Discovery

And welcome to Open. And this week we're going to talk about discovering. Discovering our sexuality. Yes, I'm Patsy and welcome back to this week's episode. If you are interested in anything we've got to say, please send us an email@presentersomensradiostation.com or tweet us @womensradiost. Now, following on from last week's episode, Patsy, I think we got up to the monthly period. Monthly periods, yes, we did indeed. Yes. So do elaborate. I think I was talking about how they managed to set me free and enabled me to get out of essentially going to the mosque and being allowed to do more creative things. So, yes, they were a godsend. Did you notice any other changes in your body? Well, I developed enormous breasts. Well, they're not enormous, but my breasts now are the same size as they were when I was 11 or 12, and they seem to kind of spring out of nowhere. So who went bra shopping with you, Patsy? My adoptive mother, took me bra shopping to quite a smart shop, actually, in Manchester at the time, and I was fitted for bras and I remember it being a really pleasant experience. It wasn't traumatizing or anything like that. She was very practical and. And I had these. What was the bra like, Patsy? Did you look pretty when you looked in the mirror? Yeah, I think I did. I think I liked what I saw. What, the frillies and. No, they weren't frillies. They were things that you'd be wearing at school. Well, what would that look like? I mean, I don't know what it looked like. I never had a training bra, shall we say? Well, they were quite plain. They were quite plain. But they were functional and practical. They were practical and functional, yeah, there was. They weren't sexual or, you know, in any way. So they weren't jumping around the bedroom kind of at her? No, no, there was none of that. What do you mean, none of that? There was none of that for me at the time. I didn't. I wasn't going anywhere to meet anybody where I could jump around. Well, you must have had some effect on the opposite sex. I don't think I had any effect on the opposite sex. Well, you must have done. I didn't. I all. All I remember the only sexual encounters I had were with myself, so. What. What do you mean, with yourself? Well, masturbation. I discovered masturbation. And how did you discover the accident? Well, I. I literally had an itch. An itch. An itch? Yeah, I had an itch and I started scratching and I just thought, oh, this feels nice. I wonder what happens if you carry on, you know, touching this place and. And what was that place, Patsy? Well, you know, the between of my legs. I don't know what you want to call it. Why is it that women can never, ever vocalize their genitalia? Well, vagina. Okay. And they're clitoris. Yeah, Vagina and clitoris. There you go. There. So it brought you lots of happiness and pleasure. Yes, that was. I was bringing myself lots of happiness and pleasure. And then the only other sexual encounter I had in my teenage years was a flasher. I mean. What do you mean? Well, in the 70s, in the late 70s and early 80s, flashes were just rife. Oh, tell me you don't see them now. Well, that's the Internet for you. It's taking them off the streets. Yeah. So you'd have flashes and they'd have their Macs. And usually they'd just be wearing socks underneath, wouldn't they? And they'd stand and open their Macs. And I remember this particular one. We were on the way to the mosque and this man was sitting in his car and he sort of beckoned us over to the window. And we all went running over to the window and lo and behold, there he was sitting there with his erect penis pointing at it. And we sort of shrieked in horror. So it was raced off thinking that this was the most awful thing ever. And that was really, for me is, you know, the sexual encounters that I had growing up. So it wasn't seen as a sexual flirtation. It was seen as more of a comic. Yes, it was comical. It was just hilarious that this man was sitting in with his memo. My mother. My mother used to say ghoulies. So I remember running home and telling her that I'd seen this man with his ghoulies out. And she was absolutely. She was absolutely, you know, sort of horrified. And she said, you know, if ever a man thrust his ghoulies at me again, I should run in the opposite direction. Isn't that perverse, though? That was your. One of your first sexual experiences. So obviously the allure you had on him to fact that you've obviously excited this old gentleman to get his member erect. Well, I think it was just schoolgirls, you know, running along. And he obviously decided he was gonna flash us to see what reaction he got. Did you have any first crushes or anything? Or boyfriend's first kiss or didn't have boyfriends or first kisses? He used to kiss my knees and sort of Pretend that I was kissing somebody. Do you mean you kissed your knees? I kissed my knees in the bath. I've never heard of that before. You're in the bath and your knees are wet and I'd sort of snog my own knees. What do you mean snog your own knees? I'd snog my own knees. So that's how you learned how to kiss? Well, I'd sort of practice on my knees, yeah. My God, how exciting as it got. Well, I mean, I had a very sheltered life. Well, I had at the time and you know, I'd have crushes. I mean, who did I have on my wall? Nick Kamen, Rob Lowe, who else? Adamant. So those were the posts. And what did you want to do with these so called crushes or fantasy lovers on the wall? Well, I suppose I wanted to meet them, you know, hope that they'd one