So on my three days after my 40th birthday, I found out I was pregnant. That's right. And I had my 40th birthday sober. And I had to lie. Cause you weren't feeling, you felt quite pregnant. I felt dreadful. I felt dizzy. I felt dreadful. And I was also having to lie to friends about my drinking. They were like, why aren't you drinking? It's your 40th. And I was just like, oh, I am. And I used to pretend. And you sat with a glass of wine in front of you. Yeah, I sat with a glass of wine and I made, I made all my friends do sips of it. It looked like it was going down. Social pressure though, just in that. That you have to keep this so hidden. Yeah. And I remember even some of my friends, you know, said, oh, are you pregnant because you're not drinking? And I was like, oh, no, no, I'm fine. I'm just taking it slow because I want to enjoy the evening. So obviously that didn't turn into your baby. No. So at eight weeks, I actually was. Wasn't feeling well. I was feeling really, really tired. I noticed that my stools were black. Sorry for the too much information. Is that an important part? So I went to my GP thinking that, you know, I'd never been pregnant before, thinking this is just another sign of pregnancy. And you know, and I, and I. And the Doctor said, oh, I've never seen this before. You need to go to A and E. So it was weird because the same day I was due to have my first scan, eight weeks with the nhs. So I went to A and E and they were doing loads of tests on me and they booked me in for an endoscopy in the afternoon because they thought maybe I had a. Something bleeding inside of my chest which was causing blood to come out in my stools. That's why it was black. That's why it was black. Black blood is old blood. Okay. Oh, okay. So they thought something was in my chest and by the time it had traveled down, it was old blood. So they wheeled me in a wheelchair from the AE department to the maternity unit so I could have my scan. Got into the scan and the doctor was scanning me and he was just like, there's nothing there. And I was just like, no, no, no, there is. There must be something there. But, you know, the test, they've already did a test for me, obviously, as I arrived at the hospital, and they said, oh, you're pregnant. I said, no. And the doctor said, no, you're not pregnant. There's nothing there. So again, they made me do another pregnancy test and it came up positive. And he was like, you know, like, oh, I don't know what's going on. Don't know what's going on. Sent me to another unit, which is the early pregnancy unit. You must have been so panicked. Well, I was just like, well, where is it? I was like, well, there must be something there. Anyway, it transpired, sadly, that I was having an ectopic pregnancy, so the embryo had fallen into my fallopian tube and was growing in my fallopian tree, which is dangerous, and it wasn't in the right place. Is that common? It is more common with ivf. They do say that it's. I don't know what the statistics are, so I'm not going to quote them, but they do say it's more common in IVF than anywhere else when you conceive. Okay. And it can be very dangerous because if the embryos grow and grow and grow and your fallopian tube can burst. So it had to come out. So it had to come out. But before then I had to have my endoscopy, so there was two things going on. So I had to go from that, from the early pregnancy unit up to the endoscopy unit, where they put me in a private room. And I heard the doctor say, she's just found Out. She's had an optopic. You know, let's just be really nice to her. And I just burst out crying. And I just. I was on my own, and I was just like, what's happening? Like, I had to spend eight weeks thinking I was pregnant. Luke and I were thinking of names already. I was rubbing my belly every night and talking to this baby. And within a flash, it was gone. So it was dreadful. So I had the endoscopy. They couldn't find anything wrong. So the next day I had to have surgery to remove my. Sorry. So an endoscopy, Is that an invasive procedure? It's. They. They sedate you, they don't put you to sleep, and they put a tube down your throat. They're still. They're still cracking on about it's in the chest at this stage. Yes. Yes. Because they still want. Wanted to know where I'm bleeding internally. Because they didn't know. And they said to me, it's nothing to do with the ectopic. Oh, okay. Yeah. So that. Yeah, so they. They didn't ever think that it was to combined. So the next day I had to come back into the hospital and I had to have surgery. I had to have the pregnancy removed and I had to have my tube removed. And so. So you had to have. They had to get rid of the pregnancy. What is that, like a D and C or. No, they actually just removed my tube. So they take the fallopian tube out? Yeah, so they took the whole tube. Sorry, that. Well, is the fallopian tube really important? Not with ivf. I have one less now. Yes, I have one. It's not. It's not that important. If you were conceiving naturally, then yes. Okay. But if you've got one left, it's fine. Does that mean you ovulate every other month? No. No. You still ovulate monthly. If you had no tubes, then you wouldn't be able to fall pregnant naturally. You would have to have ivf. But I always knew that I'd need the ivf. So for me, removing the tube wasn't a