Get Booked – Samantha Hurst – Pourings Of Love

Hello, I'm Hazel, and welcome to today's episode of Get Booked here at our fabulous women's radio station in Covent Garden, supporting women's well-being. And today we are going to be interviewing Samantha Hurst on the book Pourings of Love. Hello, how are you? I'm good, how are you? Not bad, you know, yeah, a little bit flustered. It's Christmas, you know, everything's a little bit crazy, isn't it? We got there. Yeah, we're trying to get there. Uh, I don't know, it just seems to be quite crazy at times. And what I find is one of the reasons that I have a book show is because books chill me out. Yeah. They give me something else to think about. Do you know when you're overwhelmed, which to be honest your book is about being overwhelmed with love and, and what it does to our brains, I just find that sometimes it's an escape, it's an excuse to get off your phone, it's just experiencing somebody else's life, something that's happened to them, whether you have experienced it yourself or you want to help understand what somebody else is going through, or just live somebody else's life because yours is a little bit too hectic at the moment. Are you with me on that one? Yeah, I understand that. Yeah, it's just nice to immerse yourself in something that's not you for a while. We can become very self-focused, and I think something to take us out of that is actually really helpful. Yeah. Yeah. What I tend to do with my books, I mean, I read 2 or 3 books a week, and I go from, I like to read a memoir, then I like to go on to something that's ridiculously funny, and then go on to something like fiction, just to mix it up. Otherwise, I can feel my levels kind of going, "That was a bit too much of reality." And if somebody can mix all those three together, that's just absolutely perfect. A dream book. Yes, absolutely my dream book. Um, so today we are talking about Pourings of Love. Now, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself, your background? Okay. I've done many things. My 20s were working in the city, and in my 30s, early 30s, were traveling. I was in India for around a year. I lived in a commune, a meditation commune, for around a year. No way! Yeah, I had quite a fun time there. And then I came home, and then I studied to be a naturopath. And I went in the route of natural healthcare and opened my own clinic. And I think around the age of 38, 39, I decided I didn't want to do that anymore via, um, some personal issues, and I just got to a point where I was done with it. So I moved on and I went into art, and from the art I went into mental health coaching, which I still do, and then recently writing. And yeah, the book is called Pourings of Love because the book poured out of me. I didn't have any say. It was kind of relentless. I'd wake up in the morning before I'd even had my tea, which is very important to me. I would literally have to write. It was just, these words were just, I'd have to pull over my car and write. Wow, really? Yeah. Do you know what? I have that sometimes. When I get something in my head, I've either got to send myself a voice message or I quickly pull over and write it, or if the kids are in the car, I'm like, "Can you just write that down for me? That'd be really helpful." I've got an 18-year-old, so he has his headphones on, so he wouldn't hear me if I said that, so I literally have to pull the car over. Wow. Yeah, the thing is, I'm at that stage now that if I ask my kids to remind me to do something or write something down for me and it's tech-based, so it involves them being on my phone or being on my iPad, they're like, "Yeah, sure, Mum." We're all over it, but they're 9 and 13, so, you know, enjoy it. I'm trying to. I just want a little bit of— I mean, you're into natural therapies. Um, do you find that— I mean, we were just talking before we came in the studio, um, about how you do have a little bit more time on your hands now that your son's 18. Does that mean you get to meditate a lot? Interestingly, I don't meditate at all. Really? That surprises me with your background. Yeah. Okay, okay. What I teach now is, is kind of points to the fact that all states of mind are natural to us. And what that means is that meditation, the meditative state, is also a natural state to us. So rather than doing any efforting to get into that state, bearing in mind I was a year in a commune doing meditation, um, kind of almost takes us away in some ways from it. It becomes something that we're doing rather than this organic being and just experiencing the state of mind that's coming through. So everything I do points back to the naturalness of our humanity and the fact that sometimes we're going to be really caught and lost in thought and maybe having a bad moment and having emotions that we don't like, which is completely okay. And other times we're going to actually fall into a deep meditative state, and we don't really have to do anything to get there. It can just happen. And I think the more open we are to that, the more it does actually happen. So my first— I've been teaching what I teach for around 7 years, and my first experience of seeing that as truth was when I was in King's Cross Station and suddenly I was there. Wow. And I had to go and sit down, and it was as if— it was this— as if everybody coming and going and the screams and the noises and everything just became like a dance, like an orchestra and a dance. And I I just sat there and I probably spent about maybe half an hour in this really deep, beautiful state of peaceful meditation. I was like, oh, what I'm teaching really is true. It is part of who we are. It isn't something we have to do. And from then, what happens is I just allow myself to be, allow myself to experience life. And sometimes I fall into that state naturally, and other times I'm really caught up and really lost in my own thoughts. And both are fine. I don't try and get myself to a place to be okay. I know that whatever I'm experiencing is okay. I've heard people say that they have to practice it, practice, um, kind of being, just being, and then it becomes more natural. But sometimes, I mean, I've actually gone to, um, a specialist once who just would— I've got him to help me calm down, to kind of help me meditate, which generally I get so relaxed because I'm— it's a bit like if you get a personal trainer, then you're forced to do an hour's worth of exercise, whereas if you're at home and you got it on YouTube or something like that and you're like, just need to go and put the oven on, I'll come back to that in a minute, I just need to empty the washing machine as well, and it's like it's forced to do it. However, the second session I went, I fell asleep. Okay. Within 2 minutes, in this poor old bloke's, like, kind of studio, I was like, 'Grrr, grrr.' Amazing. So if I was working with you, I would say, well, why is emptying the washing machine not meditative? I mean, it would be— it's in everything. And actually, when in India, I was taught it's in everything. It's in drinking your tea, it's in peeling the potatoes. It's like, it's not, because I get the stuff out of the washing machine, I'm like, Leo, I've told you not to leave tissues in your— now I've got to do the washing again. And the