day be my boyfriend or something like that. I mean, it wasn't anything more dramatic than that. I don't know. When did you realize that you weren't going to meet these, you know, idealistic partners or lovers? Oh, well, I think I always knew. I mean, it was always like that sort of fantasy thing you have as a, as a girl that they were there but you were never really going to get to go out. So you compared and despaired with all the other people around you? A little bit, I suppose, yeah, I think we all do that, I suspect. Well, I think at this point we should take a question from someone who sent us an email and this listener wants us to discuss in a bit more detail what we felt when we became estranged from our families, which I think is a theme that we both share. And this listener has said, well, when, you know, when do you decide that you're at that point where you're not going to see your family anymore and how do you cope with arriving at that decision? Well, thank you for writing in. I mean, I know it takes a lot of courage, but I can only go on my own personal testimony. I get the idea that, you know, on reflection, as Patsy knows, that I've just recently lost my mother. And I always held up the hope that my, I was going to have that reconciliation with my mother and father. But sadly that wasn't to happen. And in a way I feel vindicated that I made the right decision from being estranged from my parents. However, as a child I always wanted that validation from my parents. But do you think people expect you to, I don't know, for want of a better word, hang in there Longer because it's family and that you should. I personally feel that everyone's own personal life journey. I mean, in hindsight, I wish I just basically severed all ties because at the moment, it's coming back to haunt me. And I wasted so much time and effort to seek validation from a. From, you know, two people that were never, ever gonna validate me and my lifestyle or who I am as a person. So do you wish then, I think what you're saying is that you'd become estranged earlier and just. And just carry. I think everyone's journey is different. For me, it was a process. See, my mother didn't know anything about me. She never been to. She never came to my house. She never met any of my partners. She was never there when I had any operations. She was estranged. It was just me. I continued to have contact with her because I felt I always had that thing about hope. So you hoped that she would come around to accepting you for who you were and you pursued that? Would you say you pursued that until to the end? Until the end. I was there when my mother took her final breath. However, sadly, it wasn't forthcoming. So what would you advise listeners to do then, if they don't? I think. I think everyone should listen to what their instincts tell them. And I wish I listened to mine because my instinct was right. It was never going to happen. And so you should have just cut those times and don't ask other people's opinions because everyone's got an opinion. Okay, well, I think we should take a break right there. And again I say this, but if you have any questions or you want to send us an email, please send it to presentersomensradiostation.com or tweet us at womensradiostn. Foreign. Voice of women Worldwide. Sarah's universal Soul Show. What does your soul or spirituality mean to you? Welcome to future classical woman awards with me, Stefania Passamonte on women's radio station. Welcome back. I'm Russ Cain. You're listening to in conversation with on women's radio station. I'm Angie. And I'm Patsy and we're open. To see what other programs we have on women's radio station, head to our website, womensradiostation.com hi, I'm Valentina Barbachi and I'm the executive director of Media Matters for women. We're a registered charity operating in Sierra Leone and the Democratic Republic of Congo and we produce and share podcasts by via Bluetooth on mobile phones focusing specifically on women and girls excluded from information due to extreme poverty. We empower those living in rural areas with media that transforms how they access, own and share information. To find out more and be part of this movement, come check out our website@media mattersforwomen.org do you need mediation? We are the a project charity. We provide conflict resolution and community engagement services. Our services include community mediation for neighbour disputes, family mediation for separating couples, special education needs for parents, carers and their children, and young adults, as well as workplace mediation and restorative services. To find out more, head to womensradiostation.com or theaproject.co.uk women's radio station is a fresh new broadcasting platform driven by love and passion. Connecting women around the world in a global network is all about diversity from opinions, career, ethnicity, education. We aim to show the individuality of every woman everywhere, providing opportunities and a platform for your voice. 