Judymay Is Listening – How To Do Everything & Anything

Welcome to Judy Mayer's Listening. This is the show where you tell me what's happening in your life and I listen and together we transform everything. Welcome, welcome. You are here at WRS women's radio station supporting women's well being. I'm Judy Mae Murphy and for the next hour we are going to be transforming everything in your life. And my buddy in your transformation today is Dave Rosowski. Have I pronounced that correctly? Yes, you have. It's Dave, right? And I am so, so excited. And often cheesy radio hosts, and I really hope I'm not the cheesiest of those, will say something like, you're in for a treat today. And I'm really honored to present. It's true today. It is so, so true that this is a man who we have lots of friends in common in LA and Chicago and we've kind of been at the edges of each other's radar for a very, very long time. A couple of decades at least, since we almost sort of kind of met in Kilkenny in the 90s. And now we have met 20 minutes ago and I feel already like I've known him forever. Our conversation, I was like, I want to talk more. I was like, I want to switch the mic on already. I want to share this. So let's just drop everybody right in at the place where we were, we were talking about the importance of immediacy and connection and, you know, being actually in your life and how dogs are great at that, they are great teachers. Well, you said that you were a dog. I asked you, are you a dog or a cat? And you said, you're a dog. And then, because I really didn't think about it until you just said it, where you went, where you said, a friend of ours, Jeff Machalski, was saying that you can be inside. If I'm getting this right, what you said, you can be inside your head, but you really gotta pay attention to what's in front of you. And I think that a dog is so seldom in their head. I've owned two dogs and been friends with many, many dogs aside from that. But I've really been heavily connected to two dogs. And those dogs, I never saw them like thinking about, what am I gonna do with my life? And I never saw them thinking, about, two weeks ago, I really wanted to cross the street and you didn't let me. All that they care. So funny. All they care about is, are you with me right now? What are you doing right now? Can I be part of it right now? And I would like, you okay? We wake up in the morning and we put our clothes on, we look in the mirror and we wear that. It's like, I don't know. And a dog will never look in the mirror and think, oh, I'm wearing this coat again. Even in la. Even in la. Even in la. And we'll never say things like, ugh, why am I eating that kibble? You gave me that kibble last week and yesterday and this morning. They're just really excited to be alive right now. And like, are we going out? What are we gonn. So, yes, it's about being here and living the life of a dog. Now, some people might argue, so I suppose I'm going to argue this, that doing that is. It's all well and good when you're protected or when you don't have a lot of complex needs the way that a dog does, perhaps. Is it that that anxiety and that kind of double check that we do, is that in some way self protective, do you think? What's the complex needs? What do you mean by that? Needs for fulfilling dreams, for, you know, certain target that we want to hit for, you know, feeling, feeling loved, feeling that we are important to the tribe and to other people. And it seems, you know, one of the things we were talking about a little while ago was rejection. And with dogs, they seem to just kind of bounce back from rejection, you know, so is it cats don't care if you like, they would rather have you reject them, I think anyway. But go ahead. Complex needs. So what do you think? Do you think that maybe there's something to be said for holding both positions, that you are both kind of like being immediate in the moment and also being a little bit more neurotic? Oh my. There are so many things wrapped up in what you just said, that. So many shiny objects in what you just said, one being goals. I think you said something about goals. I don't know that I'm just speaking for myself. I don't know that I necessarily have goals. I look at things and I feel like I follow a lot of shiny objects. This is what brings me bliss. This brings me bliss. This brings me bliss. And then suddenly I look back on things that I did over the past three years and I think I really didn't have a plan, but this is where I am right now. And I could not be happier about where it is that I am right now. And I think following your bliss is such a major thing. But what you really have to know is what is your bliss? What is that thing that brings you joy. And I think for a dog, the bliss would be being on the couch when you're not supposed to and allowing yourself to go, I'm doing something that I shouldn't be doing. Going for a walk, getting in a car, sticking your nose out the window when in a car, being with other dogs at the dog park, or just hanging out and leaning. Leaning up against somebody. I had a Rottweiler that was really into leaning. But I feel like if you follow your bliss, all those other things are going to fall into place. And we were mentioning earlier about the word rejection. And the word rejection has so much. There's so much architecture in that word. It's just so full of pain. And, I don't know, I feel like there has to be another word other than rejection that allows us to live our life. And not. Because rejection just seems like I want to take it all in and I want to lay in my bed and just cry because you rejected me. But what if it isn't that you rejected me? What if you're just being slightly deprioritized? Well, the word that you got there is slightly like the idea of being deprioritized. Or. I bet that you and anybody listening to this knows that when you have a goal and a plan and it doesn't work out, something else works out. And I know that it's just become cliche, like when God closes a door, God opens a window, whatever the hell that is. But I always feel like I wasn't supposed to do that thing, because I was supposed to do this thing, whatever this thing was. And while I'm in the middle of having my path, a new path blazed, so I can go down it. I don't really know where it