other one, I'm like, you said you didn't have any sweets yesterday and you blatantly left sweet wrappers in the pockets. And so it's not meditative. And also, and I'm like, as we were talking before about molting, I've got the cat hair all on there. I'm like, that cat's blatantly been sleeping on my jumper. So it's not that meditative. I'm sure there's times where you do all of those things and you're in completely different states of mind. Sometimes you'll be caught up and stressed and it will all be a problem, and other times it can just flow and be easy. And it's just pointing to the fact you're not experiencing emptying the washing machine, you're experiencing your head. Do you know what, I mean, you are right, but it's different things for different people. I can, I find it a bit of a meditative state, clearing up my cleaning cupboard. I just want to be on my own, clear it all out, and that to me kind of is like a control alt delete. I really like it. If I'm a bit stressed, I clean or I reorganise things that you don't have time to do on a weekly basis. You know, I've got a hair in my face. That's because I was talking about molting. Molting. But it's, yeah, everything for everybody. Now I find also something else that kind of relaxes me is writing. It's cathartic. Now Pourings of Love must have been ridiculously cathartic. Oh my gosh, yes, it really was. It kind of cleansed me of the experience, to be honest. Ah, Ctrl+Alt+Delete. Ctrl+Alt+Delete, yeah. It was fascinating, actually, and I didn't know— I didn't even know I was writing a book at the beginning. So I've been writing little bits of poetry maybe for around 2 years now, And what I found was they were just pieces. I might put one in my blog or one online or share it on social media, but I didn't really make anything of it. But then during this experience, as I said, the words started coming. At first I was like, "Oh, okay, that could, you know, maybe put a bit more in line with these poems. Some of them I quite like and they seem quite profound and they really point to experience." And then suddenly it was like, "Oh, actually," I could make, put them in a book. And actually, oh, I could put them in an order in the book that tells the story of what I've just been through. And it was just, it just, it was, the whole process was so organic. I mean, I wasn't really doing anything. It was happening to me. It was coming through me. Well, this is why, I mean, it's called Pourings of Love, but I just, it was like an outpouring. Yeah. It was, and because what I quite often say to friends and family, when they're struggling with something, I say write it down. They're like, I'm not really a writer. I'm like, it's not going anywhere, you're getting it out of your head. Putting the writing down on paper is, it's like ordering it, it's getting it out of your head, which is sometimes it's too jumbled and we can't actually deal with it. But even if you're kind of angry with somebody, write it in an email. Yeah, don't send it, you don't have to. You might want to once you've written it because you think it sounds exactly what you want to say, but it's getting it out. And there's, there's a, there's something so incredibly, well, profound, and just, it, it just cleanses the soul. Yeah. And it was retrospective for me because it wasn't that that was the point of it either as I was doing it. It was literally, it had to come out. I had no idea that it was going to be cathartic or it was letting go of the experience. It was just, there was, there was words forming. And they had to— they were forming in the formless, coming through, and I had to put them into form. And in that form, it became incredibly cleansing, but it was only after the fact that I noticed that it was. It wasn't during it that I was thinking, 'Oh, I'm really cleansed.' It was after, towards the end. I was like, 'Oh, I feel really differently about this person and this experience than I did.' And I know that that's to do with the book. It was to do with the whole experience of, of experiencing love and heartbreak and, and things that I actually thought weren't gonna be part of my life ever again. I think that when you don't have to force something, that is when it works better. Do you not agree? Totally. Right, we're going to just very quickly go over to our first ads, and we'll be back in a jiffy, and then I want to find out about your Kickstarter. Welcome to Women's Radio Station. I'm Sarah Louise Ryan, and welcome to Love Lessons Live on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte, on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to Julie May Is Listening. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy, and we're at Women's Radio Station supporting women's well-being, and we're talking all things autism. Women, the possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. This is Carolyn here from Mother's Hour wishing you a very, very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Warmest wishes of a wonderful Christmas and Happy New Year from Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte. Live every day at 10 AM and 10 PM London time on womensradiostation.com. Have a great holiday. Merry Christmas! I'm Judy May Murphy, and from all of us here at Women's Radio Station, we hope you have an incredible holiday season. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy talking all things autism. I'd like to wish you a happy Christmas and a happy New Year from everyone at Women's Radio Station. Hello, I'm Hazel from Get Booked, and I just wanted to say have a fabulous Christmas and a spectacular New Year. Take care of yourself, focus on the positive, and know when to cuddle up with a great book for a delicious escape. Mwah! Do you want to be a doula? Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth, and the postnatal period? Do you have qualities of compassion, listening, caring, and empowering? At Nurturing Birth, we offer approved doula training courses courses across the UK which are facilitated by an award-winning doula. Here you will learn more about the support you can offer, explore the doula role, and think about how to set up your business. No need for previous qualifications. Find out more at nurturingbirth.co.uk. Hi, I'm Hazel Butterfield, a blogger, book lover, and mental health advocate, and you can listen to my show Get Booked here at Women's Radio Station daily at 5 AM and 5 PM. Throughout my shows, we'll talk about the books I've read, new releases, chat to authors, publishers, and book enthusiasts, all with a theme and aim of supporting women's emotional well-being. If you have a book to tell us about, get in touch at presenters@womensradiostation.com. Join me on my show and share my love of books and writing. You're listening to Women's Radio Station, supporting women's well-being. Women's Radio Station's creating a global network for the empowerment of women, and we want you to be involved. Join us on Instagram and Twitter at Women's Radio Station, that's Women's Radio STN, or Facebook Women's Radio Station to keep up to date with all our exciting programs. Hello, I'm Hazel, and welcome back to the second section of today's Get Booked discussing Pourings of Love with the author Samantha Hurst. Now, we've just been talking