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In 20 years of practice I've seen this transform lives. For more information look on Women's Radio website. Call me on 079-844-22171. I'm listening. Hi, I'm Vivian Arts, President of Women in Banking and Finance. Are you a woman working in the financial services sector in the uk? If you are not already a member then you are missing out on a fantastic network which has been inspiring women for 40 years. We are a not for profit organization empowering women to network, learn and inspire each other at every stage of their career. Through our highly sought after events, we aim to improve diversity by working closely with government leaders and firms through our UK branches. Find out more at www.wibf.org uk and join a network to transform your career. Hi, I'm Sandy Goddard, founder of the Room Upstairs, a different kind of businesswoman's network. Imagine a lunch or dinner party sitting next to great connections, people who might help you. You have fun, do business, build relationships, top women speakers, good food and no membership fees. That's not selling, that's connecting. Join me and economist Ruth Lee Seabee and have your say on Britain and Brexit. Find out more@theroomupstairs.co.uk Women's radio station is a not for profit community interest company. Supporting women is our passion. We're currently welcoming donations to help towards our running costs to keep this important initiative alive. To donate, simply head to our website. Every little will help. And welcome back to the second half of this week's open. So, Angie, I think we. Well, we did, we left last week's episode when you had just discovered Soho and. And what a discovery it was. Patsy, why? What? Well, it was just so colorful. It was like. All I can say was it was going from a black and white television to full color. I mean, it was like everything became like, you know, Technicolor. I mean, it was different colorful individuals, old, young, and it was just so compelling. And you just wanted to be there because the energy, the vibe was just amazing. So did you feel like you fitted into this world? It wasn't as if I fitted in. I just felt for the, for, you know, I just felt invisible, but in a good way so that you could just. I could just observe anybody that you wanted to be. Yeah, people are too busy getting on with their own lives. They weren't interested in me. So who did you meet? Who were you hanging out with? Well, as it. I remember it vividly because the clocks had just changed and they went back and it was like really, really getting dark about 4 o'. Clock. It was about November time and it was a Friday. And I thought, right, I'm gonna stay out a bit longer this time because it was dark and unbeknownst to me as, I mean, I met this creature. I mean. Creature. Yeah, I mean, I didn't know what it was because don't forget, I had a very sheltered life. And it was actually at Piccadilly bus stop. And this is really tall, thin, colorful, mixed race or black woman. And I'd never seen it. I didn't even know what a black person was. I mean, you know, where I was brought up, everyone was white. So this. And I just kept staring at this woman. Why? Because she. She was so. Everything was so exaggerated. She had these long, long, massive, long red nails and these short, short skirts and high, high heels and this bright, bright red lipstick and this wild hair. And I just thought, my God, what's this? I've never seen anything like that before. So what did you do? What did she say? I just kept staring at her. And the first thing she ever said to me was, you want to look or you want joke? And I thought, my God, what's that? What does that mean? Well, look, is that. Are you looking at me or do you want to have sex with me? And I just thought, no, I was just intrigued because I kept looking at her. So what did she say? How did you. How did. And then she just put. I remember holding my. Her grabbing hold of my chin, and she goes, you're very handsome. You are. He goes, are you sure you don't want joke? So you didn't. You didn't. And I said, no, I don't want to joke. No, no. And then we just started talking. She goes, what's your name? Then she goes to me, and I told her my name. And then she said, and what's your name? My name's Berta, darling. Why? And then I was just like, intrigued. What was she doing at the bus stop? And then the next. In about a few minutes after we started chatting, she goes, sit down over there. You're bad for business. And the next minute, this car pulled up. And then she got into the car. And then unbeknownst to me, she went around the corner. There was a car park. And then she used to do her thing in the car park. And the next minute she came back and she had all this money and she was happy, and she put it down, you know, her bra. And I just looked at. Oh, that was quick. You know, what was that all about? You know, I was observing, and then this other. Then all of a sudden this. This gentleman turned up and he had an accent. I didn't know where the accent was from. And now I, you know, after I heard he was American, from Texas, and he was staying at a local hotel. It was like, you know, Piccadilly at all. But there was a hotel there back in the day. Yeah, I think it's been changed into something else now. But anyway, there was a hotel there. And then he wanted her to go to the hotel room as well as myself, so he wanted you to go as well. So, well, Bertha said to me, she goes, oh, you. You need to come too. So I said, all right, I'll come to the hotel. And I thought, well, you know, I thought, this is going to be exciting. Where are we going now? Were you scared? I mean, how did you know? I was just gonna. I mean, I had these big eyes and I just thought, we're going to a hotel, so it's going to be everyone. There's going to be people there. So I felt quite safe. Yeah. And then, you know, the next minute we ended, we were in his bedroom and he was in a suite. And then he came. He came out with no clothes on. And then Bertha