problem, but it was just, I guess, the trauma of having to do all these procedures and. And then the grief of the ectopic. Yeah, it was the ectopic. And then it was. Well, hold on. What else is going on in my body? Why am I bleeding? And then. So following on from my operation, I then had to have hundreds of different operations, procedures, to try and find out why I was bleeding. But were your stools still black? They Stopped. Okay, so they stopped. What had transpired was I was losing quite a lot of blood. My blood count was very low. So they gave me a few blood transfusions. They. They did other tests on me. So I had a colonoscopy, which is the one that goes up the other end. She even did a hand movement for us. I did a capsule endoscopy where I swallowed a camera, a little pill which has got a camera in it, and it follows the whole way down. And this is in a time period of how long? This was November through to February. And the topic was in November. Yes, I remember November 11th. Yeah. And emotionally, what was going on for you? I get, physically, that you were being pulled from pillar to post. I just didn't know. I mean, at the one hand, I was sick and I had low blood, so I was very weak. But the other hand, I was absolutely devastated because what I thought was happening to me and, you know, you imagine you fall pregnant and you're like, okay, great. This baby's gonna arrive in June, and I'm gonna be a mum, and this is all gonna be great. And. And then it just gets taken away within a flash. And that is really, really hard to bear. So we kind of, you know, came out hospital, had all the tests, everything came back clear, and the doctors were like, well, if you want to try again, you can try again. Did that mean you had to then start the IVF again? Only had to do. I had to do a frozen cycle. So with ivf, you do a fresh cycle, which collects eggs, and then they fertilize them with the sperm, and then they put them into you straight away. I. Because I've got high polycystic ovary syndrome, I produce a lot of eggs, so I had actually 12. So what they did was they transferred two back into me in February. February. It was now 2017. Yes, yes. So. So I am. But sadly, that didn't work at all, and I just got big fat negative, which is in IVF terms. So in the frozen, you're still having to inject yourself every day, you're still pumping yourself full of hormones? Yes, yes. Because what they do is they try to thicken your lining, to get your lining really thick. So when an embryo goes in, it sticks and it's not thin and it doesn't break. And they really want the embryo to give the best chance. So I was on blood thinners, I was on progesterone tablets and progesterone injections, and they really basically get your body as hormoned up as you can to receive an embryo so it can stick and hormonally, like, oh, it's horrendous. I don't remember you being like a raging lunatic. Oh, I was. They gave me these estrogen patches that I had to stick on top of my legs and I was. I was a nightmare. In what respect? Like, tell me one of your meltdowns. I can't remember because it was so many years ago now, but I always was having. Always having a meltdown. I would scream at Luke because he wanted the lights on in one part of the flat and not in the other part of the flat. And so I turned them all off one day and said, eat your dinner in the dark. To be fair, though, Luke is a bit weird about the door shut and the lights off. He is. But, yeah, I nearly threw my dinner at him. That's amazing. I once walked out and went to Selfridges for the evening because I didn't want to be in the room with him. Yeah, you bought yourself something to cheer yourself up. And I did say to him, I said, you're lucky I didn't have your credit card with me. So hormonally you were all over the place. All over the place. And how long does a frozen cycle last for? It takes. It takes about a month to get your body ready. You put the embryo in two week wait and then you find out if it's worked or not worked. And this is when you got your big fat negative. Exactly. Bfn. Yes. So we are going to cut to a break, Lauren, and we are going to come back and we're going to hear more of your story on your story of hope and your journey of fertility. We'll be back in a minute. Welcome to the women's radio station supporting women's well being. Women's radio Station is all about diversity from opinions, career, ethnicity, education and most importantly, women's well being. 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We give practical help to get people back on track. Whether you're thinking of having a baby, trying to get out of an unhappy relationship or just unsure what benefits you may be entitled to, we can help visit turntousous.org.uk welcome to the women's radio station supporting women's well being. Women's radio station can give voice to your brand. With a wide range of sponsorship opportunities, including individual programs, we can tailor your experience for you. For more information on how you can sponsor a show, go to womensradiostation.com Women's radio stations supporting women's well being hello everyone and welcome back to Women's Radio Station. I'm your host Nicole Goodman and you are listening to the fellow Femaling show. I am joined with my my not my host. My guest tried to say that too quickly, Lauren Rogers and she