is that I'm going, but again, it's like, where am I right now? I'm gonna stop. I'm gonna look around, I'm gonna smell what's happening. I'm gonna look and just feel it and know I'm exactly where I'm supposed to be. And did you always feel that when you were back on the stage in Second City, which is a huge, big deal for improvisers, you know, you were working with people like Steve Care. I mean, these. These guys were your buddies, the ones. A lot of them ended up on snl. And I'm sure it was a very, very exciting time, and you went on to act in a lot of big movies. Was your mindset the same back then? Were you kind of just looking for that next shiny role, or do you feel that there was something else going on? I've said this before, and I wrote a book, and in my book, there's. I say this in a book, and I keep. I'm in the process of. The final process of editing this book, and in it, I keep going through the history part, the memoir part of the book. And I wrote. When I was at Second City, when I was in the training center at Second City, when I was in the touring company in Second City, when I was in the resident companies at Second City, I always felt like if it stopped today, I would be satisfied. Every day that I was there, I was like, if it stopped right now, I got everything that I wanted out of it, and I never had a goal. And I think that made that experience a lot better for me than it did for other people, because I wasn't always looking at the next thing. I was looking at the now thing and feeling the now thing. Like, what is that now thing that I'm feeling right now? And the people that I was working with and the directors that I had and the teachers that I had and the audiences that allowed us to do the work, that was fantastic work. And the fact that at Second City in Chicago, when you failed, people would go, that was awful. Really? They would say, but let me finish, that. They would go, that was awful. What's the next thing I could see you in? And it's that second part where you go, oh, so this wasn't a failure where you rejected me. This was something that didn't satisfy what it was. That was your expectation. But that doesn't mean that it didn't satisfy my. It didn't satisfy me because I had no expectations. No expectations, no disappointments. That's a really tough road to hoe. But what it means is when you find yourself. So you ask the question, did I always feel this way? Obviously not. I mean, I've had. And I know that you've experienced this, too, the concept of professional jealousy, where you're seeing all of your friends doing something, and you go, all those friends do. Where's mine? Where's my this? And while you're asking where my this is, you're missing that you have your this. Am I making sense there? Oh, completely. And if I'm jealous of your life, that essentially is saying, I want your life. And if I want your life, then I've got to take your life, all of it. And I don't know the damage that you have in your life. I know my damage, and I know how I deal with my damage. But if you're going. I wish that I had what you had. Really, I mean, all of it. Because you can't pick. I have a friend, Steve Colbert. Stephen Colbert, who, of course, is one of the most famous people in the United States, if not on the planet. I don't know that for sure. But you go, oh, Colbert's had it really well. But what you don't know was Stephen Colbert had his father and two of his brothers killed in the plane crash. Oh, my goodness. I didn't know that. Right? You didn't know that. How much of that life do you want? Because I love my brother and I love my sister, and I'm not going to sacrifice them for Stephen Colbert's, you know, position. Absolutely. And this is why I'm always really careful. I hope I'm always really careful when. Whenever I have a big win, like I've got a book coming in a couple of weeks and, you know, or whenever I'm going on a TV show or something, I will always make sure that I couch it in. And if this is something that you want, get in touch because I might be able to help you get there, too. That's a huge part of it, too. That is such a huge part of it. The idea of what I have, that's so good because it's altruistic, it's giving, and it's also you. And I would not have been here if there was not somebody who said, you know, who would like to do this is. Judy Mae would love to do this. You know who. Judy May came to me, and it's like, I'm looking, going, well, that's not who I expected. But she entered my life, and I think I can. Is it. I can help her? Yes, I think that I can help her and anybody who comes to me because I travel, I'm on the road probably 200 days out of the year. I do probably 250,000 miles of traveling. I teach improvisation and theater, and I perform and I meet really great people and I eat some great food and I stay in some really cool places and I travel that much. And if somebody says, david, I really want to do that with my life, I'll go, let's have lunch. You'll buy. And I will talk to you how to do this. And even for everything from who to connect to, to where, from who to connect to, to how to pack everything. We've got more of everything right after these. Welcome to Women's Radio Station. 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Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth and the postnatal period? Do you have qualities of compassion, listening, caring and empowering? At Nurturing Birth we offer approved doula training courses across the UK which are facilitated by an award winning doula. Here you will learn more about the support you can offer, explore the doula role and think about how to set up your business. No need for previous qualifications. Find out more@nurturingbirth.co.uk. You're listening to Women's Radio Station supporting Women's well being. Women's Radio Station's creating a global network for the empowerment of women and we want you to be involved. Join us on Instagram and Twitter. Womensradiostation. That's womensradiostn or Facebook Women's radio station to keep up to date with all our exciting programmes. You're back. I'm Judy Mae Murphy speaking to Dave Rasowski all about everything. And we were just talking because we just did not stop. We don't take a break. We don't. We're here for you completely. We're here for you even when you're