Hidden Gems – Nelia Bekker Watchmaker

Hello and welcome back to Hidden Gems with Maya on women's radio station the voice of women worldwide. Coming to you from our studio in London, Hidden Gems is designed to inform and inspire our listeners by showcasing extraordinary women in the world of mining as well as the jewelry and gemstone industry. So today on Hidden Gems, we're joined by Neilia. She's a watchmaker based in the UK and Manchester in the Midlands. And we're super excited to have her on because usually, you know, we've met gemologists, jewelry, retail jewellers, so watchers, I don't know very much and I'm hoping, Neilia, that you'll be able to tell me a little bit more. I met. Well, we were introduced through one of Neilia's old classmates. Yeah, welcome to the show. Hi. So how did you get here today? I just got the train up to in central London from home, but I'm currently at home with my mum for the week visiting. So drove down from Manchester over the weekend. And is the workshop in Manchester? Yeah, the workshops just. Just outside of the city centre, sort of, yeah. Oh, and how did you get into this world? Because, you know, with my colleagues and friends in Switzerland, the watch world is a little bit discreet. You know, you have to know a guy who knows a guy and I'd love you to describe who you are in your own world, in your own words and how you got to where you are in the jewelry world. So I just, it's completely random. I fell into it. My mum actually worked in the jewelry industry and she was selling sort of, she was selling a lot of watches at the time, more so in watches than jewelry. And I took it at gap year and I was going to go traveling but then I didn't in the end and my mom said, well, you know, why don't you give this company a go? They're looking for people to just be like technicians. And it happened to be Breitling. So I ended up going, not going to university and staying with Breitling and started out and they ended up sending me to the British School of Watchmaking. So every year they sponsor someone to go to the British School of Watchmaking, which is very small. There were six, six students a year at the time. So two year course, full time course. And yeah, I just remembered before I even went to the watchmaking school, when I was at Breitling, I remember taking the back of a chronograph, mechanical chronograph, and looked at it. What is a chronograph? For the purpose of the. I Want to say the listeners, but me too. I have no idea what is a chronograph. There's two kind of. Well, so you've got an automatic or a manual, which normal watch. And then a chronograph is a timepiece that tells the time as well as can record the time. So it's like a stopwatch, basically. But yeah. So you took the back off one of those. I took the back of the watch and I saw the movement and I went, wow, that's incredible. I want to climb inside and know how it works. And then, you know, discussed with the company and they said about going to the British School of watchmaking. And yeah, I just, you know, I found it so fascinating. I think watchmaking is maths, art and physics all in one. Absolutely. And I just find it. Yeah. So I went to the watchmaking school, did my course there. I was actually one of the first girls. Of the six of you. That was one of my next questions. Of the six of you, how many of you were women? Well, two, and it was the first year that it was myself and another girl. You stayed in touch with her, do you know? Yeah, yes. Is she still in the watch world? Yes, she works for Richmond and she's also doing very well. But yeah, it's the first two British females watchmaking school that graduated. Oh, my goodness. But yeah, and then I was with Breitling for about seven years, worked my way up to also be the boutique watchmaker on Bond Street. Wow, it's so prestigious. Yeah. And it was actually I was the first female boutique watchmaker for Breitling Worldwide as well. So, yeah, that was definitely a statement which was quite cool. So I worked there for a while and then I decided to kind of. I wanted some different brand experience. So I moved down to Southampton and worked for Amiga for two years and worked on long jeans as well. So there was myself and another guy that got trained on long jeans and then I wanted to move back to Kent to my mum and family and friends, because I think most of my friends are either in Kent or in London and worked for a multi brand company called Watchfinder, which actually now Richmond have just bought. Oh, gosh. There's a tiny, tiny watch world. Yes, the watchmaking world is very small. Like you have, you know, everyone or of everyone. But yeah, and it was a great opportunity for me. I learned so much. I got to learn basically work on loads of different brands, so. And just learn what could take people about six years, probably in about two years from the head watchmaker who was Incredible. And has so many qualifications and he's been doing it for, you know, well over 35 years. Just getting that knowledge one on one with him. It was an incredible opportunity. So being his sort of apprentice, unofficially, in the sense he's a guru and he's taught you. Taught you the way. Exactly, exactly. So, yeah, and then I kind of got to a point where I wanted a new challenge because I was just servicing watches and I thought, so servicing, is that repairing? Yeah. So, yeah. And what does that entail? Because you've mentioned lots of different brands. Is it that if you work for one brand, another brand, it's the same type of repair work? Yes. I