is telling us about her journey of fertility. So we're up to your second IVF cycle which when you said your words, a big fat negative. What happened after that? Lauren so after that I ended up going to a new clinic. Friends of mine recommended this clinic on Harley street, said it was the best and they had success. So we gave up with the NHS because my, my I was over 40 by now, so I'd run out of all my options with them. And I started at my cycle in June. This is your third cycle? This was my third cycle in June 17th. And sorry, when was your last cycle? Just so we know. February. Okay. And had your hormones calmed down by that point? Were you not throwing your dinner at your husband? No, they'd calm down. We'd probably had a holiday in between that. We always did a holiday in between cycles because it was kind of to reconnect as a couple because that was really important for us. And actually one of my questions is what was your self care throughout all of this? Would you say that that was a big one? Yes. And I always used to say, because you go through a two week wait while the embryo is implanting and you don't know what's going on, and then after two weeks you have to do a pregnancy test to see if it works. And I always used to say in those two weeks, let's if it doesn't work, we're going on holiday. Because I needed something to look forward to if it didn't work. And if it did work, then it was a great reason not to go on holiday. The best. The best reason. Okay. So in June 17, I started with a new clinic, sadly, halfway through my cycle. So I hadn't had the embryos put in. It was about a week before the embryos were due to be put back in, my internal bleeding started again. Oh, my God. Oh my God. So I went back to the doctors and after a few weeks of tests, they actually found that I had a tumor on my bowel. You hadn't started the third round yet? I'd started the third round. It had to be abandoned. So basically the doctor from the clinic caught me and he said, I've just taken your full blood count and you're at 70, which normally most people are at 130. And he said, you need to stop all drugs. We can't do this anymore. You're not well, you need to go to A and E. So off I went, have more blood transfusions. I was in and out of hospital. I was having various different tests and the doctor found a tumor, which is called a gist, which is a gastrointestine stromal tumor. Well done. Yes, that was a lot. And I had to have it removed along with part of my bowel, thankfully. Was this cancerous? It wasn't, but I obviously had to have it checked. Luckily, the doctor reassured me that most gists aren't cancerous. But obviously they still have to do a biopsy on it. So in and amongst. Because you're halfway through a treatment, so your hormone. You're hormonal anyway. Yes. You've already had two very disappointing results. Yeah. And now you've got a cancer scare. Yeah. Okay. So luckily it was benign and I was given the all clear. And in. I think that was in. That was. My operation was in August and I started my fourth round then in November. November 17th. How did you feel going into each round? Well, because each round there was a reason. I was always like, well, that was the reason why it didn't work last time. So when I went into this round in November 17th, I was very much like, well, they found the tumor, they removed it. That's the reason why it wasn't working, because I was obviously my body was trying to survive with this tumor and BLEEP my internal bleeding. And that's why the pregnancies weren't working. So you were walking in very hopeful, very hopeful. Because I kept thinking, okay, well, we know what went wrong and now it's going to work. Okay. And hope is powerful. Yes. It really gets you through those dark moments. Yes. And you just think to yourself, well, I know, you know, there was other stuff going on. Yeah. And that's. And your body can't cope with so much going on. Oh, my God. If I would have fallen apart, I couldn't barely cope with a period, let alone all this. But that's the thing. If you. If I was to fall pregnant and then I wouldn't have been able to have the operation and then the tumor would have grown and God knows what would have happened. So it's in my head, it was like, well, thank goodness I did IVF. Then I found the tumor. So you started your fourth round in November? Fourth round in November. Sadly, that didn't work. This is 2017. 2017. And what was the reason for that? Who knows? Okay. There is no. Sometimes there are just no reason. So there was no reason for this one because as you just said, that the reasons were kind of keeping you together. Yeah. So how was it after this one failed? I needed some time after this one. Yeah. I was like, okay, this, I'm four down and I need to have a plan. And my plan was true Morris, that is. Anyone knows my friends, the lovely Morrises, they're very organised, they're very together. And so that's a real Morris attitude. I needed a plan. So I gave myself Christmas, a new year off. I drank, I did what I wanted to do. You came to my party. I came to your party. Luke pulled Hawaii. We had a great Christmas that year. We ruined Luke. That was amazing. We did. You did have a great Christmas since that year. Yeah. And then in January, I started again, and my plan was to throw everything at it this time. So I did an IVF