not listening to us. And we were speaking about. What were we speaking about on the one blank? You know, we could talk about when we were speaking about it, but this is what, this is where I landed before the short jingle, the greatest. You were talking about. You were talking about people who. We talk about rejection. And when somebody says, that was really, that was an awful performance that you had, period. But really, that was an awful performance that you had. I can't wait for you to show me your next project. Right. And I was identifying that as a growth mindset. We were talking about some people are fixed mindset. And so when they hear that, they just hear that whatever they've presented the construct, the thing they identify as them is somehow wrong. Absolutely. And therefore they've got to withdraw and self protect or I guess either withdraw or over assert the constructed self as opposed to just stopping and as opposed to just taking a moment to sit and to say, what is it that I just learned from this? What is it that I just learned from this? What is it about myself that I just learned? And I think that that's such a vital thing. Like when somebody. I've had people walk out of my classes because I'm very passionate about what I do and I am very passionate. I'm very physical. And when we're doing a scene together, I am in that scene with you, even though I'm also coaching it. And so I'm up there and what I want you to do is I want you to know that I've got you, that I'm holding you, that whatever it is that you're offering me, I'm hearing you, I'm listening to you. And I want you to be the best version of that moment that you can be at that moment. And the people that take my class, what I love about the people that take my class is they know who it is that I am, they know what it is that they're getting into and they know that it's going to be a challenge for them. And the challenge is this. I am going to challenge who it is that you feel that you are. And there was a Reddit thread, and if you really want to, like. So there was a Reddit thread. Somebody, one of my. Someone that was producing a. A workshop that I was doing or a weekend that I was doing, said there was a quote that we have. We want to use it in some PR promo. Did you say this? And I went, I don't remember saying it. So I Googled it and googled my name and in it, and I didn't find the quote, but I did find this Reddit thread that was, Would someone please explain Dave Rosowski to me? And at that moment that that happens, a couple things come up. And one of the things that comes up is this. Do I jump into that? Because there's a potential for me, have this rile up some bile that I have about my life and all that? And then this hit me. What hit me was this. This great gift that I know you have and this great tool that we have. And it's this. What other people think of me is none of my business. And I know that it's hard for some people to wrap their heads around that. What other people think of me is none of my business. But I got to tell you, it's the greatest gift that you can give yourself, because then I get to live my life doing what it is that I need to do in order for me to be the best version of me that I could be. And in this thread, it said, dave Rosowski gets in your face. He yells at you, and he does the scene. He makes you do the scene that he wants you to do. And my first reaction was like, damn it, that's, to me, like, the opposite of what you would do. Right? But this is it. I went, damn it. They're absolutely right. I do get in your face because I'm passionate. I do. I am all over the scene because I'm enthusiastic about what I'm doing. And yes, I do want you to do the scene that I want you to do, because you didn't hire me to help you do the scene that you've already wanted you to do. I am here to help you stretch, and I am here to help you see another facet of the way that you look at life. And that usually has to do with this. Sit, sit in it, realize what's happening right now in this moment, and just breathe and take it in. And that's the greatest gift any improviser can give themselves is that. And it turns out to be the greatest gift that anybody can give themselves in their life is just to stop and just to breathe and to know that this is exactly where you are. And do you believe that a lot of the stress and difficulty that people feel stems from this desire to control? Absolutely. It stems from the desire to. It's the desire to control and it's the picture that you have of what you think it should be. And that word should is such a really. It's such a rough word because should. You know, when I hear students say, oh, I should have done this, they're like, I don't want you to should on yourself. I can say that. Right? I don't want you to shit on yourself because should is such a shame word. And I'm not alive to experience shame. I'm alive to experience to know that every experience that I have is an existential experience. For me to realize this is what it feels like to exist in this flesh costume that I'm wearing right now, and to know that I'm just a spirit being held in by this. By this wonderful barrier called skin. And I think that people have expectations of what it is that it could be. But to know that if you want to have an expectation, great. Know that whatever it is that you think this is going to be, whatever you think that it's going to be, is going to be something very different. And, you know, it's that thing like you want to make a. You make. You want to make God laugh, you know, make a plan. And I'm not a religious person, but it's the same thing with an improv scene where you go, whatever your plan is, that's groovy. But that has nothing to do with me, and it has nothing to do with us because when we're in a scene together, we are impermeable membrane. We are permeable membranes. I get all over you, and I want you to get all over me. And I want us to walk away from that experience going, wow, that was something that we just experienced together. That would not have happened if I was by myself or inside of my own head controlling this. Or in charge. Yeah, or in charge. And do you feel that what's happening. I'm really broaden it out now. Do you feel that what's happening in America right now is partly that people really wanting