says to me, take your clothes off. Then I said, what do you mean, I've got to take my clothes off? Says, get. Get on that bed. She'd say, you know, take clothes and get on the bed. He's paying. Come on. And then she got undressed. And that was the first time I saw. My God, she's got a penis. So you didn't realize that? No. I didn't even know people. People like that existed. I just thought, my God, I was like. And, you know, this, you know, you know, she had a pair of boobs and this p. Penis. And with this old man and this. Then I was n. And he was fumbling around and bumbling downstairs with me. And it just happens. It just was so over so quickly. And I remember he gave us each 20. It was £10. So it was £20? Yeah. And I just thought, my God, he's giving me 10 pounds and we're, you know, I was like, I mean, 10 pounds then was a lot of money. Yeah. And it was over and done with within, you know, and they were big notes as well. Big brown thing. They look like. It looked like money. You know, you felt like you. You derived. I mean, so what did you. Do you have this money, then what. I mean, I mean, we just came back down to the thing and I just felt, for the first time in my life, I thought, my God, I've just earned 10 pound for doing that, for this. This man. I don't know. I don't even know his name. Fumbling and bumbling upstairs in his room. I mean, it was like. And that's it. And it was over and done with within not even 20 minutes. And we were back at the bus stop and I was 10 pound up. Did you feel physically attractive? I mean, how. How did you feel in terms of. I didn't analyze it or anything like that. I didn'. I mean, I didn't have the emotional intelligence. All I knew was that was 10 pounds. I mean, 10 pounds was like a month, almost like two weeks salary for the average Joe. And I'd earned that in 20 minutes. I thought, oh, I'd like this. I'd be doing this a bit more. And that's how I was introduced to learning to sexuality and the power it had. So that you had this power over men that you could make. I didn't think. I realized, I think that sex had value because it was Bertha. And then I realized that she was, you know, a woman of negotiable terms. It's only then I realized she was being. Being paid to do certain things. Yeah. And then I thought, well, I'm obviously complicit in that. And did it make you feel like it was something that you wanted to carry on doing? I didn't think about carrying on doing. I just felt really good. I thought, my God, I've earned 10 pound for 20 minutes. I want to do another one now. That was another 20 pound. That'll be 20 pounds. And I'll be. You know, I just felt for the first time in my life, I felt some value about who I was. I know it sounds weird and it sounds very perplexed, but for the first time in my life I felt that who I was and my body, my own presence had a financial value. And how did that impact on you going forward, though? It gave me. Don't forget, I was already doing, you know, I didn't have to do the paper round anymore. I didn't have to go and wash cars and do Saturday jobs anymore. I felt fabulous. I'd do that for, you know, on a Friday night. And that's me done for the week. Do a couple of those. And I was making money. And then I could put money down to get a flat. And that was going to be how you were going to get out of being at home? Of course. I mean, it was my way of saying, right, I can stand on my own two feet. I've got money coming in, I've got value. I've got like, independence. I can do and come and go as I please. So when did you leave home then? How soon? I didn't. What happened was, over time, you know, I used to stay out and I wanted to stay out all night. Night. So one. One weekend, my mother and father were away. I think it was in August that summer, because they went away for the whole month of August. And I just stayed in England because I didn't want to go because it was too hot, as you know. I hate the heat, Patsy. So I basically Used to stay there for the whole weekend. And I went to stay with Bertha and she lived in a bedsit in Earl's Court. And I remember her saying to me, you can stay here, but you got to pay for the lecky. You have to pay for the electricity. Yeah, the lecky darling. It wasn't electricity. She called it the lekki darling. So how did you. How did that work? You moved in Wisher? Oh, it was a horrible flat. Well, I got to say we had to share the toilet. It was vile. But all I got to say to you is that, you know, it was a converted old house, you know those old mansion houses, and had a really high ceiling. There was this meter in the corner just above the door. And I. And she couldn't. She could. It was. We're going back a long way, 50p. You know, you'd have a slot. You put it in and you have to twist it. It was this metal thing. It looked like a can opener. And she couldn't do it cause she'd break her nails. And she always used. Her nails were her thing. So I'd have to get on a chair and get up there, put the 50p in and I paid for the lekki and I could stay until it run out. And how long was that? Well, it almost just. I mean, it would last almost a week. 50 pence. So I could have stayed there until it ran out. And that's what she said. As long as you pay for the lekki, I don't mind. And don't forget, you see, we only used to sleep in that room once the sun went, you know, down, we were out. Once it was dark, we were out, love. We were on that Piccadilly line and we were there, love. Three stops or four stops it was, and we were there. And we're