diet, which I got this book and I did. I was religiously eating, like, gluten. I was gluten free. I think I was dairy free at some point. I was sugar free. I was only eating organic vegetables. She was really fun to hang out. I was miserable, but I was doing it. And I. And I also did immune treatment, which the clinic had told me about, which they. Some. Some clinics say that if your immune levels are high, therefore you never get colds and things like that. It basically means that when you are putting an embryo in your body, your body's rejecting it because it's a foreign object and it's trying to fight any foreign objects coming in. Like a cold. Exactly. Yeah. So I had immune treatment to lower my immune levels. So I started again in January. So, no, because I did three months of this diet. Oh, sorry. So I actually did. By April 2018, I was on my fifth round and I got another BFN. Big fan. Negative. So at this point, I was like, right, I've done everything. I did acupuncture, I did reflexology, and it was just. Wasn't working. So I went to the doctor for some advice, a doctor at this clinic in Harley Street. And how were you holding up? Because the thing is, as you're one of your closest friends, I. We would go out for dinner. I would see you in social settings, and you were fantastic. You were so spirited. You hadn't lost any part of yourself. It's not like you seemed heavier or lower or I didn't notice that you were going through any depression or anything like that. You just. You were just. You. Yeah. What was I missing? What was happening? Or were you. What, was that real? No, I was probably heartbroken and breaking inside. I was. I didn't always want to talk about it because I always know that other people's stories are worse or, you know, other people have got other stuff going on. And I was just like, right, well, it hasn't worked this time. And what's next? I was. I've always been what's next? Yeah. That was like the big savior, wasn't it? Exactly. And that's how I've been brought up. You know, my parents were always like, well, what next? What Next. Yeah. And I'm smiling because, yeah, that is you and your family. It's lovely. And I took time. I took time to grieve and, you know, I took. Gave myself weeks sitting on the couch, just watching box sets. We went on holiday. We built our relationship back up because those holidays were really important for Luke and I because we would be, you know, screaming at each other, and then it wouldn't work. And then we'd be like, okay, we need to now rebuild and remember why we're together. Yeah, so. So we, you know, we. And then during those holidays, we used to then discuss what next. Okay, so. So you went to the daughter for some advice. I went to the doctor to find out what. Yeah, some advice. And I was 41 at this point. And we're now. This is 2018 in the summer of 2018. Yes, exactly. And the doctor basically gave me the biggest blow. He said to me, at 41, I was too old. I had four months until I was turning 42, and if I didn't try again as quickly as possible, then I would need to go down the surrogacy route or I would need donor eggs. Because he said, you'll never fall pregnant yourself. Yeah, he said that to me as bluntly. And when you walked out of his office, oh, it was dreadful. I was just like. I felt a failure as a woman. I felt like our dreams were diminishing between our eyes, you know, before our eyes. And I was just like. I was heartbroken. I was absolutely heartbroken. I was just like, oh, oh. So that's it then. And all that work those last four years or three years were just gone to nothing. Gone to nothing. So it took us a few weeks, and it was over a dinner one night that Luke and I discussed it. And Luke said, I think we should try surrogacy. He said, your body's been through enough. Let's try it and see what happens, because he doesn't want the dinner thrown at him again. And also we had five embryos left from our NHS round, actually. Okay. That was still in the freezer. And so we spent a lot of money, we did a lot of research. We actually went. And I won't bore you with the UK law around surrogacy, but we actually went to the country, Georgia, and enrolled in their surrogacy program. We shipped our five embryos over there, which cost us a fortune. And we went, we flew over there, we met the surrogate, but sadly, we had a failed round in August 2018. And then another failed round in September 2018. And the reason for that, we don't know. We think it's because the embryos weren't good enough because they were the worst 5 out a bunch of 12, otherwise it would have implanted them. Yes, exactly. So when it tends not to work with an embryo for someone who falls pregnant quite easily, it's generally because the embryos aren't good enough. So now you're losing hope, You've lost a lot of money. Complete hope. I then, and I'll speed it up because there's quite a lot going on, we then went to another doctor and after various tests, etcetera, he took me for a scan and he thought he saw a shadow on my ovary and told me I needed to go to an oncologist. So on top of all of this, I was then facing ovarian cancer and I had to have loads and loads of tests and I. Thankfully, nothing was there. The scanner obviously was seeing something that he didn't. That he didn't see because I had loads of blood tests and my cancer marks were