to be in control and wanting to be in charge? Absolutely. I think what also is happening is a friend of mine is a clairvoyant My friend Chris Cahill. She's a wonderful clairvoyant. And a clairvoyant doesn't see in the future. A clairvoyant sees what's happening right now very clearly. And she uses this expression, which I think is a fantastic expression. She says, you want to blow up the picture. What's happening is the picture is being blown up. That which we are experiencing. Everything is exploding. And it is a scary time for a people, because suddenly we've got to look at transgender, transgender people and say, wait, I thought that gender was something that was very solid. But gender is not solid. It's spirit. And I can't control your spirit, you know, I can't make you love me just as like, I can't make you hungry, you know? And the feeling that a lot of people are going, it's out of control. It's like, yeah, baby, life is out of control. All that you can do is hold on and know that there's a shattering that's happening. And the shattering is fantastic and scary. And it means that you're going to have to take another look at the way that you're living your life. But who doesn't want to live their life like that? I'm not a religious person, so I don't think, like, at the end of this experience, there's going to be heaven, because this is heaven. This is it. Even root canal is heaven, in a way, because it's like, this is what's happening to me right now, and I get to experience it. And then what about that pain? So my whole thing is that I think about the people who are awake on their own in their kitchens at three in the morning, crying, that's okay. And whenever I would say to them, I'd introduce this idea, because I share that same feeling of that everything is sent to serve. And it's just about what we do with that and how we sort through that. And if something's disordered, we can get it back to a place where we can be either comfortable with the disorder or we can get it in better shape if it's something that we can control. And what really breaks my heart then is, even with that, if people are still hurting, I find it very hard to be around people who are hurting and not be able to fix it. So I find it very difficult to. I was due to go on a book tour to America, and I just didn't organize it. I'm like, why am I not organizing my book tour? I'm ace at organizing book tours. I think the reason was that there's just so much pain in America right now that I was trying to not be there. Got it. Is that still gonna happen, your book tour? Oh, absolutely, yeah. Okay. Lots of friends to visit. Your message is going to get through to people or it's not gonna get through to people. And the fact. I'm sorry, your message is either gonna get through to people now or get through to people at another time or not to get through to people at all. Your responsibility here is not to fix anyone, I don't think. And maybe, you know, for me it's to impart my message and it's up to somebody else to them to. Because if we could fix each other, we would fix each other. And I love what you just said a while ago about that you can't make someone love you, just as you can't make someone hungry. That just makes it all so, so clear. We don't run around trying to make each other hungry, but we do run around trying to make each other love us. Absolutely. And that is just mind blowingly awesome. And also, yeah. What you're saying about, even if it's coming from a good place, that doesn't mean that you suddenly get control just because you, just because you want to do something good doesn't mean that you suddenly get to overstep your human abilities. Absolutely. I had a director, Michael Gelman, he gave me a note in 1989 in a class. I was a student at Second City and he gave me a note in 1989. And I ended up like, I was just so angry at that note. It just really pissed me off and I didn't get it and I stormed out of class. And I remember in say it was 1998, in 2018, 2008, I was teaching a class and I had a student who was going through the same thing that I was going through. And suddenly I got that note. It took 20 years for me to get that note. I am going, the note has to sit there and suddenly it sprouts and suddenly you get it. That is so awesome. And we're going to be asking Dave Rosalski exactly what that note was after the break. Remember that we're here every week at noon live coming from our lovely little studio in Covent Garden. And we're here to transform everything on Judy May's Listening. So more transformative stuff right after these. Welcome to the women's radio station supporting women's well being. Women's radio station is all about diversity from opinions, career, ethnicity, education and Most importantly, women's well being. We aim to celebrate the individuality of every woman everywhere, providing opportunities and the platform for your voice. Visit our website womensradiostation.com for more information. I'm Tamina Zaman, founder of Empower and Enrich. When it comes to money, do you clam up or get confused? Do you wish you could save more money or are you hoping you have enough for retirement? You are not alone. Many women want to be smarter with their cash but just don't know where to start. @empowerandenrich.org you will find a host of options to help you take charge of your finances and learn how to put your money to work for you in an easy, affordable way. Get in touch with me@empowerandenrich.org and let's change your future together. Do you want to be a doula? Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth and the postnatal period? Do you have qualities of compassion, listening, caring and empowering? At Nurturing Birth we offer approved doula training courses across the UK which are facilitated by an award winning doula. 