about the cathartic nature of how you produced this book, how it flowed fantastically, um, but there's so many elements I want to discuss about this book. But I also want to talk about, um, your Kickstarter campaign to get the book off the ground. Um, tell us a little bit more about that one. Yeah, well, someone mentioned it to me and I was like, actually, that's not a bad idea. Um, I toyed with it for about a month of yes and no, and then one day I was just like, okay, I'm going to do it and see what happens. So I set myself a target and I thought I'll give myself 30 days to reach the target. Either it will work or it won't work. You know, that's not in my hands. I can just put it out there. And I put it on social media and I raised my target in 24 hours. That's ridiculous. I saw that because you're way over it, aren't you? Oh yeah, way over. The support was phenomenal, you know, and a lot of it from social media, you know. People you didn't know? Some people, yeah, actually quite a few people I didn't know, actually. More people I didn't know than I did know, which I found really interesting. But everybody was so supportive. People were donating, people were saying they're going to help promote the book when it comes out, and there was a pouring of love for Pourings of Love. Well, you basically, your goal was £1,595, which is just to help you to kind of get the book off the ground, get it published. Printing costs. Yeah, and you've got £2,800. I'm just looking at it now. I mean, just, just in case anybody's listening or doesn't understand how Kickstarter works, I mean, it's generally for anything really, businesses, books, whatever, and people want help, financial help getting something off the ground. But it's not a case of people just give you a tenner. Generally they get to either get a copy of the book, or if somebody's setting up, I don't know, a barbecue business, they can get the first barbecue, or they can get 50% off for life and things like that, depending on how much they want to contribute. And it's just helping people get things off the ground, because you know what, we don't always have rich families that can just go, oh, that sounds like a fantastic project, here's £10,000, off you go. It's, you know, it's about getting these fantastic ideas off the ground. And you know what, it's community spirited. It's— I do absolutely love them, and I got really addicted to looking at some of the Kickstarters at one point because it was just so nice to see what people were going, "That's a fantastic idea. I want this to be in my life." And I think it's brilliant. Yeah. And you must be thrilled. I was overwhelmed. I mean, it really was— yeah, it was humbling to see the support that I got. And also, I'd highly recommend it. I mean, it was a really good experience for me. It was— it was really interesting seeing what people were interested in, how and what pledges they were interested in, whether it be the book or a print of my work, or it could be anything. And actually how people got in touch with me and said, "I love what you're doing. This is amazing, and I'd really like to help you." Some people actually pledged wanting nothing, which really surprised me. They're like, "Just send me a PDF when it's out, but I'd really like to help you." So it was also the kindness of people. Yeah, it was an amazing thing and lovely to see. So yeah, I really enjoyed it. It was a really great, great process for me. That's heartwarming. And it's also, I mean, that's very much to do with what this station is about. It's about well-being and mental health, and to have that kind of support— you've got a huge smile on your face anyway, so you seem quite happy. I love it, it's fantastic. Yeah, um, and also the book, it has one of your, um, works of art. Yes, designing it. So you're a typical, um, woman of today where you have 38 different jobs, you balance everything— being a mother, being an artist, being a coach, being a writer, going around doing interviews, putting the washing on, meditating while you're doing the washing. See, I combine, multitasking. That is, that is one of my, uh, I've got a Twitter handle called Multitasking Mother and sometimes it's just about stupid things you end up doing at the same time. Like I do find sometimes when I'm coming home from work, I'll have my 13-year-old, I'm starving, I've not eaten for 38 minutes. I'm so hungry. Yeah. So I'll say to him, right, okay, get out the chopping board, get out the potatoes. Start chopping. Yeah, yeah, cool, cool, cool. He's chopping. I said, turn the oven on so it's preheated. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm talking him through it. It's like, okay, so I'm chopping the potatoes. What else am I having? What meat do you want? He goes, uh, steaks. I'm gonna do that so you can wait. That only takes 8 minutes. I'm gonna do that when we get home because, you know, decent potatoes, they take about 40 minutes. So anyways, chopping them up, I'm going, now put oil on. Yeah, yeah. Salt. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Cool. Right now, uh, mix them all up with your hands. Wash your hands. I don't want you putting greasy paws all over everything. And I'm doing this while going around the M25 getting home from work, and I'm like, right, okay, have you fed the dog? Yeah, yeah. I mean, it sounds amazing, really. He's a very hungry boy, and he's like a rake, but he does like cooking, but he likes to know he's exactly doing the right thing. And he's just like, I want hot chocolate, how do I do it? I'm like, oh geez. YouTube, I just say go on YouTube, it's all on there. No, he did, do you know what? He wanted to learn how to do his tie for school and I went, okay, yeah, I'll remember to do it, I've just got to quickly get this vlog out and I was like, right, cool, I'm ready, he goes, I've looked it up on YouTube, I've done it, look, I was like, okay. Multitasking. Yeah, yeah, and I think predominantly motherhood these days is say either making it up or telling them to go and check it out on Google. Yeah. Or YouTube, which is pretty much the same thing. Perfect. Yeah. Thank God for those things. It's just ridiculous. Oh, dearie, dearie me. So, a couple of other— are you going to write another book? Yes. What's it going to be on? I think I'm going to write Pourings of Truth, and I think that's going to be a lot about towards the mental health, towards what I've learned through the human experience and who we really are. And things I was speaking to you about, that we don't need to meditate, and just pointing to— and it's fine to meditate. Yeah, I never give a variety. I never give a client a prescription. If it occurs to them to do that, I'm like, yes, do it, but nothing that's forced. It's all very much about people living from their own wisdom, and that's what I do. I point them back to their own wisdom, and when that awakens and they start to trust themselves more, they know exactly what to do. So what I teach is the description of the human experience and the prescription they write for themselves. The book I'm writing is quite similar to that because it's about people being confused about who they are and other people projecting what they think is right onto people. And that's, I think, that's as well as loneliness, that's