mean, the fundamentals of a watch is the same across the border. You know, you'll have different movements for different watches, but fundamentally, you know, it's like a car engine. It's. I always say to people who don't know anything about watchmaking, I said, I'm basically like a car mechanic, but for watches, very fancy watches. Yes. Yeah. And you said you wanted a challenge, so what was next? Yeah, So I thought, my family have always said, oh, you know, you can be a manager. And I said, I never want to be a manager. I don't want to go into management. I want to be hands on, hands on deck, work with watches. But then my current role came up as watchmaker, slash assistant manager, and I thought, actually, it's a good way of transitioning and learning new skills and a new challenge for me. I've always been quite ambitious and always looked at what's the next, next step. You know, I've moved around for work and for my career and sort of, you know, and I got to the point where my watchmaking skills, unless I make move to Switzerland and, you know, work for a brand there or manufacturer, or I sort of go on my own or, you know, it was. It would. It kind of came to a bit of a halt. So, yeah, I ended up going up to moving back to Manchester and taking on my current role, which is very good and very much enjoy it. And turns out that I've now sort of sidetracked my sort of role into training as well. Oh, fantastic. So are you training others or you're being trained? No, I have the opportunity to train others. Oh, wow. The student has become the master. You're getting there. You're getting there. And in your opinion, would you say the watch industry welcomes women at all levels, from apprenticeships to horologists? We've mentioned management roles. Is it very easy? Is it accessible? I think so. I mean again, if you don't know anything, anyone in the watchmaking industry, it's difficult to get into it because I think it's as an injury, as an industry as a whole, it's not very well known. I think it's becoming more well known now with advertising and marketing and stuff like that. I don't think there's any difference between male and female opportunities in it. I think maybe years ago it was seen as a trade and therefore was male orientated, whereas nowadays I think that there isn't much of a difference anymore. So it is accessible. You know, it's more the having to study for it and then getting the qualifications and then becoming a watchmaker that I think is a difficult process. Not necessarily to do with male or female. So there's not necessarily a gender difference in terms of the doing the work itself, but I mean in terms of access, would you say they welcome as a woman because you were one of first, as you mentioned, there were two of you out of six. Yeah. Is there a way of making sure that that becomes three out of six or at least half of the group? I think, to be honest, I think in years after my, after I graduated there were more girls that came in and again, I think it's just sort of word of mouth and yeah, I don't know really. I think it is accessible for women and yeah, I've. Is there anything that we can do as women in this industry to get other perhaps younger women or career changers or newbies to the industry to get involved? What could we do? Us personally, I think we should just be really proud of the fact that we are in sort of in a male orientated environment that we are there and I think the women that do come through have, are quite, very strong women and quite independent and they, they definitely then translate that to new people and to then encourage them that it's an opportunity that you can do just as much as anyone else. And I think a lot of women are now sort of starting to wanting to do it more as well. Certainly in sort of society that I speak to or whatever you speak to friends and stuff, you know, daughters and they think, oh actually that could be an opportunity for my daughter and things. And I'll go, oh definitely, you know, it's, it's a great job and it's, it's, you need to have, obviously have the skills for it and stuff but it is, you know, you, the opportunity is there for everyone and with your training, would you like to incorporate a little bit more of that. Yes, I would like to, I think I would very much encourage females to step into the industry. And yeah, training wise, I had any opportunity of talking to anyone about watchmaking. I do. It's a bit odd, really. Coffee shop, we're like, watch out, Neilia's coming with her. Watch. My friends always say when we meet new people, if say we're out and they're oh, so, you know, a generous question. What do you do? My friends goes, oh, you know, I work in banking. And he's, you know, bored of. Oh, okay. What do you do? Oh, my other friends, marketing. Okay, what about you? And then Neelia, I can't wait to hear a little bit more. But we're gonna go off for a short break and we'll speak to you and hear more after the break. WRS women's radio station, Voice of Women Worldwide, Sarah's Universal Soul Show. What does your soul or spirituality mean to you? Welcome to future Classical Woman Awards with me, Stefania Passamonte on women's Radio Station. Welcome back. I'm Russ Cain. You're listening to in conversation with on Women's Radio Station. I'm Angie. And I'm Patsy and we're open. Just to see what other programs we have on women's radio station, head to our website, womensradiostation.com hi, I'm Valentina Barbacci and I'm the executive director of Media Matters for Women. 