on the meter, we're at the bus stop. And we always work together as a pair. Because back in the day there was undercover police, you see, and she. She didn't want to get nicked by the police. And I didn't want to get nicked as well for being, you know, selling my wares. Yeah. So we always made out. We weren't ever together. We were always a bit apart. So we could each see each other. And if somebody was talking and asking you all these questions, you knew it was undercover. She's ange. She'd say to me, look at the feet, look at the shoes. The shoes always gets them. What? The shoes would tell you that this was a copper. Yes, it was a copper. So every time I saw that one of us would rush over to each other and say, oh, I'm sorry, I'm late. Sorry, sorry, do forgive me. Don't be horrible to me. And then that'll be it. And then he'll realize that, well, actually, we'll meet. You were just waiting. They knew we were, you know, doing unchristian things. Thank you, Angie. I don't know where we're going to continue on from there, but there will doubtless be more to listen to next week and we will have other questions from listeners that have sent us emails that we'll be discussing, too. So I hope you can join us. And remember, if you want to comment or have a question for us, send us an email@presenterswomensradiostation.com or tweet us @womensradiostn. Thank you for listening. I'm Patsy. And I'm Angie and we're open. Welcome to women's Radio Station, the voice of women worldwide. Hungry an average woman eats about 2 to 3 kilos of lipstick in her lifetime. Women's Radio Station, we want to hear from you. This is Women's Radio Station. You're listening to Avril Price with Kitchen Sink Spirituality. It's Anna Kennedy talking all things autism. And my guest today is Karen Nunn. I listen to women's radio station Women. The possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. Do you dream of a wedding on the beach or maybe in the middle of a vineyard? Imagine your wedding in Italy, the land of Leonardo da Vinci and Michelangelo. Getting married in Italy in a venue that is magical and has natural beauty. Amoretti weddings create unforgettable moments. What you had to do is just relax and watch us make your wedding a real fairy tale. Contact us now for a free consultation. Www.amoretti.co.uk do you experience skin irritation, unpleasant odor or feel insecure worrying about possible leaks? Discover revolutionary and patented most absorbent, 100% ECO certified genial day sanitary napkins with tourmaline strip. So thin, so powerful, so genial. Leave behind embarrassing rashes, annoying skin irritations, leaks with your old menstrual pad. Order your free trial@genially.com you can also find us at womensradiostation.com. Women's Radio Station is passionate about communication and we'd love any thoughts and feedback on our programs. Email presenterswomensradiostation.com if there's a topic you'd like to hear about or want to contact your favourite presenter, do get in touch. WRS Women's radio station, Voice of Women Worldwide. Hi, I'm Valentina Barbachi and I'm the Executive Director of Media Matters for Women. We're a registered charity operating in Sierra Leone and the Democratic Republic of Congo and we produce and share podcasts via Bluetooth on mobile phones, focusing specifically on women and girls excluded from information due to extreme poverty. We empower those living in rural areas with media that transforms how they access, own and share information. To find out more and be part of this movement, come check out our website@media mattersforwomen.org Mirae B Ltd. We are a virtual PA consultancy. We provide remote administrative services. Our offering is diverse. We manage your calendar, we update your client database, we take care of your property in France and in London. We also offer bookkeeping and translation services. Would you like to know more? Please call 077-8684-8998 for further information. Miray B Limited making the life of the business owner successful. I'm Isabelle Manevy, an executive coach. Do you want to change a negative into a positive? We can do this by coaching you to rewire your brain using simple visualization techniques. In 20 years of practice, I seen this transform lives. For more information, look on Women's Radio website. Call me on 07-98442-2171. I'm listening. Do you need mediation? We are the a project charity. We provide conflict resolution and community engagement services. Our services include community mediation for neighbourly disputes, family mediation for separating couples, special education needs for parents, carers and their children and young adults, as well as workplace mediation and restorative services. To find out more, head to womensradiostation.com or theaproject.co.uk. I'm Angie. And I'm Patsy and we're open as a trans woman living in the centre of London in 2018. The show's about all the barriers I face on a daily level, but it's also about our life stories. How we got to where we are, how we stayed positive in the face of adversity and being more than just a label. It's about finding one's true, authentic self. But it's also about your stories too. So send us a tweet. Send us an email at presentersomensradio. The voice of women Worldwide women's radio station is a not for profit, community interest company. Supporting women is our passion. We're currently welcoming donations to help towards our running costs to keep this important initiative alive. To donate, simply head to our website. Every little will help.