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Whether you're thinking of having a baby, trying to get out of an unhappy relationship or just unsure what benefits you may be entitled to, we can help. Visit turntous.org.uk welcome to the women's radio station supporting women's well being. Women's radio station can give voice to your brand. With a wide range of sponsorship opportunities including individual programs, we can tailor your experience for you. For more information on how you can sponsor a Show, go to womensradiostation.com Women's radio station supporting women's wellbeing. Welcome back to wrs. This is Judy Mae Murphy here on Judy Mae is listening. I'm in studio today with the wonderful Dave Rosalski. And he said something just right before you guys came back. And it completely language wise, I thought, can we say this on the radio? Yes, we can. So what Dave said was, he said, fuck hope. And I kind of thought my immediate reaction was to not introduce this idea because it's so. It seems right now, from where I'm sitting, to be so completely the opposite to what I feel because I feel that a large part of my identity is giving hope. So we've got to unpack this. So what is it about hope? I was married for 14 years and the 10 years of that marriage was fantastic. But the last four years was problematic trouble, and it was a dying relationship. And I remember waking up every morning and thinking, I hope that today is the day that I am able to put the sentence together that my wife will understand. I'm able to put the sentence together that allows my wife to understand what I've been asking for her and what my needs are. And I also hope that today is the day that she says what it is that makes me understand what it is that she's going through. And after a while, I just kept thinking, hope is not working. Hope is certainly not working. And hope is a victim's emotion. It's a victim's activity. If you go, I hope that a safe doesn't fall on my head is being in relationship to something that you are not in control of at all. Right. As opposed to, I have faith that a safe is not going to fall out of the sky under my head. I have faith that I am going to realize the words that I need in order to either save my marriage or to express the needs that I have to end this marriage. So there's a difference between faith and hope. And we have a friend, Danny Breen, who had cancer. And I found myself, I really hope that Danny survives his cancer and hope did nothing to make it better for me. And so I say fuck hope, but it's not fuck hopefully, and then leave it at that. Because if I'm giving myself a negative note, I have to follow it up with a positive note. And that's what I do when I'm teaching class. That's what I'm doing when I'm directing is I'm going to give you what's perceived as a negative note, which is stop doing this and start doing this and the stop doing this was stop hoping and start having faith. That's the difference between the two. And it sounds as if in order to facilitate that difference, it's about relinquishing control again, clearly. Absolutely. It's about relinquishing control and it's also about accepting control. Because hope is relinquishing control, isn't it? Hope is going. I have no control over this. I hope everything works out as opposed to everything is going to work out, just not where you think it's going to work out. Okay. And perhaps then another way to think about it is not being so attached to the vehicle. So we always want something at back of any desire we have. So with our friend Danny Breen, who sadly passed away, we have had that feeling of we want Danny here. And the thing we were saying earlier was we have Danny here like in every moment. We're talking about him right now. We're loving him right now. All those who are listening, who. Who know him still are feeling that same huge celebration and are smiling really big right now. Right, right, right. Okay. So this is. I'm gonna give a trigger warning. There's a trigger warning because this is a sad story. And the sad story is this. I had a dog and my dog was Shira, and I love my dog very much. And Shira had Addison's disease. What's Addison's disease? Addison's disease, I think, is. It's an adrenal gland. Like Kennedy. John Kennedy had Addison's disease. And it's something where the adrenal gland isn't working properly and it needs some kind of medicine that I just can't pronounce right now. So Shira had Addison's disease. And I remember my wife was out of the country and we both knew that this was terminal. It was terminal. So I promised myself that if I came home from lunch and she couldn't walk up the stairs, it was time to go. And so I came home from lunch once and she couldn't walk up the stairs. And my ex wife was in Lithuania or something, and I called my friend Tamara and I said, tamara, it's time. And she said she cancelled all of her plans and she. She went with me to the vet. We go to the vet and we bring Shira in and we put her down on this bed in this dark room in a veterinary's office and they put a saline solution in and they said, say goodbye and tell me when to come in and we'll get the magic potion that is going to send her to the next place. So we said goodbye to her. We said, time they put it in. And we watched her pass. I hugged Tamara. We cried and cried. And I looked back and I looked at Shira, and I was like, oh, that's not my dog. That's what my dog wore. Oh, how lovely. The spirit of my dog is still here. That's just what she was wearing. And so I look at Danny and I go, oh, Danny's still here. Just what he was wearing. He shed that, which is what he was wearing. And it's a spiritual feeling that I have because we are spirits and that's all. And the way that you look and the way that I look, this is just spirits. And those of us who are actors or those of us who are personalities or celebrities or whatever it is, we are sharing our spirit. And when we go, our spirit is still here. It's just taken on a different tubing, you know, a different costume. And I do have a feeling that Danny's spirit also has a mustache. Danny spirit has a mustache. And Danny spirit was. Is snarky. Oh, clearly. And has. Yes. Danny spirit. Absolutely. Absolutely. There's a book called A Brief History of the Dead, and the concept is this. It's a great book. Oh, who's that by? It sounds a little bit like the Tibetan Book of Living and Dying. I know, but it's not. It's fictional, and it's fictional. But the concept is this. Okay, I know that we're running out of time, but it's this, that you and I are alive right now, and I'm seeing you and I'm talking to you. And should one of us die, we go to another level. And that level has us doing pretty much the same things that we were doing on this level. And we are alive on that second level as long as there's