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We're here in the studio in London Talking about watches, the world of Watches with Neilia, who is a watchmaker based in the Midlands. So just before the break, you were telling us all about what you say to people when you're in a coffee shop or on a night out, and they say, what do you do? Yeah. So when I'm with my friends and they say, they ask what they do and then they come to me and they ask, what do you do? And then I say, watchmaking. And then my friends are going, oh, here we go again. Eye roll, eye roll. We've lost her for an hour. And it's really nice that people are actually interested in it. And, you know, they. They're not just sort of talking to you just because it's polite. They actually do want to know also, what's it like? What do you do? And it's really nice. And I always then have the opportunity to, you know, tell them about my passion, because ultimately it is a passion. But even now, your eyes light up. Brilliant. Great. To be able to see that it has. You have to have passion. I think that's very important because if you don't have the passion, I don't think you'll get far. And do you think that's how people end up doing this for 40, 50 years? Yeah. Is Switzerland on the cards at all for you? I've been to Switzerland a few times for training and stuff. Very much enjoyable. I used to think that I wanted to move over to Switzerland and work out there, but I think sort of as my life has changed, as I got older, I'd be more suited here. Swiss culture, I think, is very different and the watchmaking industry is also very different out there. So, you know, I'd like going over for training, but in terms of living there, it's not for me. You're saying it's different. How so? Can you compare it to the UK watch world as well as the global watch world? Yeah, I mean, obviously it's big manufacturers, big warehouses and stuff. I think a lot of places in Switzerland do sequential work. So what is that? Sequential work is sort of. That's. It's like a production line. So one person does this bit, other does this bit, then that bit. So for production wise, it's quicker, which is great. But to then implement that in an after sales service center doesn't work as well. You know, it's better to, you know, sit and do it yourself rather than, you know, having bits. And ultimately, in Switzerland, it's very much a factory job, which goes back to what you were saying. Just before the break about a car, you know, you likened your industry to a car manufacturing. You do your role, then you pass on to the next bit and then next production. And I think because it's so massive in Switzerland, that's how it's done. But then again, that's in the production rather than the after sales. So where I work after sales is, you know, sorry, repairing and restoring. So it is different, but I mean, globally I think it is very similar because it's obviously a Swiss. Swiss industry, I guess, which actually it isn't because, pray tell, tell us more. Wow. People always think, oh, you know, watches, watchmaking is from Switzerland. Absolutely. It's synonymous. No, it's only. It's actually started in the UK and Germany and Italy. But the only thing is the UK didn't want to. The government didn't want to put money behind it because they thought it was a dying trade. So therefore they didn't. But Switzerland, all they had was farming and then winter had nothing. So they then took it and then patented as theirs and said, well, we are now going to be making Swiss watches and Swiss brands. So. Yeah, so that's how to this day, Germany missed out and the UK missed out. Yeah. Dare I mention the B word, Brexit. I wonder what we would have been able to do if we had held onto that industry. Because it's not a dying. No, it definitely become an art form. Yes. Craftsman, you know, it's just, as you mentioned earlier, it's an art form. Yeah, it's definitely craftsmanship and art form and stuff and with a bit of physics thrown in. Oh yeah, yeah, bit of physics and maths chucked in there, you know. But yeah, I think it's fascinating that it is just now that, you know, Swiss, Swiss watches are so massive, but then you get other companies that like, you get. There's now the UK company called Bromont Bremont, which are two UK brothers and stuff and they, they're doing. Trying to make an English watch brand. Well, they have very successfully actually. That's. And that's where Andrew works actually at the moment. Andrew is who I mentioned earlier, the classmate who put us in touch. Yeah, yeah. So. And I think all after sale service centers around the world are sort of mirrored on Switzerland. So, you know, they have the same layout, same machinery, same, you know, type of things. So it is like little bit of Switzerland all around the country. Sorry, all around the world. That's a nice way of looking. Yeah, yeah. It can be frustrating sometimes because it's. Everything has to be Bought through Switzerland. Oh, that's really wise of them. Again, they have to. They make themselves a very necessary part of the exact production line. Yeah. So they do very well at keeping it their own. So you've mentioned the uk, Germany, Italy, which. Switzerland of course. Where else in the world is a, you know, a place to watch for watches? Sorry, you have to excuse me. I try not to do too many puns but I have to say that. Well, Hong Kong do a big watch watch industry and from the manufacturer point of view. Yeah. Is it after sales or. After sales are huge and yeah. And one of my friends, old work colleagues, he works with his dad