a lot to do with how people are having so many mental health issues at the moment because they're kind of forgetting who they are, they're confused, and so many people are telling them who they should be and giving everybody just completely undue hassle for no reason whatsoever because everybody is kind of going through their own battle. It's just about— my book's trying to get people to understand themselves a little bit more. And yeah, you'll have to read that at the same time as when you finish— I mean, have you started writing your other one yet? There's bits of it. There's definitely another book of love, but I don't know what form that's going to take. So there is more writing towards love, which is really interesting. But I haven't decided on what form that will take and what kind of book. But Poor Rings of Truth feels like that could be the next one. Yeah. And just kind of explain what I see and how helpful it is. And how helpful it is to know that your experience is coming from you and has nothing to do with the world. And when we start to begin to see that actually the only thing we experience is our own heads. How that actually that's manageable. What's not manageable is when we think it's the million and one things in the world that we've got to deal with. But that is it though, isn't it? It's managing our own heads and our— what we think we are experiencing, um, and breaking it down a little bit. Yeah, I think mine's a little bit different. I think maybe managing isn't the right word. Um, dissecting What I teach is more about— we have thought constantly. Stanford University says we have 60,000 thoughts a day, and as we spoke about before the show, a lot of it unconscious, we're not aware of. And when we start to see that most of that thought is nonsense and all of it is neutral, we can have a very different experience. So it becomes that we observe thought, trying to manage thought. You know, we've all had those moments, like in meditation or in yoga, saying, like, calm your mind, you know. You know, calm your thoughts down. And your thoughts can go crazy. We don't control thought. Mm-hmm. You know, thought is doing its own thing. But we do have the opportunity to create space between us and our own thinking and observe it. So what I teach people is go more into this observer, you know, more objective rather than subjective. And then when we're in the objective, actually we can deal with anything. We can deal with the moment and we can deal with life exactly as it is when we're in the objective mind. When we are in our subjective, we get lost. And so all of mine is to start to create this space where people have this gap where they can fall into it and they can see that we have mental health and we have mental well-being, but it lies underneath all the beliefs and all the things that we think we are, not who we really are. Okay. I think one of the main issues is that a lot of people think, I don't have time to do that. That is what's going on. In the world a lot. Well, see, that's kind of the paradox here. Yeah, it can really look like that, but there's also— once you see it, there's nothing to do. It takes so much off the table because so much of what we do is unnecessary, because a lot of what we're doing is trying to manage the unmanageable. And when we start to see that, we start to go, okay, I can only do what I can do in this moment because this moment is all I have. Again, what I teach brings you really back into the now. Because once— so we can be really lost in an idea or a story or in a thought in our head that's taking us away from the moment. Once we— we don't have to analyse that story or that thinking. We only need to see it as neutral thought. And as soon as we see that, we're back in the moment. We're back here. We go, okay, that's the movie. What can I do right now? Do you know, that's quite interesting. It sounds like a cliché about living in the moment, but I read this fantastic line, and I've said it a few times on this show, is that Depression is worrying about what's happened in the past, and anxiety is worried about what's going to happen in the future. And if you live in the moment, neither of those things can exist. And I think that's such a powerful thought to try and remember and to try and get your head around. And it's easier said than done. I've gone through troubles myself, I've got many other friends that are going through it, and trying— sometimes you just, you've got a stumbling block, and I get that. But if you just need to try and drill it home. We need to try and live in the moment a little bit more. Um, we're going to go over to— we're halfway through today's show already. Wow, I know, we should have bought a bottle of wine with us. Please do it again another time. Yeah, I mean, it's Christmas, you can pretty much put champagne on your cornflakes at Christmas, right? Totally. We'll be back in a minute after these messages. Welcome to the Women's Radio Station support Supporting women's well-being. Women's Radio Station is all about diversity, from opinions, career, ethnicity, education, and most importantly, women's well-being. We aim to celebrate the individuality of every woman everywhere, providing opportunities and the platform for your voice. Visit our website, womensradiostation.com, for more information. Do you want to be a doula? Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth, and the postnatal period? Do you have qualities of compassion, listening, caring, and empowering? At Nurturing Birth, we offer approved doula training courses across the UK, which are facilitated by an award-winning doula. Here you will learn more about the support you can offer, explore the doula role, and think about how to set up your business. No need for previous qualifications qualifications, find out more at nurturingbirth.co.uk. This is Carolyn here from Mother's Hour, wishing you a very, very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Warmest wishes of a wonderful Christmas and Happy New Year from Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte, live every day at 10 AM and 10 PM London time on womensradiostation.com. Have a great holiday. Merry Christmas, I'm Judy May Murphy, and from all of us here at Women's Radio Station, we hope you have an incredible holiday season. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy talking all things autism. I'd like to wish you a happy Christmas and a happy New Year from everyone at Women's Radio Station. Hello, I'm Hazel from Get Booked, and I just wanted to to say, have a fabulous Christmas and a spectacular New Year. Take care of yourself, focus on the positive, and know when to cuddle up with a great book for a delicious escape. Mwah! Hi, I'm Carolyn Van Beers. Please join me for a brand new show here on Women's Radio Station. It's Mother's Hour. If like me, you're a mum juggling far too many balls and dropping most of them, this is definitely the show for you. We'll examine the highs and lows of motherhood and make sure you laugh out loud as we take on this challenging role together. With spoonfuls of advice, incredible stories, it will be a refreshing, honest, and funny look at being a mum. Welcome to the Women's Radio Station, supporting women's well-being. Women's Radio Station can give voice to your brand with a wide range of sponsorship opportunities, including individual programs. We can tailor your experience for you. For more information on how you can sponsor a show, go to womensradiostation.com. Women's Radio Station, supporting women's well-being. Welcome back to today's Get Booked with Samantha Hurst. Now, I'm starting to think that I need to do a kind of outtakes, things that we talk about um, while the ads are on, because we possibly say things that we can't always say on air. But, you know, I think sometimes that's the joy of it, really. What do you think? Yeah, I think that's good. Yeah, definitely do an outside show. Um, now I do want to talk about how you got into mental health. Okay, if that's okay with you. Absolutely fine. Yeah, I mean, that's probably the most interesting part of, of the story of my life was, um, So obviously living in the meditation commune, coming back, having my clinic, I worked a lot within therapies, natural healthcare, and it was really interesting that I ended up having a breakdown. So all the best people do. Yeah, but there you go. And it was unexpected. I hadn't really had much of a buildup. I'd always had, you know, issues with a bit of anxiety and some fears, you know, not but nothing that I thought was out of the ordinary. And one day I just woke up in psychosis and I was like, oh, were you hospitalized? I, I wasn't, no, because of the world that I lived in and because I knew lots of therapists, I kind of reached out to those people. Um, we obviously did go to the doctors, I did go to the Priory, but I didn't have private healthcare, so I literally went for a day and, and they, um, observed me and just said that I was, yeah, definitely had some kind of breakdown. Put me on antipsychotics, sleeping tablets, got loads and loads of drugs. Um, I actually only took the sleeping tablets. Um, there was— I just knew that there was something in this that I had to get through, and there was a part of me that just didn't feel right. But I knew if I could sleep, because I hadn't slept at all, you know, maybe getting an hour a night for, for a good few weeks at that point, which caused havoc. Yeah, I mean, I was in a bad, bad way. I mean, I was quite— I was literally I didn't stop shaking, my mind was just a crazy hellish place to live. Had you ripped your skin off as well? Well, almost. I mean, you know, it wasn't pleasant, that's for sure. But when I got the sleeping tablets, I knew that I could take— the first night I took it, I remember being actually really terrified of taking it because I hadn't taken any drugs for a long time. So I'd taken this sleeping tablet, and what it did, it actually just shut my mind off for about 4 or 5 hours. So I'd have these 5 hours peace, I'd get up the next day and then I'd look to dealing with my experience and what was going on. And obviously knowing lots of therapists, knowing lots about therapies, I did a lot of work on my— what looked like on myself. And what it got me to was a place where I was still full of fear, I was still full of anxiety, but I managed it. And I would say that was over the course of around 7 years. So I would have terrible anxieties, I'd have my days of terrible depression. I came out of psychosis, but my mind was still crazy. And what I began to do was just make my world smaller and smaller and smaller because it looked like I had to do that to be safe and to manage my mental health. So I ended up living in this very small world, taking these sleeping tablets every night and just managing. And almost because I had my son, ticking every day off, just like, I'll get through another day, I've got my son. Yeah. Tick. Done. Okay, it wasn't pleasant, but I could get through it. And I actually didn't realize that I could be happy. I kind of just accepted that that's where I was. I still tried all the things that I could do to try and get myself to a better mental state, but I kind of just believed that I was mentally ill and that's how I was going to stay. Then I went to see a different therapist, and he was a guy that did hypnosis and NLP. And he— I wanted to see him because I thought, well, if I deal with one major fear and phobia at a time, Just, just so people know, NLP, Neuro Linguistic Programming. Yeah. So I said, so I thought, well, I can deal with one fear at a time, and that will make my life easier. So if I can just get rid of this fear, then I'll feel better, and that'll be one less thing on the list. So I went to see him, and he just started learning about something called the 3 Principles, which is what I teach. And once I spoke to him, he said, I really want you to do the 3 Principles with me. I said, well, I'm really not sure. I've come to you for this. I don't know anything about them. And he said, look, just allow me to add on some time onto your sessions. We'll do some hypnosis and NLP, which I had tried before, and it hadn't really done much. It kind of alleviated a little bit, but there was, there was no great difference from it. So I thought, okay, I'll give you a go. And so we started to talk about these 3 principles at the end of every session, and he talked to me, and because I'd had my experience of India and kind of these, this deep spiritual path that I was on. He talked about things like consciousness, and I think, how could I know about consciousness? And I was a bit of a know-it-all, I was a bit of a nightmare client for him, I have to admit. And so I'd see him once a month for 6 months, and then I remember just started— I just asked though, did you know it all? I thought I did. No, I didn't. No, no, that's really interesting. Yeah, yeah, I really thought I did though. And then after about 6 months of seeing him once a month and kind of feel a bit better when I come out of the sessions, but I hadn't really seen anything in the principles that he was talking to me about. And, you know, it was again management. It was management of my feeling rather than curative. And after the 6th session, I remember coming home thinking, oh, maybe there's something in this. I heard something when he was talking about thought. And then I got sick. I remember getting the flu, and I came out of the flu, and I went on to Amazon, and I I thought, there must be a book on this, let me find a book. And I found a book called The Inside Out Revolution by a guy called Michael Neill, who is one of the top teachers of the principles in the world. And I got the book on, I think it was February 25th of which year? Of 2014? 