somebody on that first level who still remembers us, who has our name. And the moment that those people die, we disappear and we're no longer anything. So everyone that we know and love that has passed on to that next level is still alive with us as long as we remember them. And that's all that matters. And do you feel that when you're teaching, do you feel that you are passing on part of you that 100 years from now is still going to keep going? Oh, for sure. And the way that I know that is what I'm passing on is something that somebody else gave to me, that somebody gave to them. That somebody gave to them. So I am merely, you know, I'm just an emotional delivery system that was inspired by other emotional delivery systems that I've pinpointed, how to express myself the way that I'm feeling right now. Tell me some more about your teachers, the teachers that I've had. I had a teacher named Martin demott. And Martin demott was at the Second City, and he was pretty much the one that started the Second City Training center. And Martin had the. These beautiful phrases. And when I was the artistic director of Second City in Los Angeles, I would hire teachers that had been students of Martin, and Martin would say things like, the moment that you walk into any of my classes, you lose the right to judge yourself. And that was one more time on that. Anytime you walk into any of my classes, you lose the right to judge yourself. That is huge and freeing and scary at the same time to me, absolutely. But in the. In the fright of that is the feeling of being alive. And when we're on stage improvising, I'm not up on that stage. That's my spirit. That's up on that stage. And if I am judging myself in that moment, I'm not being my truest me. I'm getting very granola California here. But that all started with Martin DeMott back in the 80s. And Martin was the warmest person that I'd ever met. And he had this pretty much this feeling of this statement where if there's a problem, there's a solution, and the solution is usually within you and you haven't given birth to it yet. And just free yourself from the judgment and ask yourself, my friend Alexandra Billings, who's another. Have you ever seen the show Transparent? It's on Amazon. She's in that show, but she's a great teacher, and she's a transgender woman. And she has this phrase, and the phrase is this. You're born with wings. Use them. And the idea is that jump. It's just jump. Take that leap. And Ray Bradbury says, take the leap and grow wings on the way down. And I look at that and go, all of that has to do with just take a chance. If you're waking up in the morning dreading what's happening, what's the thing that you're most dreading? And what if you didn't have it? You didn't have it. Husband, wife, job. How can you live your life right now being miserable because you're attached to that. That job, that relationship, whatever that's going. That apartment, whatever it's going to be, and how do we change that? And I'm thinking right now that when we go and watch improv done really, really well, like the way it's done, you know, with you and Jeff and Jane Morris and these wonderful people that we know and of course Dave Pasquezi and TJ and Dave, that when we see that, that what we are looking at is that spiritual courage and that really is what we're drawn to. More than the cheap laughs, more than the, you know, the wow moments, it's just there's those very small moments of, you know, well, they didn't fail because they showed up. Absolutely. And there is no failure because everything they do on stage they use. Everything they do on stage, they use. There's no mistake. And it's that idea of that thought of what if you can never make a mistake and what would your life be if there was nothing that you ever did wrong. I have a TED Talk that's all about that. Oh, what's that called? The TED Talk is the product of your life. Is the process of your life. The product of your life is the process of your life. It's probably the process of your life. Life. It's a product of your life. And the TED talk has a lot to do with you. Consider something a mistake. It's not a mistake. It's an opportunity and it's a way for us to live our lives. And being able to take that and not have it just be something that cheers us up but something that actually redirects us is very, very exciting. So we're going to talk about that right after these. We would love to talk right through the commercial break. We will. You're going to be joining us again very, very soon. Welcome to Women's Radio Station. I'm Sarah Louise Ryan and welcome to Love Lessons live on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to future classic Women awards with me, Stefania Passamonte on Women's Radio Station. Hello and welcome to Julie Mae is listening. Hi, this is Anna Kennedy and we're at women's radio Station supporting women's well being and we're talking all things, all women. The possibilities are endless. That's what makes us different. Hi, I'm Lauren Mishkon. I'm a birth doula and mum of three and I'm passionate about supporting women to have empowering and positive birth experiences. Please join me for my brand new show From Tummy to Mummy here on women's radio station. Every week I'll be here with an expert guest talking about women's reproductive health, health everything, fertility, pregnancy, birth and baby related right through to the menopause and beyond. Please join us for an informative and fun hour. 