in London on the. Have a place in Burlington Arcade and he does buying and selling and sort of auction and goes to a lot of auctions from. And goes to Hong Kong to go to sort of auctions and things. So I know only through him that the market is massive out there as well. And is that for contemporary or for older watches? Antique watches? I think more older. Well, I think they. Their place is called Somlo Antiques and Wellington. I'm going to have to go pop by and visit. Yeah, definitely pop in. Say, say Neela. I'll say Neela sent me. There's a Jasmine called Dan so you can have a nice chat with him about that as well. But yeah, he listener tells me but because they do in antiques they mostly go for the older stuff. But you know, do you know what sort of time period again, sorry for the pun but what period of time is it? You can't escape. Escape them. Where do they focus? Which era? Not entirely sure. I think mostly from like the 60s and 70s I think. But yeah, they've got some beautiful timepieces and antiques in the store and there's stuff from. I've seen from like Hong Kong. The pictures he sends me, they're very classic old style watches. So beautiful. Yeah. And is there anything. Am I allowed to ask you about what you're wearing right now, please. As you know it's radio so if you can be very descriptive, I would also. Well, I'm wearing a beautiful Breitling Mont. Brilliant. Which are actually now discontinued. So I'm actually very happy that I managed to buy one just before they got discontinued. My little pride and joy. What year is it from? Gosh, 2000 and must be seven. That's when I think 2007 is when I started to work for them. So over 10 years. So yeah, yeah. And is it a chronograph? I don't know the language so you have to Help me again. It's a chronograph. Yes. So chronograph is a timepiece that tells the time as well as records the time without affecting the time. Oh yes, you said like a stopwatch, right? Yes. Is it waterproof? It is. I personally don't like having my watches near water, even if they are waterproof, especially if they don't have a screw down crown. So the crown obviously how you adjust the time and date and if that doesn't screw down, you know, this opportunity that's got gaskets and everything else like that. So it is waterproof. But yeah, I wouldn't. You wouldn't recommend. I wouldn't recommend going through that. No, no, yeah. I think also because I know how precious I am over it, I don't want anything to affect it like water or anything like that, so. Oh, gosh. Hopefully not. Sorry, I veered off there for a second. That's right. We're talking about the global industry. I wanted to know what do you think is going to happen over the next sort of five to ten years in the watch world? We have a lot of technology changes in terms of innovation in watchmaking, but of course all of the mobile phone companies, they're making watches as well. What's going to happen? I don't think the industry is ever going to die out. I think yes, people can do have the Iwatches or the androids or whatever, but I think so strip it right back from when watches, pocket watches were first invented. Of course, people used to have pocket watches as a sign of status and wealth. Oh yes. Because the chain used to hang out through the jacket. So that's where watches started off as status and wealth. And I think very much the industry now and for years to come it will still be just exactly that. You know, if people get their first job in London and you know, in the city, what do they do with their first sort of pay packet? Go buy themselves a really nice watch. Especially men. But I think women now are starting to also do it. A lot of the style watches that are made are unisex and it used to very much clientele, well used to cater for men and females, whereas now it's just there's your watch, there's your sort of, you've got the budget, you can buy it. Exactly, exactly. And they're making bigger watches for girls and stuff. And you know, I think it's, it's again, girls can accessorize with handbags and stuff and guys will accessorize with a watch. Oh, they tend to say, isn't it? It's the car, the watch, the shoes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And but I think now the girl. Girls are also starting to buy watches. A hell of. Sorry, a lot more and a lot bigger watches. And sort of it is. Girls are definitely thinking more about watches rather than it just being a male thing. Okay, hold that thought. We're going to go onto a break and I look forward to hearing a lot more about the trends in the watch world. Welcome to women's Radio station, the voice of women worldwide. Hungry an average woman eats about 2 to 3 kilos of liquid stick in her lifetime. Women's Radio Station, we want to hear from you. This is Women's Radio Station. You're listening to Avril Price with Kitchen Sink Spirituality. It's Anna Kennedy talking all things autism. And my guest today is Karen Nunn. I listen to women's radio station. 