2013? No, 2013. And I read the book in a day. And my life completely changed. Wow, because I was going to ask you, what's your favorite book out there? And I think you've just kind of answered that for me. If it's a life-changing book, I mean, you know, that, that's beyond entertaining, isn't it? Yeah, I mean, it gave me a deep insight. I saw thought. I saw what— I saw the nature of thought. It was very much a, a huge awakening. Um, it— it was almost as if from all the darkness the light came in, my world opened up. I remember thinking, because my quest was enlightenment for many years, it felt like an enlightenment. And it was in a way, but it was, it was so ordinary as well. But it was just, I literally saw that everything that I'd experienced was created by thought, by my own thinking, by this incredible power. And it, and for the first time in 7 years, I had no thought. I thought my thought was calm, my thought was peaceful. It washed over me and I just sat there and I was like, I've got it, I've got it. I'd like to swear right now, but I've got it. You know, you can imagine what I was saying. You've blooming got it. I've blooming got it. And then, and then for 3 days I felt like that and just in a complete state of oneness and pure bliss. What was the name of this book again? Yeah. The Inside Out Revolution by Michael Neill. And it— and then it was very much— I thought I'd stay in that state, but I didn't. Obviously I came back into, you know, a bit more reality, but I felt so much better. And I knew I'd seen something. In all my years of deep meditation and quests and all the spiritual works I'd studied and everything that I'd done, I'd never had that experience that I had in my bedroom on a Tuesday night from a book. And it was just came from within me. It was like I deeply saw the truth of who we are. And from that, it was like, okay, this is it. Okay, there's nowhere, no other direction to go in. And I just then immersed myself in the three principles. And, and I think the first year was definitely up and down. It wasn't, oh yes, suddenly I'm better. Oh, you woke up and just went, weee! But it was definitely, it was like, it was like a consciousness jump. From where I was to where I, where I, where I got to from the book and from my insight. And then from there I was up and down in that state, and then I'd have another consciousness jump, and then I was up and down in that state. And I would say my life is unrecognizable now from that experience. I'm going to go to the shop straight after this session because that sounds like something I really want to get on board with. And again, you know, I said I like a variety as well, and I can't read too many books like that. I need to— yes. Otherwise, because there are certain books that you just flow through, especially more like fictional books because they're a story, but other ones you've got to stop and let it kind of sink in and understand what's happening to yourself. And, and well, it's exactly what Pourings of Love is as well, isn't it? I mean, it's something that you need to read, you read it as a story, but you can go— I kind of said to you, and I hope it was taken in the right way, that it's the book that kind of needs to sit by the side of the toilet so that when you sit there and you kind of want to just sit and chill out for a little bit And you just sit and read another poem. Yeah. And go back to it. Yeah. Books to read in the loo. Yeah, well, it's to be read as a story originally, and then I think once you've read it as a story, you can just pick it up at any point and just open it and read whatever comes up for you, because, you know, it does take you on a journey. It does go from, you know, it's the moment the universe was born, into a love story, into the destruction of love and heartbreak and devastation, and into coming out of that into into self-awareness, you know. It points to the experience that I had. It points to that in the same way, but through heartbreak. So again, I had another awakening through the experience of falling in love, you know. That again was— I had more insights at the end of that into our true nature. Because once you have one insight, it's not like you're done. It's like, oh yeah, I've got— I know what the universe is about. Yeah, I've had a whole insight, a whole one. It's constant, you're constantly evolving. It's, it is, you know, what we're looking towards is infinite, so our experience of it is infinite, and what we can see is infinite. So I'm constantly waking up and again and again to what truth is and to who I am and to how I'm just really a mass of thought and beliefs that aren't true. And I can scratch away at those and just, and I freshen up. But we are constantly evolving. Can you imagine how dull life would be if if we just knew ourselves and that was it and we never changed and we're done. I think that's some people though. There are a few people. I do think that people are quite, you know, there are people that are content, but I wasn't one of those people. Mine was, I was that of a seeker and it was really interesting. I went all over the world with this seeking and as I said, I found it in my bedroom on a Tuesday rainy night in February because it was It's not in the book, you know, we were saying about Michael Neal's book, which is brilliant, I recommend everybody read it, as well as my book. Of course. It's in us, and that wake-up moment can come from any book, it can come in any moment, and it's just us being open to the fact that what you're looking for is who you are. The spiritual experience you're looking for is right here, right now, in this moment. It isn't outside of you, it isn't in another country, it isn't in a book, it isn't in another person. It's here now, and it's just you need that one moment of clarity and to see that, and then you're, you're in a very different space. The seeking falls away. So when we come back for our final section, because we're on our final section very soon already, we want to talk— I want to talk about where everybody can find you, where they can get hold of the book, and And also I want to find out about your 3 tips on mental health. Perfect. Welcome to Women's Radio Station. I'm Sarah Louise Ryan and welcome to Love Lessons Live on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte, on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to Julie May Is Listening. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy and we're at Women's Radio Station supporting women's well-being. And we're talking all things autism. Women, the possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. This is Carolyn here from Mother's Hour wishing you a very, very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Warmest wishes of a wonderful Christmas and Happy New Year from Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte. Live every day at 10 AM and 10 PM London time on womensradiostation.com. Have a great holiday. Merry Christmas, I'm Judy May Murphy, and from all of us here at Women's Radio Station, we hope you have an incredible holiday season. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy talking all things autism. I'd like to wish you a happy Christmas and a happy New Year from everyone at Women's Radio Station. Hello, I'm Hazel from GetBooked, and I just wanted to say have a fabulous Christmas and a spectacular New Year. Take care of yourself, focus on the positive, and know when to cuddle up with a great book for a delicious escape. Mwah! Do you want to be a doula? Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth, and the postnatal period? Do you have qualities of compassion, listening, Listening, caring, and empowering. At Nurturing Birth, we offer approved doula training courses across the UK, which are facilitated by an award-winning doula. Here you will learn more about the support you can offer, explore the doula role, and think about how to set up your business. No need for previous qualifications. Find out more at nurturingbirth.co.uk. Hi, I'm Hazel Butterfield, a blogger, book lover, and mental health advocate, and you can listen to my show, Get Booked here at Women's Radio Station daily at 5 AM and 5 PM. Throughout my shows, we'll talk about the books I've read, new releases, chat to authors, publishers, and book enthusiasts, all with the theme and aim of supporting women's emotional well-being. If you have a book to tell us about, get in touch at presenters@womensradiostation.com. Join me on my show and share my love of books and writing. You're listening to Women's Radio Station, supporting women's well-being. Women's Radio Station's creating a global network for the empowerment of women, and we want you to be involved. Join us on Instagram and Twitter at Women's Radio Station— that's Women's Radio STN— or Facebook Women's Radio Station to keep up to date with all our exciting programs. Well, we have raced through today's show. We've had Samantha Hurst in the studio on Get Booked talking about Pourings of Love and just life in general. We've been shooting the breeze. We've regretted not bringing in a bottle of Chablis to kind of chat away. And we've been talking about everything that this station is about, about well-being, about understanding ourselves, about mental health and the cathartic nature of your book Pourings of Love. Um, and also we've been talking about a the Kickstarter that you did to help you get this book off the ground, which is all about community and helping each other get along in life, which I think is sweet. It's been wonderful, yeah. It's been a really lovely experience. And we did say that we were going to ask you for your 3 top tips on just how to achieve some sort of semblance of mental well-being. Okay, so So this is your specialty. Yeah, it is, it is. And I think it's to see the role that thought plays. So once you see that you're feeling thought, you're not feeling what the movie in your head is telling you you're feeling. That's the story. You're literally feeling thought in the moment. That can be incredibly helpful. So just to understand the system, so to look towards these three principles, you know, is incredibly powerful for our mental well-being, to know that no matter what's going on, you have mental well-being underneath any problems. Now, that never leaves us, it just gets covered. We get bogged down in the world looking real, we get bogged down in our own thinking, and that covers the mental well-being. It's a bit like, you know, being cloudy. You know, the clouds are our own thoughts, they're our thoughts about the world. So it's just seeing through that, seeing through the illusions that we live in, that the world is creating our experience, and starting to understand that our experience is coming from us. That can be incredibly empowering because then you're not a victim of the world. Nobody wants to be a victim. No, it's not helpful. It really isn't, because then there's something outside that we have to mend, and actually all we need to do is wake up to our own resilience. Yeah. And we are all incredibly resilient. Me. And there's so much I can talk to about mental health and what I do, but I did put it into 3 bullet points. It's quite difficult, but it, you know, it really is— it doesn't work how you think it works, you know. It works, but it works differently. It works from inside to out, not outside to in. So people can actually hire you to help them Completely. Yeah, that's my job. Yeah, yeah. I get hired for anything from 1 hour to 4 days. So next week someone's hired me for 4 days, so I'm going to spend 4 days with them and I'll just immerse them in the understanding. And we go for walks, and, and by the end of it, they will see the world completely differently, and they will have a very, very different experience. And a lot of what looks like their problems just won't exist anymore. Not because the problems are gone, but because then they're— how they see the world in their mind will be completely completely different. Me! I'd like to do that! How can people get hold of you? Through my website, which is www.artistcoach.org. Because you are an artist as well? Yes, because I paint as well, so that's on the front of the book, is one of my paintings. Have you been in the Saatchi Gallery? Yes. I thought I saw— Oh no, no, sorry, no, no, I've been in it, I haven't shown in it. Oh right, okay. I think maybe it was just a poster. I'm on the Saatchi actually website. Yeah, that's what I mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Why? Yeah, I'm not, I'm not actually in the gallery, but there, I, my work is on the website. That's— I thought I'd seen something. That's pretty cool. Yeah, that is really cool. All right. Yeah, it's all right. Whatever. There are worse galleries. I feel like I'm— well done, you! Pat me on the head. I would do, but they'd be like, hey Bird, on the microphone, so So yeah, you do a little bit of everything, jack of all trades. Yes, yeah, yeah. I mean, I think— or a sum of all trades. A sum of all trades. The mental health coaching is my main work. I think that's grown, and that seems to be what I do the most. Writing, it just happens. I don't have any control over that. It'll just be as it pours through, it pours out, and that will be the next book. So I try to do everything with ease. I don't want to do anything that I have to force. Yeah, me too. So if I've got to force it, I'm probably not— from my experience, and I know this isn't everyone's experience, but for mine, if I'm trying to force it, I'm probably not going in the right direction. It's what comes naturally, what flows from me. So yeah, so I do— I haven't painted much lately because writing has taken over, but I go where the wind blows, and it's a lovely way to exist to be honest. And after having those 7 years of mental health issues, which were pretty awful, you know, just living and being happy is enough. It's like anything on top of that is just a bonus. The thing is, I'm a huge fan of positive attribution, and it's horrible to go through issues where you do feel depressed or anxious, or— but at least you get to understand yourself a little bit more. And you get to appreciate life a little bit more, and it's just, you're going through something, you can, it's a bit like if you make mistakes in life, then you can learn from them. I mean, imagine going through life if you never had the opportunity or the need to learn anything, or understand a little bit more about other people. When you go through rubbish situations, you develop more empathy for other people, I think. Yeah, I agree, and I think that I don't see anything that was, you know, at the time it was hideous, but looking back, it was what I needed to go through. It was my experience. It's an experience that's taken me to a very different stage in my life, and it taught me, it really taught me a lot. And I don't see so much in positive or negative anymore. I tend to see neutral, and that's incredibly helpful for my life as well. Wow. That's pretty cool. Is there anybody out there in the public eye that you just think, you're smashing it, you seem to have got things right, you're, you're, maybe you follow them on social media and they're posting, maybe they're inspirational in what they post or what they say or what they stand for, is there anybody out