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I'm here in studio with Dave Rozowski here on WRS Women's Radio Station. We're all about supporting women's well being. Dave if I can turn the conversation to specifically about the experience that women have. Because everything I really love about Second City and about improv is that it seems to me to be much more inclusive of women. It seems to me that a lot of the stuff that's going on in the rest of Hollywood, you know, that the MeToo movement is shining a great light on. Is that an improv? It doesn't exist in the same way, or does it? It's a really good question. And I've been at this since. I think people have to remember that improvisation is only about 75 years old, but when I started in 84, 85, it was a very different world for women. And I always. I never understood it. The different world for women was anytime a woman walked on stage, they were pegged by a man as being teacher, wife, nun, nurse, female nurse. And if somebody wanted to get a joke, it's like, oh, the. The judges coming and then a woman walk on stage and everybody would laugh because, like a woman can't be a judge, right? And what it is is this. This is about women standing up, but it's also about men stepping back. And we're only as. We can only work together if we see each other just again as spirits, not as in competition to each other. So everything has changed. And when I was at Second City, the first woman that I saw that made me go, oh, my God. Was Bonnie Hunt. And Bonnie Hunt, snarky, strong, she was a nurse. So she was trained as a nurse. So she really connected to people on both a physical level and a spiritual level. And to look at her and go, that's not a woman, that's a spirit. That's a woman who. That's a spirit. That's a woman, right? And to look at that and go, oh, my God, finally somebody that I can look at and go, that's not a man. I like the female energy. I have a lot of female energy. I love what it is that Bonnie's doing. And then I remember going to LA and every woman, okay, so Second City was started by a man. And the woman that was the mother of everything, her name was Joyce Love. The woman that started IO improv Olympic, which brought the Herald, was started by Del Close and this woman named Sharna Halpern. Dell Dodd. And Sharna's controlling it now. And a Herald is a long form improv, a long form improv structure that is sort of like. It's like three, one act plays in 20 minutes to 40 minutes. And then, of course, we now know people like Susan Messing, people like Julianne Larson. Amazing. And I'm getting to Tina Fey and Amy Poehler, because I watched Tina Fey. I was in Second City and I was in la. I came back and I watched this woman named Tina Fey. And I thought that human being is just such an inspiring artist that I think that she shattered it for me. Totally made it, made me just realize what I've known for a really long time, that it is nothing. Oops. So sorry. It has nothing to do with gender. It has to do with confidence and spirit. And if you read, you know, Tina's book, like, she didn't start out having that confidence. It was something about being a boss, wasn't it? Yeah, yeah. Bossy pants, bossy pants, bossy pants. And owning that phrase. Like, she's just kind of like, this is me and I'm that. So you can't use that against a woman now. Absolutely, absolutely. And it really is up to women to go, what is it that you're offering? Who is it that you are? Speak your voice and say what it is that you're doing and then let everybody else get the hell out of your way. You know, just. I am going, like, for everybody to say this. Man or woman? But certainly women nowadays go, and when I see a woman, and this is really like, I had a woman walk out of my class once, where I'm like, stop. I will not let you be a victim in this scene. I will not let you be a victim in this scene. And what would be your. What would you be seeing that you would say that she is being a victim? Is it that because for me, I have a. A really good way of seeing why someone is playing so very small, that for me, if somebody is being less than, if someone's being quiet, if someone's frozen, I see that as them being strong and the only way that they've learned how to be strong. And you're absolutely right. And it's like, it's how these people, it's how these, these. These humans have learned to protect themselves, if you will. But for me, I see it as. To answer your question. For me, the physicality is really an important thing to note. The way that people's. What people's shapes are. And when I will watch this woman be in a shape that has cowered, closed off, that sort of thing. I can relate to that one. Absolutely. And to go, okay, stop. Pardon me. Stop. This is what I need for you to do. Sit up straight right now and tell me what your mouth wants to say. Open up your mouth and say what you want to say. Because right now, open up your mouth. As you're cowering, open your mouth like, ah, I shouldn't be here. Now sit up straight, look out, and just be at the edge of your chair and say, what the hell you're feeling right now. And it's a sacred space, this theater that we have, this classroom that we have. And let your mouth hear. Let your ears hear what your mouth wants to say. And that's probably the first time that they've ever been invited into that experience. Absolutely. Absolutely. And that's what I do. And a lot of people in improv and you talk about the MeToo movement and all that sort of. That sort of stuff, which is fantastic. A lot of people in classes that in the States and outside here are going, what happens if somebody's, you know, 2pc or what happens if somebody is being abusive to another actor? And I go, I don't experience that because my classes have nothing to do with. With gender, with character, with anything other than feel the feelings you're feeling, the moment you feel those feelings, feel the feelings you're feeling the moment you feel those feelings. Engage in it and now express how you're feeling and does. Because anytime. I've taken improv class with our friend Jeff McCarsky, there have been times when people, when men have shown up and their reality that they have been living, so their conditioning is quite misogynistic. And so that shows up on a stage. Do you ever see it? And if you see it, do you call it out? I haven't seen it in many years because I don't. I haven't seen it. You don't attract that. Because I don't attract that. And what I attract is I attract. And I hate to say this, I attract. Well, I don't know how to say it. I attract beta males, and I attract a lot of women in my classes. A lot of my classes have a lot of women in it. And because it's about. Improvisation is a feminine art form. It's about relationship, connection, collaboration, vulnerability. And I am using all that as a foundation to create improv scenes that you've never seen before. Because I'm not dealing with. Okay, I don't take suggestions. It's not like, you know, okay, you're a doctor and you're a nurse. We're not going to take a suggestion. It's like, you're sitting that way. What does that way that you're sitting in that