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We're currently welcoming donations to help towards our running costs to keep this important initiative alive. To donate, simply head to our website. Every little will help. Welcome back to Hidden Gems with me, Maya and my guest today, Neilia horologist and master of time. We were laughing about this during the break. I think that's absolutely brilliant title. But just before the break we were talking about the differences, styles and how there's more of a unisex feel to watches and the watch industry has had to, you know, adapt and innovate to be able to match the needs of the clients. Yeah, Completely. And you know, there used to be sort of like the male watches and female watches, you know, the ladies watch are really small and the gents were obviously bigger, whereas now you get mid size, you get big. And I think a lot of females are wearing bigger watches. Now when you say bigger, do you mean the watch face or the strap itself? No, the watch face. But then. Yeah, then, but say you then get the big watch face usually comes with a big strap. So now then the strap industry also got bigger because then you need to make different smaller style straps for, to accommodate the size of the watch for the ladies. And is that regardless of the material that it's made from? Yeah, yeah. So all leather straps or alligator or, you know, rubber straps or whatever. And then bracelets, you can just take links out. So it's very adaptable. And is the clasp made separately to the strap or it's all. Yeah, so you get two different types of clasps. You can either get the normal clasp which like a pin buckle, or you can have a deployment clasp which is like a bracelet clasp. So you don't undo it, you just sort of undo the clasp and then slide the watch off as if it wasn't a bracelet. And that. Was there any reason behind that? Is it just a design or is there an actual practical. Yeah, the practicality behind it is that every time if you have a normal pin buckle that, you know, wear and tear of putting it on, taking it off, putting it on and it can quite, it can tarnish. So with a pin buckle you don't have that strain process every time. So therefore you just, it's just the strap itself that will wear over time, but you don't necessarily have the buckle and it's normally made out of really sturdy material, isn't it? So it lasts longer. Yeah, yeah. So can you explain? I'm just so fascinated. I've like just delved into this interview and I've almost forgotten some of my questions because I'm so excited. But I can't wait to know a little bit more about you and I'd like to know more about your hobbies and what you do outside of work. I know you said it's your passion, it's what you live for, it's what you talk about. Live, breathe, watch. Time, time, time. But tell me, what do you do in terms of. Yeah, hobbies outside of work? Well, I love sport. I play hockey. Are you on a team? Well, I recently tore my acl. What is it? Wait, what is an acl? Acoustic ligament. The back of My knee. Ouch. So I can't actually need surgery to. To fix that. Oh, gosh. Should you not be on crutches right now? No, no, no, it's fine. I just can't sort of run or change direction stuff really quickly because my knees were not very sturdy. But I used to play and I'm. I actually just took up a coaching job to sort of coach a ladies team. Wow. So you're training people in the workplace and you're coaching people outside of work. That's brilliant. And it's a ladies team. Exactly. Even better. All for women power. Here, here. We didn't tell her to say that, but yeah. And apart from sports, I am a unashamed onophile. What is that? It's someone who is really into fine wines and does a lot of wine tasting. Of course. You're teaching me so much today. So what's your favourite wine? Oh, I have to say South African Shiraz. Oh, you've got a bit of South African ancestry, from what I remember. Yes, yes, I am South African and I moved over to the UK when I was about 10. But wine's always been sort of in my family. You know, we do a lot of, as a family, do a lot of wine tastings every year together. And you go over to. Because I hear it's thriving over in Kent there, in the wine. Yeah, yeah. There's actually a few wineries locally to us. We haven't actually gone to do tastings at them yet. It's just. That'll be the next family adventure. Well, exactly, exactly. So my mum's actually part of the London International Wine and Spirits, because usually when she first moved over, she wanted to sort of work in the wine industry. So we did go to the tastings every year, which is in London, and that's just an incredible day out and get to taste some phenomenal stuff. Do you ever want to be a collector of wine? Well, yes, but I think I drink it too much. You consume it before you keep hold of it. I have got a little collection. I think my collection is probably about 45 bottles. My brother's and his wife is probably about 400 bottles. Oh. Deepest creepers. And my mum's is probably double that. Oh, golly. So you really are connoisseur. Yeah, yeah. So we, yeah, do, like I said, a lot of wine tastings and go to South Africa, bring a lot of wine back, and my brother and his wife and my mom and stuff, go over to France and then do a little big wine shop and then come back and you know, golly gee, all of you seem to be in these male dominated worlds doing what women do best and showing people what we're made of. Yeah, yeah, my mom's definitely. My mom's definitely a person for that. Yeah. And what about your music interest? What do you listen to? Oh, gosh, everything and anything. Does it depend on your mood? Do you listen to anything when you're working? Yes. One thing I love about. I think this is also what attracted me into the. Into my job is in the workshop. Everyone's got headphones in with it. Yeah. So you're constantly listening to music or podcasts or radio stations and. And I love that because I'm always. I don't think I ever have a silent moment in my life. I either have my radio on or my headphones in or, you know, in a car. So definitely my Spotify playlist collection is