fine and everything else. But that was just another thing to throw in the mix of it all. And then finally, in January 2019, I went to another clinic which was more holistic, so they believed a lot of nutrition, looking after the body and looking after the patient more. And the clinic's called Zeta West. And after months and months of different tests and them working with me In June, on June 20, 2019, I finally saw two little blue lines on a pregnancy test. Oh. Getting very tired, obviously. I know you did because you're sitting here with your beautiful big bum as we speak. Yes. So, you know, fast forward to today. I've got six weeks to go and I'm hopefully gonna have a baby. No. Well, you are having a baby. If it's not hopefully, you are definitely looking at you, my darling. You are definitely having a beautiful baby. Even if it comes today, you're having a beautiful baby. Yeah. Well, let's hope it doesn't come today. So you changed, so that's brilliant. So you finally got what you had been waiting for. Hence why this is now a story of hope. When we come back to the break, we're gonna talk about when you got your dog, and I wanna know about how that was timed in with you falling pregnant. Be back in a sec. Welcome to Women's radio Station. Hello and welcome to future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte on women's radio station. Hello and welcome to. Judy May is listening. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy and we're at Women's Radio station supporting women's well being and we're talking about all things autism women. The possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. Hi, I'm Nicole Goodman. And I'm Lauren Mishkon and this is the Self Care Club podcast. The advice for self care today is endless and can feel like yet another overwhelming job for women. The Self Care Club is part social experiment, part reality show. Every episode we trial a different self care practice, live it to the letter for a week and report back to you on the results. Will it actually improve your well being or will it be another waste of your time? We test out self care so you don't have to welcome to the Self Care Club. My name is Ingrid Marsh and I host the Radical Wellbeing show supporting women's well being. On my show I bring you ordinary women like me and you who are sharing their unique stories. Women who have refused to be defined by their pains, to be silenced by stigma or crushed by stereotypes, and who are taking back their power. And together our mission is a simple one and that's to inspire you to kick away the roadblocks too. To don your wings and be the person that you were born to be. Do you want to be a doula? Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth and the postnatal period? 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You're listening to women's radio stations supporting women's well being Women's radio stations creating a global network for the empowerment of women and we want you to be involved. Join us on Instagram and Twitter. Women's radio station that's womens Radio, STN or Facebook Women's radio station to keep up to date with all our exciting programs. Hello, everyone, and welcome back to women's radio station. I am your host, Nicole Goodman, and we are here at the fe femaling show. I am joined by my guest, Lauren Rogers. And just before the break, she told us how she saw those two magical blue lines that told her she was pregnant. Hooray. And I'm sitting here watching you today, and you're due in six weeks. Yes. Amazing. So the one thing I want to ask you is because you suddenly ordered a dog. Yes. Out of all of this, I knew you changed clinics and everything else. And as your friend, just seeing it from my perspective, you'd ordered this dog. And I totally got why you ordered a dog because you wanted to grow your family. But then it seemed like the dog arrived and then you announced your pregnancy. So do you think that there was something that you were able to let go of or something that you like, do you think that is connected? I think. Well, I personally think that it was just coincidence. Yeah. I don't believe in coincidence. My husband thinks the dog's a lucky charm. Yes. We all. The dog was born in May and we were going through a cycle. Then I fell pregnant in June. So that was your final cycle. Yes. And what number cycle was that? Eight. You did eight cycles. Eight cycles. Wow. Yeah. You're superwoman. You got to keep going. So, yeah. And then we picked the dog up in July. So, yeah, we were. The reason we got the dog, as you say, was because after failure, after failure, after failure, we wanted to grow our family. And Luke had said to me at one point, well, do you want to get a dog? And I had never thought of having a dog and nor had he. We're not. We. We didn't grow up with a dog in our families. And I was like, yeah, okay. And then we ordered the dog, and then I felt pregnant. And my dog has never seen me not have a baby in my tummy. So she is your lucky child. Yeah. She's going to be like, you don't have a big belly anymore. Do you think she'll say that? So I want to. I really want to get to the crux of it now. What did you learn on this journey? I learned that you got to keep going. I learned that you've got to. And Can I just. Sorry to interrupt, but how did. How did you always keep going? You