moment make me feel? And we're just going to start. So if somebody's coming in misogynistic, I'm not going to let them get those words out because they're not going to have an opportunity to get those words out. And I've noticed that the alpha males, like, they don't last very long. They don't tend to come back, I've seen. Because they're not allowed to assert themselves in the way that they're used to asserting themselves. And so they make the whole process wrong or they make the tribe wrong. Anything other than have a look at, you know, maybe something that they are doing might need looking at a second time, but that's all good improvisation. It's making somebody stop and say, the choices that you made prior to this aren't working right now. The way that you're working does not work right now. But do you find that the people who really need that message are the people who are incapable or unwilling to accept that? I don't have those people as my students. But in the world, if people are experiencing that in my class, I don't know, they may come in going, argh, I've got something to prove. But at the end of it, I am going to say, we're not going to focus on that. We're not going to focus on your ego. We're not going to focus on who you think that you need to be in this world. Because that's not what acting is. All improvisation is acting. And it's not about you bringing in your personality, your history, your ego. I'm not interested in all of that. We're giving you a part, and your part is this. You're Tabla Ross at the beginning of a scene. You're an empty slate. And your part partner is going to tell you who the hell you are. And not emotionally. They're going to emotionally tell you who you are where it's like, carl, don't be so sad right now. Things are going to work out because you look like you're sitting like you're sad. And it's not because, oh, that's because my wife screwed me over, or it's like, yeah, I'm feeling sad. It's like, let's go there, for God's sake, let's go there. And do you find that people in general are disconnected from what they're actually feeling? Because we are kind of bombarded with so much, clearly. I also think that it's about you holding up your personality, who it is that you think that you are and your need to have that. But I'm not here to hold on to, because I know that Laura and I have been together for six years. You know, but the first time that we were together, I was treating her the way that I. I was still talking to her the way that I was talking to my ex girlfriend. Does that make sense? We're bringing in yesterday into today. And in improvisation, you're not allowed to bring yesterday into today. You're allowed to do this. Eat up what's happening right now. And for me, it was this fantastic, strong, funny woman who I just wanted to hang out with. And if I brought in all my stress from the past, that's my choice. And I get to be aware that I'm doing that. But it's going to wreck the time that we're having together. So just being that tabula rasa every morning, it's like, what was it Seneca said? You know, Treat each new day as a new life. Absolutely. And we've all been in. Do I have time? We've all been in it, where we're having a great day. We're having a lovely day. It's sunny out. I'm in London. It's sunny day. And we're having. It's a great day. And we're going, oh, my God. I just love what's happening right now. It's like, I was worried about something yesterday. What the hell was I worried about? Oh, right. I was worried about, why didn't she send me that money? And now yesterday, it's like, oh, my God, stop bringing yesterday into today. Stop bringing yesterday in today. There's a T shirt right there. Absolutely. A bumper sticker if you had a car. And I love the fact that just to mention one more friend that we share, Michael McCarthy. Oh, my God. We just. We love Michael so much, and he brought so many of us together. Oh, my God. And he is going through the big spiritual journey of all right now and just being an absolute champion and beacon within that. So I just wanted to mention that and talk about, you know, all these lessons that we've been talking about. It's just so, like, every day, like, he's got a blog out every day about how grateful he is, and he's going through a real existential crisis. But he also is surrounded by people who are saying, we love you, we love you, we love you, we love you. That's it. And that. And that really is what it's all about, isn't it? Knowing that you're here for a great reason. You don't need to define that reason. You don't need to prove that reason. Dave, what a pleasure. Judy May, thank you so much. You're welcome. And I'm really hoping that we will get to have you on the show again. You've been listening to Judy Mae's Listening with me, Judy Mae Murphy and Dave Rozowski and we'll see you next week. Bye bye. Welcome to the Women's Radio Station Supporting Women's well being Women's Radio Station is all about diversity from opinions, career, ethnicity, education and most importantly, women's well being. We aim to celebrate the individuality of every woman everywhere, providing opportunities and the platform for your voice. Visit our website womensradiostation.com for more information. I'm Tamina Zaman, founder of Empower and Enrich. When it comes to money, do you clam up or get confused? Do you wish you could save more money or are you hoping you have enough for retirement? You are not alone. Many women want to be smarter with their cash, but just don't know where to start. @empowerandenrich.org you will find a host of options to help you take charge of your finances and learn how to put your money to work for you in an easy, affordable way. Get in touch with me@empowerandenrich.org and let's choose your future together. Do you want to be a doula? Would you like to support families through pregnancy, birth and the postnatal period? Do you have qualities of compassion, listening, caring and empowering? At Nurturing Birth we offer approved doula training courses across the UK which are facilitated by an award winning doula. Here you will learn more about the support you can offer, explore the doula role and think about how to set up your business known as need for previous qualifications. 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