very vast. And what sort of, I mean, give us a little taste. Is it pop, rock, classical, jazz? So on my journey down from Manchester, I was listening to my country playlist. One of my really good friends, she's a country singer, so that's helpful to have. So. Yeah, definitely. So, yes, I listen to a lot of country. I go to. I love a little bit of rock house music. I actually got a ticket to Creamfield, so that's gonna be a very fun day. Envious. I. Creamfield. What's the other one? Is it called Ultra? Yeah, yeah. I've never been to Ultra, but I've never been to Creamfields actually. So this is your first time? I've been to sort of like the Steelyard Cream, Dayfield days, what they have in London and stuff like that. Sort of a warm up. Yeah. So now you've got the main show, so very much looking forward to that. And I've not been to a festival in quite a while. So you're due. And then, you know, I went to a few friends and I went to go see Steps, the Steps the other day. Oh God. Is it like a reunion that they had? Yeah, Steps and Blue. Funnily enough, it was in Chester. It was the most random concert ever. My friend was like, oh, I've got spare ticket. I was like, okay, why not? Yeah. So literally everything and anything. And you mentioned podcasts as well just now. What sort of podcasts do you listen to? There's one at the moment I'm listening to called Evil or Genius where they talk about people in the past, like not celebrities, but sort of famous people. One of them was like Gandhi and all the Facts that you necessarily didn't know about him, but, like, you know, which were quite bad. And then, you know all the things good about him. And then they go the vote at the end, like, okay, is he evil or genius? And is it a listener's vote or is it. No, no, it's just in the studio themselves and there's three. Three people. And they usually have a guest, I think. Yeah, I'm going to check that out. So it's quite interesting. I love revealing things. You know what you've told me already today about the watch world? I think I thought I knew that. Yeah. Oh, gosh. It wasn't embedded in Switzerland. Yeah, I know. So this podcast, I'm sure it does the same thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's very interesting. And what about film? Are you watching anything? Because, you know, everybody's obsessed with Netflix at the moment. Oh, God, yeah. Amazon tv. Yeah. What are you watching? I don't watch much tv. Again, when I'm in my flat, I listen to music mostly and just sort of potter around. But if I do, I'll do like a good Netflix show series. Just started watching Designated Survivor. Oh, what's that about? Sounds a bit dark. Oh, yeah, it is. It's really great. It's in America that the White House gets bombed and basically takes out the president, vice president, and all of the cabinet and everything. And this guy ends up being like the designated Survivor and now he has to step in to be the president and. Yeah, and then it's all just like a conspiracy and realize that the bomb was actually not. It was sort of possibly done internally. So, yeah, very interesting. Very gripping. Oh, my goodness. The problem with Netflix, though, isn't it? It just takes up so much time before you know it, and you're like 10 episodes in. You're like, what a lazy Sunday. And then Netflix asks if you're still alive. You're like, are you still there? Yes, I am. Yes, yes, Netflix. I'm here. Oh, gosh, Sorry, I gotta go back onto. We should have a cup of coffee after this. It's brilliant. But. Okay, so tell me, who is your source of inspiration? Have to say my mum. Two sources of inspiration. My mum and Frida Kahlo. Oh, brilliant. Have you seen that? She's over at the vna. Yes, I've really been here. I need to know because I need to buy. I wanted to buy a ticket and they were sold out. For when? This week. Oh, God. So I'm definitely gonna. I need to buy. When you come back from Manchester down To London? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I needed to pre book because it gets really busy and she's incredible. So my old art teacher basically introduced me to Frida Kahlo. Oh, my gosh, my hair is standing on end. That is. We have the same story. But tell me first. I'll tell you first. I'm actually still really good friends with my art teacher. So, yeah, she told me about. Well, she introduced Frida Kahlo and I just thought studied her for my A level art and her story is just absolutely incredible. So harrowing, but yeah, strong and passionate and never gives up and, you know, and with my mum as well, like, you know, sort of went through a difficult stage in South Africa and then, you know, she managed to take two children across, like start new in a different country and just, you know, never gave up and, you know, gave us the best opportunities in life. And my mom is just incredible, unreal. All of the beloved. And she's always the one that, you know, very much did it on her own. You know, you fight for what you want and you work hard for what you want and, you know, and then when she got me the job at Breitling, you know, it just, it just flourished for me from there and she was always very supportive. So get what you want, keep flourishing and you can to and be whoever you want to be. Exactly. I think that's a wonderful time to end and go to the break. 