said that you had the perspective always of what's next. What else kept you going? Support. Yeah. So my support, the support from my family, the support from my friends. I also was on a Facebook group, which was fantastic because it was. It's an IVF Facebook group. And for people listening. Can you tell us the name of that group? It's called the ARGC Facebook group. It's private, so somebody will have to invite you to it. ARGC was one of the clinics I went to. It wasn't the one I got successful with, but it was one of them. But now that group is coming, more and more people are going. Are on that group, not at argc. And it was a huge, huge help for me because any question you have, you know, you have all these tests, you have all these appointments, and you walk away. You know, I shouldn't have. I should have asked this. I should have asked that. And you straightaway go onto this Facebook group and you ask those questions. And all these women have been through it and going through it. Yeah. And they cheer you on when you tell them that you've fallen pregnant. And they are there for you when you tell them it didn't work. And I've made some really good friends from this group. I really have. And I. I think that was the best thing for me. And how did it. How did eight rounds of IVF and all the cancer scares and the operations and procedures and everything you went through, how do you think it's gonna feed into you? As a mother, I worry that my child's gonna be spoiled rotten. They are. I was about to say she. But we have no idea whether it's a shield. They are. Yeah. Because they are. We're all gonna spoil them rotten. Because to me, this is my miracle child. This was the child that I never thought I would have. So it's going to be emotional. I. I know that now. And I'm gonna have to try and not be like, you're precious and you're a miracle, and you know, you can't. You. You can do this and you can do that, because I just need to. Yeah. I need to just go. Okay. You're. You're here. Yeah, you're here. You're here. Exactly. And I just think the gratitude that you'll have for this. Yes. For this mirror. And it is a miracle child. Yes, it is a miracle. After all this time. Oh, how lovely. And what was. I want two questions. What was the hardest part of it for you? And I was gonna say, what was the best part? But obviously that was seeing the two. What was the. But apart from the two lines, what was the most Positive thing that you will take with you. The positive thing I take with me is that after all of the knockbacks and being told, this won't work for you, or, sorry, this hasn't worked, took this time. The last clinic I went to, Z2s were very positive with me. And I went to them because I was told they are actually brutally honest with everybody. So some people go in and walk out and be told they can't help them. With me, they came out and they said, we can help you. Actually, from this last cycle, I got three genetically tested, genetically good embryos. One of them is in my belly and two of them are in the freezer. And when we got those results, the doctor said to me, you're going to have three kids. And I was like, I'm 43, I haven't got time for three kids. I don't want to still be popping them out at 50. But that helped me because they were hopeful. And if a doctor who knows all of the statistics and everything else is hopeful, than I can be hopeful. Yeah. So it was hope. Yeah, hope. Hope. I mean, and I love that you're pointing to that because that's what the title of the show is, a Story of Hope. And I think that how that hope pulled you through and the hope from other people, it's just. And there were times where other people around me were like, why don't you just give up now? And I was just like, no, I'm not ready to give up because I believe this is going to happen and I've got to have hope that this will work. Did you ever lose hope? Sometimes, yes, sometimes. But not hope that I would have a child. I would. I lost hope that I would have my own child, as in my own flesh and blood and genetically attached to me. But there are so many options out there nowadays with surrogacy, donor eggs, adoption, that I always had hoped that we would have a child. I just didn't know how it was going to come into the this world. The one thing I want to touch on is, I remember, obviously it was at least nine months ago. I said to you, oh, there's this amazing podcast I want you to listen to. It's about a story of fertility. And you said to me, has she got a happy ending? Because if she has, I just don't think I can listen to it. What was going on there for you and what do you want to tell other women about that? I listened to a lot of podcasts. About a year and a half ago, I was on holiday, one of our holidays where we were trying to get over a failure. And every podcast was like, well, they had a. They've had a positive pregnancy test and they're, oh, we're pregnant. And they announced it. And I hated it. I absolutely hated it. And even though I know the struggle that these people went through, because I listened to the whole podcast, I was like, well, it's not happened to me. Yeah. And I think for me now, and I'm very conscious in this pod, in. In this radio, state radio show, that it doesn't always work. And people are still going through this journey longer than I have. They could have gone