there? Well, it's probably the ones you already know about. And again, because I see in neutral, I don't see anyone as really doing wrong. It's kind of everyone's having the perfect experience. You're not on Twitter enough. Oh, I am, trust me. Everyone's having the perfect experience, and it's just how life looks to them. But, you know, Eckhart Tolle, beautiful, just beautiful. And again, what happened was I studied Eckhart for a long time, but actually when I discovered the 3 principles, I really understood what he was pointing to. It was as if these principles gave me, um, the ABC. I was studying all this, all these spiritual texts and, and all these understandings, and I kind of got them to a certain extent. But it— when I look back, it was like trying to read a novel without knowing your alphabet. And the principles have given me the alphabet. So now anything that I study in the spiritual realm, I've got such a deeper understanding of because I've got the building blocks that were in that I needed to understand it all. And so people like Eckhart, um, Ram Dass, just all these, these teachers that really speak to truth, um, and Adyashanti, beautiful. So no one from Coronation Street? I'm one of these annoying people that doesn't watch much TV. Oh, sorry. I mean, I do watch some But yeah, that's not really— All right, so if you're not a TV fan, what do you— I gaze. You gaze. Wow. That's how you— So some people watch Waterfalls when they're trying to kind of gaze and get in their headspace, and you watch Strictly. Yeah, I am on social media a lot. I do listen to a lot of music. I speak to friends. I write. I do watch, you know, I'll binge-watch a box set, like the best them. I'm just not really a big, you know, telly seems to have fallen away from me. So yeah, again, who knows? I'm not a set person, you know, I'm not stuck or set in who I am. I'm fluid. So tomorrow I might become a TV person. Nothing again is wrong or right. I just go where it goes. It's like, oh, I feel like doing that, I want to experience that. Surely you've got to be a TV person on Christmas Day, especially— Absolutely. Right. 'Come on, Gavin and Stacey.' 8:30. Oh my God, I'm on it! Have you seen the little thing where it's like, 'Come on in.' Are you asking me to step on in? Yeah, I'm asking you to come out. I'm asking you to leave. No, I'm asking you, do you want me to step inside? Yeah, I'm not a smug no telly person because it's like, I do actually love the TV. But it's just something at the moment that isn't, you know, and the book took up so much writing time and, you know, the arrangement of the book and the order of the book and, yeah, so publishing a book for the first time takes up a lot of space. So that was kind of what, and the Kickstarter and all of those things, so that kind of drew me away from a lot of the things that I used to do. But I have no idea tomorrow what I'm going to be doing or what kind of person I'm going to be, and I love that. I love the fluidity. You can be whoever you want to be, whenever you want to be, and nothing's set in stone. The only thing that ever stops you is the thoughts in your head, and that is it. Once you see that, everything comes away. It just becomes— it's like you've gone from a blinkered vision to a 360-degree vision, and anything can come in and change your life. We need to refresh our mindset. So when can people get hold of Pourings of Love, and how much is it going to cost them, and everything? Okay, right. Pourings of Love, when this radio interview goes out, it will be on Amazon. It will be on Amazon all over the world, and it will be priced at £10.99 for the paperback, which I advise. You know, there's something about this book that I think should be held and read and opened whenever you need it. And then left somewhere, left somewhere by your bed, in your loo, wherever you like. And then there is a Kindle version as well. And yes, yeah, yeah, there's Kindle and there's this. And then hopefully at some point it will be on Barnes Noble. I'm in the process of putting it on there as well, but it might be on there when this show goes out. It'll be predominantly on Amazon. Okay. There will be— there is a limited run of 250 hardback copies that will be available on my website as well. Wow. Yes. Well, I will make sure, uh, that we put all the links up there as well. Thank you so much for joining me today. Oh, thank you for having me. You're welcome. It's flown by. It really has. I hope you have a fabulous Christmas, and, uh, we'll be watching Kevin and Stacy. We will. Lovely to meet you. Thank you so much. You are very welcome. You are listening to Hazel Butterfield, and today I had Samantha Hurst joining me here at Women's Radio Station, supporting women's well-being. Welcome to the Women's Radio Station, supporting women's well-being. Women's Radio Station is all about diversity, from opinions, career, ethnicity, education, and most importantly, women's well-being. We aim to celebrate the individuality of every woman everywhere, providing opportunities and the platform for your voice. Visit our website womensradiostation.com for more information. Do you want to be a doula? Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth, and the postnatal period? Do you have qualities of compassion, listening, caring, and empowering? At Nurturing Birth, we offer approved doula training courses across the UK, which are facilitated by an award-winning doula Doula. Here you will learn more about the support you can offer, explore the doula role, and think about how to set up your business. No need for previous qualifications. Find out more at nurturingbirth.co.uk. This is Carolyn here from Mother's Hour, wishing you a very, very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Warmest wishes of a wonderful Christmas and Happy New Year from Future Classic Women Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte, live every day at 10 AM and 10 PM London time on womensradiostation.com. Have a great holiday. Merry Christmas, I'm Judy May Murphy, and from all of us here at Women's Radio Station, we hope you have an incredible holiday season. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy talking all things autism. I'd like to wish you a happy Christmas and a happy new year from everyone at Women's Radio Station. Hello, I'm Hazel from GetBooked, and I just wanted to say have a fabulous Christmas and a spectacular new year. Take care of yourself, focus on the positive, and know when to cuddle up with a great book for a delicious escape. Mwah! Hi, I'm Carolyn Van Biers. Please join me for a brand new show here on Women's Radio Station. It's Mother's Hour. If like me, you're a mum juggling far too many balls and dropping most of them, this is definitely the show for you. We'll examine the highs and lows of motherhood and make sure you laugh out loud as we take on this challenging role together. With spoonfuls of advice, incredible stories, it will be a refreshing, honest, and funny look at being a mum. Welcome to the Women's Radio Station, supporting women's well-being. Women's Radio Station can give voice to your brand with a wide range of sponsorship opportunities, including individual programs. We can tailor your experience for you. 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