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Welcome back to Hidden Gems with Maya. With me, your host, Maya and Neilia the horologist and master of time. I'm using that. That should be your new tagline, Neilia. Before the break, we talked about your mother, who is unreal, incredible, beautiful, who's taught you to never give up and helped you get the job at Breitling. Right. I want to know a little bit more about this Frida Kahlo adventure because during the break what we realized is we've got a really similar story there. We're inspired by our art teachers. Yeah. So yeah, I did my art A level on Frida Kahlo and my art teacher at the time, which is still one of my really good friends, she said to me, she's like, listen, study this artist. You know, I think you'd have a few things in common. Well, not in common with her, but sort of, you know, it would help you through stuff. And so I had to get really personal sort of about, you know, my childhood and stuff, which wasn't always as easy as sort of it should have been. But yeah, so I wrote this essay and I remember when I get. And then I had to produce a piece of art about my life, but in her style. So what did you make? What did you create? Well, I did drew this really abstract picture which had a lot of like, if you think about mental flashing images and like I drew it but it all kind of fitted together and then I painted it and stuck it on a mirror and with, on the mirror I had few Frida Kahliff quotes and Then like a little bit pictures of hers as well. So it's like a reflection because you can see through the mirror. And then as well as, like, my life story in a picture. So, yeah, I did that. And I said to my art teacher, I said, you know, can you not show many people this essay? I know you have to for marking purposes, but, you know, it's quite personal and I don't want people asking questions about it. Within the school? Yeah, within the school. I said, you know, keep private. And she was like, yeah, that's fine. And she told me, you know, there's only one other teacher and the invigilator will have to read it. I said, okay, that's fine. But I don't want them to ask me questions about it. It's private. You don't want anybody else to read it. You didn't want to find out. And I was close to her and she knew my life story and stuff, so, you know, I could communicate with her. Anyway, years later, she ended up working at a private school in London and she had to go for an open day, sort of show previous students work. I was part of her portfolio. Yeah, okay. Anyways, she messaged me, and I think I was in South Africa at the time. When I got the message, she went, oh, by the way, just so you know, don't be mad, but I've shown people your essay. And I was like, who's people? Who did she show? I was like, okay, right. And she was like, yeah. And someone read it and he was quite touched by it and asked for a copy. I was like, right. She went, well, the reason why I don't think you'll be mad is because it was Mick Jagger. Phenomenal. And I was like, oh, okay, yeah, happy days. So, yeah, I just think it's just. Yeah. Incredible. But, you know, it's Frida Kahlo that isn't that incredible. And, you know, just the story and about having a strong woman like her as a role model, sort of. As a sort of, I guess a sum of a little bit of a role model of my art teacher. And then how my art teacher sort of introducing me to Frida Kahlo, and then it just sort of went from there. And along with my mother and my mom and I love Frida Carloman, you know, watch the film a few times together, and, you know, we want to go to the exhibition that's actually on in London at the DNA. Yeah, yeah. Oh, gosh. I think that's really such an inspiring way to continue. And, you know, to stay motivated because, you know, work. We often talk about the positive times of work, but there are some down days also and it's great to have these wonderful women who are, you know, showing you who to be and how to be as a woman in your role and independently, just as a woman in the world. Yeah, definitely. And could you say a bit more about what motivates you to stay in this role and in this industry? Yes. It's your passion. Yes. You've got all these wonderful women. Yeah, passion. And I think ultimately transferring that passion to others. I think now that I'm sort of starting to go down the training route, I definitely, I think even when I was younger I said, well, you know, in years to come I'd like to be a teacher at the watchmaking school and teach my skills. This is your dream, you're living your dreams. Yeah, I, you know, I am. Everything's worked out quite well for me. I mean I've worked hard for it. Absolutely. I've made a lot of sacrifices to get where I am. You know, I've moved to places I've never known anything about and just for work up and left to, you know, follow my career and sort of, you know, make the most out of it, which has been difficult but very good character building and you know, I'm quite ambitious so I think that helps enormously. Yeah, yeah, that helps. And you know. Yeah. Now that I can sort of make a start, a training role for myself, I can, you know, connecting the dots. What would you tell your younger self if 15 year old Neilia came up to you today? What would you tell her? Be a bit more patient with things in life and don't try and just look at the next step. Slow down a bit. Basically, which I still have to tell myself now. But I think sometimes when I was younger I was always looking at the next step where sometimes I think then I rush the current step. Almost. You can almost miss it, isn't it? Yeah. And I think I made in the moment certain decisions I made I could have reflected on and made them better and not just kind of made it right there and then, but I guess it's all