through 10 rounds of IVF. They could have had miscarriages galore. And it. The journey, it doesn't happen always. Yeah. The journey doesn't always end with a happy ending. And it might be that people choose after a certain time, financially, because IVF is very, very expensive or because emotionally they cannot go through it again, that they choose to have their life in a different way. They choose to buy a holiday home, they choose to travel, they choose to do something else. That's their happy ending. Yes. Yeah. And I think, and I'm really conscious of that, that I don't want it to be just a happy, you know, happy ending for everyone. Look at me. Yeah. No, because it's not for everyone. No, it's not for everyone. And it's nice to be. I think it's important to be mindful about that. By the way, the podcast was. Didn't I said to you, no, no, you can listen to her, she's not pregnant. Yeah. It was a very good podcast. And what was the hardest thing that you went through? What was the moment that you thought, I can't do this anymore? It was getting all those test results. So with a clinic, we used to. They used to take a blood test in the morning. I used to have to go at 7 o' clock in the morning, have a blood test. And then I had to sit by the phone and wait and I had to wait until they called me to tell me whether it worked or not. And I literally, I was like that needy single girl waiting for a guy to call her or text her to confirm a date. I was checking my phone all the time. I was asking my mum, call my mobile, check, it's working. And it was horrendous. It was absolutely horrendous. So I learned after that that do a pee on the stick first, and then you kind of know your answer before you're waiting for the call. That's a good piece of advice. And actually, that was my next question. What was. What advice would you give to women who are going through the IVF process? Knowledge is power. I would say get as much knowledge as possible. Have people around you that understand the process, understand, you know, even, like, I have friends now who are going and getting blood tests because they're trying to conceive, and it's not working. And they get the blood test results, and they don't know what the answers are. You know, they're just getting a piece of paper, and they're bringing them out to me over dinner and saying, what does this mean? I'm not a doctor. I do understand most of the results, but they need to get as much. Yeah. Do your research. Emotionally, how could. Mentally. How can they look off themselves? Just give themselves time. Do you know, do whatever it takes to relax them. Meditation, reflexology, acupuncture, and also, it doesn't matter how a baby comes into this world. I believe that if a baby is coming into this world via surrogacy, via a donor egg, you're bringing that person, you're bringing that baby in. So especially with donor, you're carrying that baby. Everything you're eating is feeding into that baby. And it doesn't matter whether it's got. It's genetically attached. All that matters is that it's here. Yeah. Beautiful. Lauren, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for sharing your story with me. I feel very honored. You are a absolute representation of bravery and courage and hope, and I could not be prouder to call you my friend. I really couldn't. And I couldn't be more excited to have a little cuddle with that beautiful newborn. Thank you for coming. I always end with a. With a quote. And today I have two. The one is. The first one is the best for you, comes after the hardest climb, because I thought that was just so relevant to you. And the second one is the moment you're ready to quit is usually the moment right before a miracle happens. So never give up. Absolutely. Would you say that that. Would that resonate with you? Absolutely. Absolutely. Because my last round was gonna be my lot, my final one. Yeah. Was it gonna. It was gonna be your final one. I said that at the time. Who knows? Yeah. But I was always like, okay, this is now number eight. How. How much more have I got to give? Yeah. And. And there you go. And then you. You got your miracle. And maybe God or the higher purpose around us or whatever you want to call it, maybe they have heard that and said, okay, we'll give her a baby. Now. She's done. She's learned her lesson, whatever that may be. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you. Thank you for your honesty and thank you for all that you went through. Thank you for listening to Femaling. This is my first show here. I think it went pretty well. What do you think? I will be back in two weeks time and I can't wait to bring you another exciting topic of women empowerment. Welcome to the Women's Radio Station Supporting Women's well Being Women's Radio Station is all about diversity from opinions, career, ethnicity, education and most importantly, women's well being. We aim to celebrate the individuality of every woman everywhere, providing opportunities and the platform for your voice. Visit our website womensradiostation.com for more information. I'm Tamina Zaman, founder of Empower and Enrich. When it comes to money, do you clam up or get confused? Do you wish you could save more money or are you hoping you have enough for retirement? You are not alone. 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