worked out very well for me. So, I mean, and here we are years later, a decade later, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. Gosh, 10 years over 10 years experience. Crazy. You'd never thought, oh golly, you're getting old. What would you tell career changes or returners to the trade? Just be patient with it. Same same advice you'd give your younger self. And I Think a lot of it, I think go in with a very open mind. You get taught that watchmaking is a craftsmanship and skill and you know, beautiful, which it is. But also remember that you're working in modern day society and it is about production. Your output still matters, isn't it? Yeah. You know, you can't leisurely work on a watch for three hours and make it look all pretty and you know, you need. It is a business. And I think the way you get taught, especially at the watchmaking school was a very classic way and you are taught about the craftsmanship and making things and you know, like, you know, working with a lathe and like all these different tools. A lathe is. Oh, gosh. It's like a little machine that you hand wind that then turns metal that the. And then you cut and then you sort of make parts with it. Wowzers. So and you use that in 2018. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you use that and it's all sort of you. It's kind of, you know, when you tap your head and you'd rub your tummy. Oh, yeah, that kind of thing. So it's sort of a similar. Because you have to turn with one hand like a winding motion and then with the other hand you have to cut like the metal because you're spinning the metal at the same time. At the same time and then cutting with the other hand and then with looking through an eyeglass as well. So it's quite. You have to have a lot of hand. Eye coordination. So you have an eyeglass. Yeah, a little monocle. And do you keep the monocle in your pocket? No, I actually keep it around my neck on a loop. Oh, brilliant. I like that you have these old sort of practices and old equipment in the modern day world because as you mentioned, it's a different world to what the older people and older generations would have been doing and using. Yeah. Oh, I love my little toolbox. My little toolbox. What's in your toolbox? You know what all these fashion bloggers. What's in my bag? I want to know what's in your toolbox? Tell us. Oh, you know, tweezers, screwdrivers. Yeah. Mostly just the hand tools which some of them are made from school, which I like still use and stuff. I kind of wish I made more things at school, but then again I was living up in Manchester for the first time away from home, so I was enjoying life as well. Yes. As one must. Yeah. And I was playing hockey and coaching at the time as well. So it was. Yeah. Jam packed. Yeah. But I have to say, I love my. My two monocles that I bought. They're wooden and they've got my name engraved on them. They came with a cool box. Wooden monocle. Yeah, yeah. Are they made here? Actually, a gentleman I work with, it's him and his dad's business, they make watch tooling stuff. And they're also in the Midlands. Yeah, yeah. And everything in your tool bag, Toolkit, do you use it every day or does it depend on what you're doing? It depends on which watches I'm fixing. Some I'll use every day, others I'll sort of use it if I'm working on a particular model or calibre, if it needs a certain adjustment. And then sometimes I've made tools to like little tricks and trades. Tricks of the trade and Life pack. Yeah, yeah. You're like, oh, I made a tool for that. It's easier. Look, do you have photographs or how do you keep track of what you're doing? Or you just do it from memory? Yeah, yeah, memory. It's weird because if you think about a watch, it's got, you know, it can have to have up to about 100 parts and then like six different types of screws and then that's just one watch. And say if you've worked on like 10 different types of watches and you're all those different screws, all those different parts, you just have to know where they go. And that is from everybody. It is, yeah. And it is just like you just know. Craftsman, you just know. And you. But I think it's. That's why you need to have passion, because if you're not passionate, you will forget that. And I think the passion for me is when you see a beautiful chronograph, especially in the back of the movement. And it is something that I just want to climb in and figure out how it works and like get stuck in there, which is full circle, you know, what you said, what got you here in the first place. And Nelia, are you on Instagram? Do you have a YouTube? You know, these days everyone is on every platform. Can we find you on Instagram? Instagram, yes. And what is it? It's Neiliab 55. Okay. And what are you posting on your Instagram? Well, watches and wine and food. Watches, wine and food, that's all one needs. Nia, thank you so much for coming in today. It was really, really great to have you here. Thank you. Really, really nice to see you. And I hope that you'll come back perhaps yeah, yeah. Wonderful. You've been listening to Hidden Gems with Maya on Women's Radio Station the voice of women Worldwide. And if you want to get in touch with us, please email presentersomensradiostation.com you can find us on Instagram womensradiostn, same for Twitter or go online to womensradiostation.com and if you wanted to listen again or catch up on our previous programs, you can head to the presenters page on womensradiostation.com thank you for listening. 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